G25/27 horrendous rattling

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Mee, Jan 10, 2012.

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  1. Kknorpp001

    Kknorpp001 Banned

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    I'm personally fine with the rattling as long as Logitech is. I live in US and have a big house :). My primary concern was for safety of wheel. I find Tim's comment about Logitech wheels being designed to prevent harm very helpful if true. Not sure why it takes 20 pages to mention this.

    Tim, not that you owe it to us, but do you happen to know where that fact is documented? I believe this may help calm at least some of the noise (no pun). Thanks.
     
  2. 88mphTim

    88mphTim I'm new here Staff Member

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    I'll see if I can get confirmation of it.
     
  3. YoLolo69

    YoLolo69 Registered

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    Last time I was listening to the last Black Eyed Peas album my average audio system was suffering in the bass making bad vibration to the speaker, so I lowered bass a bit and was able to enjoy all songs. I’ll will not ask for a refund, or to the Black Eyed Peas any paper proving my system will be safe, or create a law suit against them to have a minimum bass speaker requirement specified before buying, and even worst I will not drop the album! One day I’ll buy a more powerful system and I’ll be happy to listen to them all maxed! ;)

    In other words: from day one I put a really light filtering like suggested for my 100% compatible G25 wheel and I’m really happy and fully enjoy rF2 a lot :)
     
  4. Alan Frost

    Alan Frost Registered

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    I worry the main problem has been lost within this discussion.

    I have a G27 and I'm 100% happy with driving it on the roads, it rattles and jumps now and then but it's really no problem. However, if i go off onto the grass it gets ridiculous and I have to jump for the ESCAPE key on my keyboard. It happened just now with the Brabham at Monza.

    So I really don't want any changes to how the G27 works because it's great, but I really think the grass/offroad parameters need to be changed, because if anything grass should feel much much softer than a road surface, but it feels like my G27 will explode.

    I'm willing to accept my wheel isn't up to driving on the concrete oval at Monza, if that's the effect concrete has then fair enough, hopefully I can get a belt driven wheel in the future. But grass should not do that in my opinion!
     
  5. raekwon

    raekwon Registered

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    I don't know where all this talk ports.. the ffb with logitech steering wheels (g25 g27 dfgt) is completely wrong. it's like driving with the steering wheel directly connected to the road regardless of tires and suspension.
    is a real shame because the potential could be very good

    i will never use the steering wheel in these conditions...i prefer to have lag and add filter to it
     
  6. Papa_K

    Papa_K Registered

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    G27 user here too. The way I'd look at is that the rF2 FFB works just as well with the G27, but the effects are not physically dampened by a belt drive system, giving some rattling. I'd guess there is some relative FFB effect harshness compared to a belt-drive wheel.

    Editing the Steering torque filter setting the controller's .ini file appears to be the current G27 rattling solution.
    ______________________
    One related question: Does the Userdata > player > Controller.ini file have any use, or is it just the selected controller .ini file in the Userdata > Controller folder? (The file in the player folder doesn't appear to be used, but I'm not sure.)
     
  7. 88mphTim

    88mphTim I'm new here Staff Member

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    Have you then tried adding the filtering??
     
  8. 1959nikos

    1959nikos Registered

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    The rattling noise problems of g25/27 were one of the first things discussed here in this forum since January, from people worried that their wheels could be destroyed because of the game.

    Since then, I havent heard anyone reporting any damage, which is actually a valid test imho of wheel's strength, as so many people use them, me included.
     
  9. MaXyM

    MaXyM Registered

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    what if there extra wear due to this effect?
    what if no one wheel is broken just because people use rf2 not as often (due to test period)
    what if there is too small sample of players to get this statistic valid?
     
  10. 1959nikos

    1959nikos Registered

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    Common Maxym, this place alone has 3000 members.
    With what ifs you can question anything, but not just ONE incident since January?

    Although if I was so worried about extra wear on my precious wheel, which will be obsolete pretty soon, Id lower ffb settings and all the fuss is gone.
     
  11. 88mphTim

    88mphTim I'm new here Staff Member

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    Yep. You can also look at this very differently: Customization.

    rFactor2 allows you to use FFB with no filtering. Isn't that great? First sim to allow you to, I think? Not only that, but rFactor2 allows you to customize the amount of filtering. Incredible, huh?

    The negativity, it's something I do have trouble understanding. I understand the points, but every sim filters FFB, with rF2 you have greater options, not less options.

    You can turn this issue right on it's head.
     
  12. Nimugp

    Nimugp Registered

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    Maybe that's a problem for some/most. People may have gotten used with having something that suits them out of the box, now they have to customise it, so then " the game itself must be lacking in that area!!! " (NOTE: this is not my opinion, just a view of how I think people are thinking!!!)
     
  13. 88mphTim

    88mphTim I'm new here Staff Member

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    rFactor2 hasn't been put in a box yet. "Have to" isn't correct, they do not have to even now (depends on their noise tolerance). But eventually I think there will be something in the UI to do this.
     
  14. 88mphTim

    88mphTim I'm new here Staff Member

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    To add to earlier info, I am told a figure up to 8 in the filtering should give you FFB comparable to the filtering always present in most software. Over 8, you will start to lose the feeling by probably more than you would want.
     
  15. Gearjammer

    Gearjammer Registered

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    Here is the issue as I see it.

    The Logitech G25/27 rattles with high frequency bumps from either curbs, going off road or on specific tracks where the noise level is high.

    The reason the wheel rattles is because the wheel is gear driven and the high frequency is causing the gears to clash rapidly making the noise.

    Everyone is used to their wheel being nice and quiet in other titles so they are not sure what to make of all this noise all of the sudden.

    From the reactions here, we can see that first off, ffb filtering resolves this issue, and that the reason it exists in the first place is because the sim is capable of sending raw data to the wheel instead of filtering it like every other game. If the Logitech wheels had stronger motors, it would likely brake the gears, which is probably why they don't have stronger motors, heheh.

    Does the rattling have a negative effect on the life of the wheel? Very possible that it does due to hammer wear to gear teeth. Can this be resolved to eliminate the issue, yes it can and therefore the wheel would not suffer long term damage from it.

    There are so many people that race sims that are not afraid of altering plr files and other files to get desired results from sims, but for some reason feel offended if they have to alter a file a little to get desired results from their wheel. Asking ISI to put out a caution that using a Logitech wheel might be noisy is a bit silly as you will be able to tell that pretty much as soon as you get on track. Fixing the noise for most of us takes about 2 minutes once we find out that we can alter the ffb in the ini files as well as lowering or filtering the effect in the game gui.

    I would suggest that we take a step back, calm down, and stop being so dramatic about this issue as there is a solution and it doesn't require voiding a warranty or even using a screwdriver to fix.

    Just my 2 cents, and yes I live in a medium sized US house and play all day because I am unemployed.
     
  16. buddhatree

    buddhatree Registered

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    :)
     
  17. MaXyM

    MaXyM Registered

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    what is curious to me, a lot of you say that filtering, even low values helps.
    I set filtering to 20 and even set some dumping a bit. but bt20 on monza is still too noisy.
    I know it is track specific, but Is strange that it not happens in other sims while Tim does compare its filterig to something about 8.
     
  18. stonec

    stonec Member

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    Some track/mod combinations seem to require a very high level of filtering. The issue seems to be worse in open-wheel cars. When driving the FISI car at Sepang a torque filter of 8 is not enough to produce anywhere near silent results. The wheel is still quite violent when going through gravel or hitting a curb at high speed. This is with G27 and default FFB values except for the filter at 8. As I've said before, the G25 seems to be a bit more smooth, for unknown reasons.
     
  19. Ryno917

    Ryno917 Registered

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    IIRC the G27 has bevel-cut gear teeth, while the G25 has straight cut. The straight cut gears are noisier for normal operation (the reason that race cars have gear whine), but quieter when hammered like in a quick change of direction from the FFB motor.
     
  20. feels3

    feels3 Member

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    Do you have old Monza circuit in other sims?
     
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