Now THIS is a great summary of OUR user experience

What I even find most annoying is that all subpages are listed at the bottom of the page. Literally directly behind my wheel and dash. I need to constantly tilt my whole body left right left right when scrolling to the list to get the right one behind my wheel :D
 
myself9 said:
also *plays R3E for the first time two weeks ago, gives "expert" opinion*
friggin' ridiculous influencer streamer people, man :p
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Sounds a little jealous to me, what generation are you? :p
No, honestly two weeks is waay enough time to judge a sim by how drives, isnt it? If you are fast in another sim, you normally need an hour to adapt to others. So after an evening of driving a new sim, everyone should be able to give an opinion on how it feels and compares to others ;)
 
Filip said:
What?!?
Are you comparing AC UI with rf2 UI?
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Yes I am!

Filip said:
Any sim has much better UI, and so does vanilla AC.
Sure rf2 offers more configuration and setup possibilities than other sims but that's not worth much for average user. Because most stuff is non intuitive.
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I guess I disagree. For a new user maybe (and I can understand the frustration), once you get used to it's all pretty straight forward, with only a few quality of life issues which yes are annying but not as bad as people make out imo.

Filip said:
Even experienced users after hundreds of hours in rf2 discover new possibilities because these are either hidden or placed somewhere nobody would think of looking.
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Okay guilty as charged! Yes that has happened to me. But when you learn where everything is and what it does, it's not that difficult really. I think it's been discussed in the past that a PDF users manual would be a good idea. I fully understand that a new user would not know what half of the stuff does, and that would be a real pain.

My first session in rF2, every car loaded into the track, EVERY car! I was racing against RC cars and quad bikes, all while not being able to exceed 99km/h becuase I didn't know about the pit speed limiter! So yeah I get it, but a user manual would be a good addition imo, and it would give it more of a "simulator" feel too. I guess I'm old school, I think manuals and a driving school would be cool. Most young people would probably not read it though! It's a simulator, it's complex, be prepared to put in a bit of extra effort. I'm glad rF2 isn't "gamey" like the other "sims". Could be be better? hell yes it could, but I legit prefer it to other racing titles.

Somethings that I really do think sucks though!

- I always lose where my curser is, lost in a huge expanse of white.
- Not knowing which content is S397 and third party, forgetting which content is fully updated etc.
- Having to use the little horizontal scroll bar to always access drivetrain set up.
- Going to the next session, yeah that's a bit unintuative.
- Having to manully adjust the FFB for every single car, maybe some kind of global adjustment could also work?
- A.I difficulty is so inconsistnet from mod to mod, I'm always having to exit the session quite a few times to get it dialed in perfectly. Understand that it's probably impossible to adjust it in the garage, but that would be a huge quality of life gain for me, because I really like tweaking it to the perfect percentage which takes time, and I need to do it with every car. Then when I go back to that car, I always forget what I had it on. Actually, being able to set AI per mod and it saves the setting (similar to what it does with FFB) would be good.
 
Filip said:
What?!?
Are you comparing AC UI with rf2 UI?
Any sim has much better UI, and so does vanilla AC.
Sure rf2 offers more configuration and setup possibilities than other sims but that's not worth much for average user. Because most stuff is non intuitive.
Even experienced users after hundreds of hours in rf2 discover new possibilities because these are either hidden or placed somewhere nobody would think of looking.
People with years of experience in rf2 tend to forget that.
Btw because rf2 UI, old and new is super slow hence discourages users to experiment, browse
the options. Another reason for features to be left undiscovered and users frustrated.
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The AC UI gives you allmost zero options in comparison to rF2. How hard is it to f*ck up an UI that gives zero options? Seriously? And that's the exact reason why people invented the Content Manager, wich is pretty bad from my perspective and easily as unintuitive and obstrusive as the rF2 UI, yet it's hyped as the best thing since sliced bread because people can tweak everything that AC offers from an engine perspective. Wich also leads to the fact that people can f*ck up alot more stuff and it is a very good example of all the stuff that you can tweak but don't really need to tweak. Then people come up with all the other great UIs from other sims, where I ask myself: Does it make sense to compare UIs from very different, closed products to a sandbox like rF2? Have people actually taken the time to navigate a UI like the one from ACC just looking for the design principles?

The new rF2 UI, as bad as some basic design principles are, is quite a step forward in some other areas and I find it unfair when people say that all of the stuff is hidden and that you need to dig deep down into json files. That's nonesnese, especialy when you compare to amount of json file tweaking to AC. There you have no way of getting rid of the HUD through the UI or easy tooltips that show you the right key bindings. It's also important to note that S397 added alot more functionaliy and options since the new UI was released compared to ISI with the old UI. They simply gave it a different colour scheme and that was it. If S397 can get rid of the teething issues I see no reason why the new UI tech shouldn't be the way forward. It just needs to run smoother, wich is from my perspective the worst point so far. But that's also due to the UI being webbased.
 
Ermins videos often sound like having a prebaked conclusion with a bunch of flawed reasoning slapped on top of it (did I just described humanity´s though process here :D?) but I do agree with his sentiment here, wasn´t really expecting that.
 
Usually i don't watch long a** videos that could be summarized in a few lines. That being said i agree with him almost completely. Yet there are people praising rF2 like it is perfect the way it is. Too many times i read people praising rF2 AI, some folks here have a very low bar. So far for me rF2 is a failure, a lot of missed promises both under ISI and 397 developement. After half decade, physics/AI wise this game is basically the same (actually AI had steps back) and yet people praise it. 397 roadmap is pretty clear and it does not aim to core stuff but rather to superficial stuff....Meanwhile others games are already ahead in some areas and on others they are closing the gap.

Honestly speaking, i have little doubt that a rF3 will solve any problem, most of these bugs should be "easily" fixable in this engine aswell. If they can't fix them here, why they should be able to fix elsewhere.
 
I am new to the world of simracing and therefore, in rfactor 2. I am not going to lie, all the content that is released I buy it (not only from this simulator) In the short time that I have been, I see, every week or month, users talk in the forum about bugs, about things that do not work well, that the physics are broken, that the interface is just as bad as the previous one, to tell streamers on their channels that they have asked for contributions to this game and that they have simply ignored them ...

Instead, and it is something that I appreciate, new content on a regular basis (for a fee) I have seen a lot.

I don't know where this game is going (and from what I read, its players have not known it for years either) but it is unfortunate to enter Twitch, for example, and see the number of streamers that the different games have.

Probably this game is not the one in which I have played the least hours, that honor is held by Project Cars 3, but it is true that it is the one in which it takes the longest to play a game.

I prefer not to talk about the competition system.

Every time I read more negative comments about the state of the game and from what I read these problems come from afar.

I hope that this time, Fernando Alonso has chosen well.

By the way, my first experience in rfactor 2 was a full course yellow "ad aeternum", but the FFB convinced me that the game was worth it ... I hope I was not wrong, but it is tiresome not to read positive messages because they are being done things well. Like everything in life, patience and the money has a limit ... and competition is increasing every day.

Sorry for my English, but I have used the google translator.
 
hitm4k3r said:
The AC UI gives you allmost zero options in comparison to rF2. How hard is it to f*ck up an UI that gives zero options? Seriously?
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?? Perhaps it has less options, but at the same time It has some options that rF2 doesn’t have.
Content Manager not only looks and works as a modern UI and is quite fast and much more ergonomic . It offers way more options than rF2’s UI or any sims’ UI. It’s not perfect, but it’s way better than rF2 new pathetic UI.
And IIRC it’s written by one person.
 
avenger82 said:
?? Perhaps it has less options, but at the same time It has some options that rF2 doesn’t have.
Content Manager not only looks and works as a modern UI and is quite fast and much more ergonomic . It offers way more options than rF2’s UI or any sims’ UI. It’s not perfect, but it’s way better than rF2 new pathetic UI.
And IIRC it’s written by one person.
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Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to defend the UI of rF2 as there are obvious flaws that need to be sorted, asap at best and I have no idea why improvements for those obvious issues aren't shipped faster (like a dark mode or exit buttons on every page or better smoothness in gerneral). But it's everything but certainly not pathetic and it has some nice options integrated that I allway wanted for the old UI. All the setup options and summaries with the highlighted changes alone are a reason to use it. The modular SP session settings are fantastic and there is even more potential there.

Regarding AC and it's lack of options: when it was released it had some slick design ideas. But overall, the whole sim is alot more simplistic wich leads to the fact that the UI itself has very few options that you can tweak, especialy in comparison with a product like rF2. In short, it doesn't make any sense to compare both UIs and I can't think of a single item that I really miss in rF2. It's the other way around. There are so many more factors involved with the rF2 UI, that go far beyond a simple slider or gadged that I don't understand how people see this as relevant. The AC HUD design is nice at first glance, but I find it annoying that I can't toggle all the different gadges, just to give a small example and I find it even more annoying that the HUD appears once my mouse sensor reacts just a tiny bit. Who ever had that idea deserves a medal for stubidy as it's a knowing problem that sim rigs move and flex.

Afterall, there is a reason why people even invented and use the CM - at the end the default UI of AC is not sufficient enough, simple as that. How a game that is made for modding as zero options to manage them from within the game is beyond me. And I don't care if CM is developed by one single person, I just try to judge what I see in an objective way. Who knows if it isn't the same case for rF2? If the CM was the default UI of a sim that was sold for real money, I would be easily more annoyed.

With UIs it's as with everything in life: it's not the size (aka amount of options) that matters but that you put all necessary options in the right place. CM is at the complete opposite spectrum of the new rF2 UI. It's simply too much.
 
AC was abandoned by Kunos during the start of ACC and development stopped.
That was also announced and actually very clear.
They left it for the community to do with it what they wanted to do with it.
RF2 is a game which is still very alive, if I'm not being fooled reading current developments at MSG...
So you can't compare the two in any way imho.
 
turtleCZ said:
It's probably not perfect, but what is? PC3? Or F1 from CM where career save could be lost and CM doesn't care at all? This is just good enough to me to be the best racing sim for now. Mostly for interesting physics and how cars move, it's so cool. Nothing is near to it.
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These kind of comments are the biggest problem within the simracing community, take my money!!.
Nobody expects things to be perfect at all, but you should expect that available features simply function.
Imo When they do not function they should be either being put on a hold or removed all together.
 
Good for you.
Over the years I've maybe spend hundredfold, who cares!?.
When you buy a car and the blinkers, mirrors and wipers are missing, you say It's all oké because it drives nice.. :D
 
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