Now THIS is a great summary of OUR user experience

Andy Bonar said:
Believe what you like.
Fanboy?
Come back and talk when you've reached puberty.
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This is from your own thread on this forum:
Andy Bonar said:
Hi all
Has anyone any experience using the new Lenovo G2 VR headset with rf2?
For me and a friend who has a similar setup, it is running really badly.

I use FPSVR to monitor whats going on.
The framerate is bouncing all over the place anywhere between 50 and 90 fps.
Im running an Nvidia 3080 with an i7 7700k, 32gb ram.

For testing im racing 16 cars at Silverstone, twilight start time.
No matter what I seem to set the gfx up, it always runs like this, can only describe it as "gloopy"

Ive also changed the headset resolution down to no effect.
The GPU is only maxing out at 40% on the last lowish settings i used, and cpu only around 35%

Im wondering if its something to do with windows mixed reality and how it works with steam vr

Well, after spending endless hours trying to resolve, I give up.
Nothing changes, no matter what you do.
Changing processor affinity, priority etc makes no difference.
Pretty clear to me that the problem lies within the poor coding of RF2.
There are so many threads about poor performance with this sim to confirm it.
I jumped into PC2, having reinstalled it for comparison. Set everything as high as it would go.
Ran a test race with about 16 AI at Spa, night time race, thunderstorms, rain, the lot. Flawless. Pretty much 90fps all the way, You feel like you are actually there. I love rf2 for the feel and they physics, its light years ahead of PC2, but this really needs fixing as its got to be fixable.

Well, ive kind of sorted it now.
The solution ive found is to force the game to use 45fps with motion projection in steam vr.
Makes no sense at all though, as now even with all settings on max, im only using 60% gpu and around 30% cpu.

Put it back on 90fps, knock the graphics right down, same sort of gpu and cpu usage and it looks like treacle when there are lots of other cars on track.

But, it looks great now, even at 45 fps. Personally i cant see much difference between that and 90, so happy for now.
Like David said, hopefully the driver issue might improve things over time.
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So you just made it all up. You have/had the same problem. You said it yourself: "Well, after spending endless hours trying to resolve, I give up. Nothing changes, no matter what you do."

Then you came up with your "fix": "Well, ive kind of sorted it now. The solution ive found is to force the game to use 45fps with motion projection in steam vr. Makes no sense at all though, as now even with all settings on max, im only using 60% gpu and around 30% cpu."

So why do you even argue with me on this point? You clearly said it yourself that I am right on every point that I made.

You're just happy that with many many effort; you found a way to play this game which is acceptable for YOU. But not for others, nobody likes 45fps and reprojection/motion smoothing; it is terrible on the G2. It shouldn't be necessary to use such features with an card like the 3080. And especially not with everything on low and 30% resolution or something. It's clearly bugged, you stated it yourself so many times. Why even argue about it? I really don't get it.
 
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pilAUTO said:
Turbo :

rF2 is ssooo bad : don't play it + don't waste and looose your time to bash rF2 + play to your other favorite sims.

Simple?
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No rF2 is awesome! But it's simply bugged for many WMR users and for that reason unplayable.

If I thought that this game is so bad, then why would I do so much to get this issue under the attention of the dev's? :)

I really really want to play this awesome game. I love the content, the physics, the way it drives etc.
But I'm an VR man, I cannot go back to 2D... I don't understand why the dev's are never replying on such major flaws, it makes me indeed very irritated. They should at least give their point of view on this subject, but they simply refuse it. Reiza/Kunos would never let it get this far, they should already have shared their point of view on such an issue a long long time ago.
 
TurboHenk said:
This is from your own thread on this forum:


So you just made it all up. You have/had the same problem. You said it yourself: "Well, after spending endless hours trying to resolve, I give up. Nothing changes, no matter what you do."

Then you came up with your "fix": "Well, ive kind of sorted it now. The solution ive found is to force the game to use 45fps with motion projection in steam vr. Makes no sense at all though, as now even with all settings on max, im only using 60% gpu and around 30% cpu."

So why do you even argue with me on this point? You clearly said it yourself that I am right on every point that I made.

You're just happy that with many many effort; you found a way to play this game which is acceptable for YOU. But not for others, nobody likes 45fps and reprojection/motion smoothing; it is terrible on the G2. It shouldn't be necessary to use such features with an card like the 3080. And especially not with everything on low and 30% resolution or something. It's clearly bugged, you stated it yourself so many times. Why even argue about it? I really don't get it.
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I'm not going waste any more time with you after this reply.

Yes, I have had problems with RF2, I found my solution, and am very happy with the way it works for me. Not sure how long ago I posted that, and to be honest I dont really care. What matters is that it has improved massively.
For all I know, i could run it at 90 fps with the same settings....I just dont bother changing it as I dont see much difference between that and 45. And no, Im not making that up, that is my individual perception. We all have different eyesight etc etc before you come back on that.

And I use FPSVR when updating gfx drivers to check how they work, and my GPU and CPU both use a lot higher than that now, up in the 85 to 90% on the gpu and over 70 on the cpu, dependant on car/track load obviously.
Improvement's have no doubt been made to the sim, which has reflected in its performance.

Seriously, go and play AMS2 if it works for you and give it a rest.
 
I'm happy for you that you're happy with reprojection/motion smoothing/45fps/stutters and sharp gfx in rF2.
That's not sim racing for me. For me it's only enjoyable at 90fps with zero framedrops.

No. I keep doing my best to get this major bug under the attention of the dev's. You're not in the position to stop me and to tell me that I have to play an other game.

That you don't remember what you posted on this forum says enough about yourself. I still don't understand why you started the argument while you clearly have the same issues yourself(so that makes your comment about all your friends even more unbelievable). You simply accepted to live with it, I don't, it's as simple as that.
 
TurboHenk said:
That you don't remember what you posted on this forum says enough about yourself. I still don't understand why you started the argument while you clearly have the same issues yourself(so that makes your comment about all your friends even more unbelievable). You simply accepted to live with it, I don't, it's as simple as that.
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Jeez, grow up. How old are you?

If you ever get it running well for you, maybe you will look back at your posts and see things change.
Opinions change.
I dont get stutters by the way. What I do get is a sim that looks great, plays well, and I get lots of enjoyment from.
 
IMHO fanboys of sims make it very hard to get change. Its like the companies listen to the 5 star rating and don't bother listening to the rest of the ratings, Fanboys are louder and get heard more. Somehow the rest have to get them to listen.
 
TurboHenk said:
Thx for your reply. I had an Asus motherboard with this same setup(z390), but now I have an MSI motherboard(also z390) but the issue remains exactly the same. So don't bother switching it. I have an 9700k@5ghz btw.

"I have given up trying to understand it and trying to fix it." Me too. I really tried everything. The saddest thing is: Studio 397 ALSO gave up, but I think that they didn't even try to solve it. This is the worst developer in terms of communication that I ever experienced in my long gaming experience history. This issue is so far spread on this forum, but ZERO comment from Studio 397 and they keep selling the game as "Windows Mixed Reality compatible" but it CLEARLY isn't. It indeed only works for hotlapping, but I'm not a fan of that, so I'm not able to play this game at all since I bought it. And I couldn't get a refund because I spend too many time trying to fix this issue. So I feel scammed by Studio 397 since they simply ignore everyone with this issue and also keep telling everybody that it's compatible with Windows Mixed Reality(by keeping this info on the Steam page).
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Not WMR thing. just G2 resolution thing, and poor optimization on rf2 side. Other cars on track is a known issue, and nothing is done about it unfortunately.
I get good performance for my G2 if im alone in the track, OR on with lighter (perf) taxiing cars like porsche cup, and on light track, like portugal. Even 15 AI cars is possible while having SS @100% with 6800xt. Wouldn't expect 3080 to be any worse.

Im very much against poor optimization, as i think it's lazy and goes against EVERY engineering principle.
Only PC game devs think making something better, is an excuse for making it worse at the same time.
Every other engineering field would think this approach is nowhere near acceptable.

It's like, say a guy named Frank, drives a car, that has no AC, airbags, and has old cam operated windows is gonna buy a new car.
At the dealers he's shown a new car that has all the bells and whistles, but the dealer says: all this comes at a cost you know mr. Frank.
Having the AC, airbags, cup holders, electronic windows and mirrors etc. will make the car use 50% more fuel.
would Frank go for it? Hell no! He would still sweat in his car and roll the windows by hand, and just tighten the seatbelt. "fuck them new cars, 50% more fuel can kiss my behind!"

Console game devs have to make progress without sacrificing performance, as there are no room for it. Yet they manage to pull it off, during the life time of that generation console.
We PC gamers, simmers especially are just expected to buy more POWER. regardless if there even exits any.
Not saying progress shouldn't have a price in this genre, but usually it's just overlooked so totally that it ends up making as much damage to the game, as what ever the added stuff could possibly bring to it.

And we all know pc sim devs love to add that stuff, eye candy mostly, that they like, that no one really asked for.
AND.
When there are perf problems, in sims, as there almost always is. Those cries hardly ever get heard, or at least pretty much nothing is ever done to it.

But this is the world we live in...
Mean while @TurboHenk, you could try to set steam vr open xr to default wmr open xr, in steam vr settings developer section. both svr and wmr, need to be restarted for it to have effect.

Have a nice day.
 
AMS2 seems also to have the "pink spike problem" for some people. From the Nvidia dropped frames thread: "I was wrong! It only works well at 80Hz, 90Hz shows many dropped frames in Automobilista 2 even at a steady frametime of 7. Pathetic." So Reiza is also incompentent?
 
I agree with most of the criticism.

The UI and loading times makes me want to start rF2 less frequently. The UI is especially bad in VR. I wish they could make a desktop UI, similar to Content Manager for AC.

I also agree that S397 should review and reorganize the content. It's currently a big mess.

I'm not convinced, however, that moving on to rF3 would be a solution. A new technical platform would require a ton of work and that work may very well be better spent on improving the current one.
 
ATQ said:
I agree with most of the criticism.

The UI and loading times makes me want to start rF2 less frequently. The UI is especially bad in VR. I wish they could make a desktop UI, similar to Content Manager for AC.

I also agree that S397 should review and reorganize the content. It's currently a big mess.

I'm not convinced, however, that moving on to rF3 would be a solution. A new technical platform would require a ton of work and that work may very well be better spent on improving the current one.
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But do you think work IS actually spend on improvements? In the last years we've barely seen any improvements in regards of user experience imo
 
St54KeV said:
But do you think work IS actually spend on improvements? In the last years we've barely seen any improvements in regards of user experience imo
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It's not complicated, the user experience is really the worst part of rF2.

But what you have to ask yourself is, is it the most important aspects in a great simulation (spoiler: *NO*, just a little important), is it improving (spoiler: *YES*, improving slow but certain and continuous), and above all the most important aspects of a simulation are they globally present (yes, not all, but rF2 is the best on these aspects).

Then there are aspects that are important on which rF2 is rather bad (but not crappy) : AI, racing rules, online...

I find that rF2 corresponds to my expectations (real realistic simulation), is constantly improving and overall is not bad, except on userfriendly and AI to keep it simple.
 
pilAUTO said:
It's not complicated, the user experience is really the worst part of rF2.

But what you have to ask yourself is, is it the most important aspects in a great simulation (spoiler: *NO*, just a little important), is it improving (spoiler: *YES*, improving slow but certain and continuous), and above all the most important aspects of a simulation are they globally present (yes, not all, but rF2 is the best on these aspects).

Then there are aspects that are important on which rF2 is rather bad (but not crappy) : AI, racing rules, online...

I find that rF2 corresponds to my expectations (real realistic simulation), is constantly improving and overall is not bad, except on userfriendly and AI to keep it simple.
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Yes! I do think it's the most important part, because simulations usually lack of users. And the devs need users to be profitable. And a profitable company can make the simulation aspect better because that's the most expensive part.
Creating a competition system and focusing on eSports pulls new users to the Sim momentarily but those won't stay because it's pretty "shit" to use. I've been through that, and multiple of my friends I tried to introduce into rF2. It has always been the same story. All hate the user experience and just leave without purchasing any additional content.
I think User experience is what a 2021 software company should mainly focus on
 
Because you are looking for different things.
I've been surprised when @pilAUTO has said that the online if rF2 is bad. For me is very good. I'm racing only online since rF1 days and the leagues experience has been great. Then i suposse that he speaks about the Comp System or a different way to use the online.
 
Question has there been any talk of the hud being able to be moved to players choice for positioning on screen/VR, or will they just let players use simhub and not bother. I personally would like it to be in the sim something similar to iracing.
 
turtleCZ said:
Why my user experience is great and bought every possible DLC then?
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The user experience, I mean user-friendly, loading times, etc ... is catastrophic in rF2.

I've been a fan (NOT fanboy, positive and constructive critism) of rF2 for 8 years, and before rF1, but I think you have to be clear-headed.

I understand from reading you that you are new to rF2.

You arrive at the right time, the user experience is still bad but has really improved, but especially after many many years with a very unsatisfactory rF2 on many subjects, rF2 has started for I would say 6 months ago to be really really good.

It's good that you're positive, but be clear about rF2's flaws, but frankly as a new user you haven't experienced the gigantic frustrations of this simulation.



@lagg :

In fact I am an offline player only, maybe I was wrong about the online aspect. I was told the netcode was excellent (iracing players).
 
Binny said:
Question has there been any talk of the hud being able to be moved to players choice for positioning on screen/VR, or will they just let players use simhub and not bother. I personally would like it to be in the sim something similar to iracing.
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For a long time now the HUD system has been on the list to be overhauled. I'm not sure where it sits on the list, and it's perhaps a little worrying that the UI (which itself is built on a new system, encompassing the competition system, and whose development necessitated pulling apart large parts of code tying the previous UI to the internal game code) is still awaiting a major refresh/update/overhaul to improve its user friendliness.

So: a new HUD system, and let's assume that's a flexible one, is planned.

On the other hand, the current HUD (and only the same elements, though customisable in appearance) can be customised via devmode, and a number of options are on the workshop that can cater to many needs. If you've only tried the core ones you should take the (considerable) time to try all those. You might find something that suits you better in the ~years we wait for a new HUD system.
 
St54KeV said:
But do you think work IS actually spend on improvements? In the last years we've barely seen any improvements in regards of user experience imo
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I would love 397 list a top 10 of most mentioned user issues for Ai and a top 10 for user issues for online play. And just give their assesment on what they are going to do. Including ''sorry guys, we are not working or going to work on this topic'. Clarity would be worth a lot for me.
 
This list has anyone ever seen 1 ? or is it something spoken about but no 1 really knows for sure ?
 
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