My conclusion is that the FFB on the F2 is just broken...period. Using these settings: Steering resistance coefficient="0.31000" // Coefficient to use for steering resistance. Range: -1.0 to 1.0 Steering resistance saturation="0.31000" // Saturation value to use for steering resistance. Range: 0 - 1.0 helps a tiny bit, but there is still nothing remotely approaching normal FFB. The same wheel (Fanatec CSW) with normal settings produces sublime FFB on most other cars. The surface irregularity FFB is totally normal. Even at FFB multiplier of 1.0, it can cause the wheel to chatter over rumble strip curbs. If you try to increase the multiplier to get some of the missing FFB, you would risk damaging the wheel. But yes, there is missing FFB. Somehow, the forces related to steering resistance are so weak in comparison to the bump-related FFB, you end up with a complete mess. I am glad that changing a couple of lines in the controller file works for some wheels, but even that suggests a serious programming issue because we should not need different JSON-file settings for one car versus another. The FFB related to steering feel is OK.,..I think. It isn't backwards or weird, but it is so weak that it gets overshadowed by the other FFB. ISI--please fix so that normal settings produce the same great, balanced, FFB that we get on most of your other cars.
With the right setup and a few tweaks in the controller file this car feels great to me. Nothing weird about it. Sure it has its own characteristics but that's part of the charm.
It isn't charming to have to trawl through forums and make arcane adjustments to JSON files to get something to work properly (for you), or not (for me). ISI needs to standardize the FFB (and many other elements) so that once you have fiddled to find an optimal setting for element "x," you can be confident that it will also optimize all the other cars/tracks/sounds/etc.
Totally. As I'm starting to understand more of the small subtleties in the force feedback I find that my G27 is becoming too limited as well. Gotta get me a better wheel soon so I can enjoy even more of cars such as the F2. I was quite freaked out too about the feeling of the ffb on this car too at first. Actually almost ditched it entirely truth be told. But I made an effort in asking the right questions and I happened to get the right answers. Now the car feels great. I would love more detail in the ffb though but I need a better wheel for that.
Be careful getting a better quality wheel because you could end up like me with no way to put lipstick on the pig. The fidelity of the feedback is so superior with the Fanatec compared to my old Logi G that now I cannot boost the FFB on the F2 without it feeling like the tires are made of blocks of solid rubber instead of air-filled rubber tubes. The tolerance for wonky FFB settings is vastly reduced on the higher-end wheels.
I know how to drive. I have raced Skippy's. I have raced every sim ever made for the PC. The rF2 F2 has the lightest, most unrealistic steering possible. As mentioned, I am sure it is wheel-specific, because what I feel bears no resemblance whatsoever to what you or others are describing. I tried Hex's settings and fiddled with a dozen variations on them--to no avail. They made a slight difference, but the fundamental issue of missing FFB was still there. The surface FFB is perfect. The steering resistance FFB is missing-in-action. There may be some combination of JSON tweaking that could make it work with the CSW, but that should not be required when the identical wheel and default settings and set-up feels PERFECT right out the box for other ISI cars in the same sim.
Tried your settings for FFB with my G27. They are spot on, the FR 3.5 2014 is as you say a dream to drive (before I thought the FBB was quite weird at low speed). Thanks a lot.
Yes, you have described what I meant by resistance. Neither is there. At rest, the car feels like a 1960's Cadillac with over-boosted power steering that you can turn with one finger. In motion, the car has close to zero torque caused by the load put on the car while turning or from the natural centring force when driving straight. I know that these cars in real life have a set-up that makes the steering lighter and requires more manual return-to-centre in an effort to lighten the overall steering torque required by the driver in a car without power steering. I can feel that, but that's not what is missing. I tried your settings (and a bunch of variations) and even at 1.0 (maximum) it barely has any effect, though it is slightly better. The problem is that use of the FFB multiplier also boosts the already adequate surface FFB at the same time, making the car undriveable on anything but a glass-smooth surface. If I crank the multiplier up to 1.8 or 2.0, the proper (or closer to the proper) steering resistance feeling comes through, but as mentioned, not usable because of the tires that now feel like they are made of solid rubber or wood. Thanks for trying to help, but I have concluded it is a FFB issue with this car. By the way, have you tried the version 1.7 of the ASR 1992 F1 cars? These cars are a bit too grippy compared to real life, but the FFB is almost orgasmic it is so well done. I'd love to know how it compares to the F2 on your rig. 180 degrees polar opposite is my experience. The ASR cars FFB is based loosely on the ISI Indy car.
Perception really is a funny thing. I find the F2 one of the most enjoyable to drive of all ISI's cars.
You obviously didn't read what I wrote. It's hardware-specific--I might also love how it feels on your rig with your settings. What do the ASR 1992 F1 cars feel like (at default settings) on your rig compared to the ISI F2?
I read every last word of it man, and I respect that you obviously feel very strongly about this. I wasn't directly replying to your post, just made a more general comment, due to the fact that many people find this car too weird. That is very interesting. I will give that a shot tomorrow. I'm always up for some ffb tweaking.
Awesome feedback guys, keep it coming. Paul, can you post your full Controller.JSON file? I'd be interested. I now tried briefly the Steering coefficient/saturation (1/0.06) as you suggested, and it feels different, but I need more drive time to actually understand. I was also wondering about the various comments about "Brake/Clutch/Throttle effects on the steering axis". Do you know if that setting actually does anything?
Paul, I already use 100% dampening in the controller menu...although I am not aware that it makes any difference in rF2 whatsoever (with the Fanatec; I know it does for other wheels). I would like to understand how my wheel can feel objectively so different for one car, but the very same for another, using the identical settings. The only thing that is changed is the hardware. Another test--what does the ISI F1 car feel like--with default settings and then with your alternate settings? Compared to the F2. They should be subtly different, of course, but not dramatically different.
Paul i think those damping resistance ( even the spring settings ) in the controller file are just applying static forces. I did not much testing the last month with the FFB and used it standard for testing purposes of the new builds and cars but i never used those static forces, even if a appropriate strength is determined and the result feels more natural to you, it is not dynamically generated by the physics and makes it just worse because it slows down the overall steering dynamic.
Some more info from "digi" if it helps... http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.php/16703-Steering-spring-vs-Steering-resistance-coefficient?highlight=
Nope, the throttle, brake, and clutch FFB lines don't do anything in rF2. I tried to enable them as i was desperately trying to get some additional FFB stuff going on but it doesn't work. Paul, what in-game FFB strength do you use (per car)?
Sweet, thanks Paul. A bit of clipping here and there is minor to me. As long as my FFB does some sort of shudder, or FFB forces decrease or just anything to indicate I'm loosing grip for a certain tyre then some clipping of just overall steering resistance (like more resistance as you turn more with very high downforce) is no biggie for me personally since just loading up and adding more steering resistance is just that - adding and loading up more steering resistance, it's not a loss-of-grip moment/effect and therefore has no affect on slip angles, car/tyre limits, fractions of a second (laptime), etc. Now, if the clipping is ocurring in such a way that it masks actual loss of grip/tyre-slip effects/forces (especially front tyres) then that's a different story.
