Can you drive an F1 car on the ceiling?

[jtbo]

looks like it will take a while so i will just leave it running and post the completed files here once done. Its pretty late so I need some sleep.

Maybe around 3 hours with your machine, not quite sure how much changing that angle will affect the computing time. My computer computes single tire between 4 and 12 hours depending bit from options.

 

[martymoose]

Not sure if it's working, the percentage done has never shifted. There is load on the cpu and the app hasnt crashed but doesnt appear to be doing much. I left it over night hoping it will do something but it's not looking too promising.

As soon as I click the run automated the screen stops updating but i still have acces to the cursor. I am running full screen because even if i check window mode it still loads fs both in dev mode and all other modes for some reason.

I stopped the process and reloaded the tgm file and it now has percentage done 1.336 after about 9hrs lol. Maybe this tyre is a bit much for the software I noticed it only uses 15% cpu load when its working

 

[martymoose]

As a test I have just done the automated option with the default data when the app loads and this is going fine with no issues. In this test I let it run for about 30 min no issues and cpu temps never got over 35c

Your tgm file is hanging the app for some reason though. Have you tried it on your end to see if it hangs?

I have even tried running cpu at stock same result, but my liquid cooled cpu has passed 12hrs prime at 5ghz along with heavy video editing at that setting so its not a cpu stability issue for sure.

I just dont think that file will work properly. Is there anything else I can try?

 

[osella]

Neat idea, everybody who heard F1 heard this should be possible.

I'm afraid we won't be able to test this in rf2 though since I personally expect that rf2 - and other sims too - just simulate downforce by playing with grip coefficients and not actually push the car into ground as martymoose said as a possibility, hence the car just won't stick to the roof even if it had 10x more downforce than real F1 car.

Of course I may be totally wrong, but to me this makes more sense - to fake the effect of downforce since for actual racing it wouldn't really make difference. Noone wanted or will want to drive upside down.

 

[Tuttle]

As a test I have just done the automated option with the default data when the app loads and this is going fine with no issues. In this test I let it run for about 30 min no issues and cpu temps never got over 35c

Your tgm file is hanging the app for some reason though. Have you tried it on your end to see if it hangs?

I have even tried running cpu at stock same result, but my liquid cooled cpu has passed 12hrs prime at 5ghz along with heavy video editing at that setting so its not a cpu stability issue for sure.

I just dont think that file will work properly. Is there anything else I can try?

Seems like you need to use a smaller DT multiplier. Try 0.85 and take a look to the bottom section of the ttool.

PS: It's not just a single test...but a LOT of tests (72 or mooooore)....so the percentage is calculated on every single test.

 

[martymoose]

Seems like you need to use a smaller DT multiplier. Try 0.85 and take a look to the bottom section of the ttool.

PS: It's not just a single test...but a LOT of tests (72 or mooooore)....so the percentage is calculated on every single test.

Thanks Tuttle dropping that to 0.85 has worked it was at 1.0 originally. I dont know what all the figures are as Im just running this for jtbo.

Should have it up as soon as its done, all looks fine after that change and I assume it wont have any negative effect on the end result.


Update: Still going fine 45 of 72 tests in just under an hour so I think it will take around 1:40 per tyre.

 

[martymoose]

Here are the 2 completed TGM files. I have included the files from the backup folder too as the originals seem to have shrunk a little and trying to load them back in that tool was crashing it so not sure if that's normal or means they are corrupted. Both completed 100% in around 1h40m and I just added an f to the file name before saving.

http://www.mediafire.com/?87crelc8tp1njkd

Hope they are fine lol, but I did have to drop the DT multiplier to .85 as Tuttle suggested because it was hanging originally.

 

[jtbo]

Here are the 2 completed TGM files. I have included the files from the backup folder too as the originals seem to have shrunk a little and trying to load them back in that tool was crashing it so not sure if that's normal or means they are corrupted. Both completed 100% in around 1h40m and I just added an f to the file name before saving.

http://www.mediafire.com/?87crelc8tp1njkd

Hope they are fine lol, but I did have to drop the DT multiplier to .85 as Tuttle suggested because it was hanging originally.

That is bit odd, there is only lookup tables in saved files (ones with f), I wonder if those will work if I place other sections from original ones to saved ones, well only one way to find out, by testing that.

edit: Tires attached, use those at dev mode, also one needs to bring F1 car to dev mode to be able to use these tires. These probably don't change anything for current test track, but would need track I described earlier, however there are no quarantees that even that would work better.

I need run now, but will test tires later.

 

[martymoose]

So were those files ok? No need to redo it?

I will try the tyres on the f1 will try figure out how to bring f1s to dev mode. That was the first time I even used dev mode, I did do some basic modding conversions in rf1 with some of the aussie v8 tracks but havent done anything for some time. Always intended to get into some scratch made tracks.just never had the enough time.

 

[jtbo]

So were those files ok? No need to redo it?

I will try the tyres on the f1 will try figure out how to bring f1s to dev mode. That was the first time I even used dev mode, I did do some basic modding conversions in rf1 with some of the aussie v8 tracks but havent done anything for some time. Always intended to get into some scratch made tracks.just never had the enough time.

I'm back from run, so I test them now.

To get car into devmode, this is how do it currently, there are probably other ways too, but this way I get it into dev mode fastest and as I don't edit graphics, only physics, it is simpler to keep graphics packed.

First I copy all stuff to their places, after that I extract what I want to edit and remove .mas files that I don't need to keep things clean.

Step1: Copy 'FormulaISIr' folder from rf2data\Installed\Vehicles to rf2data\ModDev\Vehicles

Step2: Copy 'FormulaISIr_RFM_10.mas' from rf2data\Installed\rFm to rf2data\ModDev\rFm

Step3: Copy 'FISIR_Sounds.mas' from rf2data\Installed\Sounds\FISIR\1.0 to rf2data\ModDev\Vehicles\FormulaISIr\1.0
Correct place for this would be actually sounds folder, but I want to save some typing and as we can't extract sounds anyway, it is pretty much same where those are...

Step4: Starting Mas2 tool, double click MAS2.EXE from rf2data\Support\Tools

Step5: Extracting 'FormulaISIr_RFM_10.mas', as you now should have MAStool open, drag and drop 'FormulaISIr_RFM_10.mas' to MAStool and you can see files listed in window, hit ctrl-a, then right click some of the filenames and choose from popup menu command 'Extract...' navigate to path rf2data\ModDev\rFm and extract files there, don't close MAStool.

Step6: drag and drop 'FISIR_MAIN.mas' from rf2data\ModDev\Vehicles\FormulaISIr\1.0 to MAStool, hit ctrl-a right click some file and choose 'Extract...', navigate to rf2data\ModDev\Vehicles\FormulaISIr\1.0 and extract files there.

Step7: Delete 'FISIR_MAIN.mas' from rf2data\ModDev\Vehicles\FormulaISIr\1.0, also delete FormulaISIr_RFM_10.mas' from rf2data\ModDev\rFm

We now have everything on correct places so we need to change few lines in files to make it all work.

Step8: open 'FISIR.GEN' and FISIR_SPINNER.GEN in notepad++ from rf2data\ModDev\Vehicles\FormulaISIr\1.0:
We are interested from this section:

SearchPath=<VEHDIR>

SearchPath=<VEHDIR>FISIR\maps
SearchPath=<VEHDIR>cmaps_maps
MASFile=FISIR\FISIR.mas
MASFile=cmaps.mas

I changed it like this:

SearchPath=<VEHDIR>
SearchPath=FormulaISIr\1.0
//SearchPath=<VEHDIR>FISIR\maps
//SearchPath=<VEHDIR>cmaps_maps
MASFile=FormulaISIr\1.0\FISIR.mas
MASFile=cmaps.mas
MASFile=FISIR_TEAMSa.mas

Remember to do change to both .gen files.

Step9: open 'ISIFM_10.RFM' from rf2data\ModDev\rFm add two lines after this:

//[[gMa1.002f (c)2012    ]] [[            ]]
Mod Name = ISI Formula Masters
Mod Version = 1.0

Lines that must be added:

Track Filter = * NSCRS SRGrandPrix OWChallenge TMOD
Vehicle Filter = FISI_ROAD

Well, only * is needed for track filter, but rest came when I copied from another mod that I had moved earlier to dev mode and did not know what I know today, tomorrow I know again some more...

After that it should work in dev mode, error saying gridmarker could not be loaded means some path in .gen file is wrong, if can't select car but can select series, then RFM file needs some attention.

Of course in modding style in rF1, you would just need to make backup of old tires and put new tires in with same name and be done with it, but this is not rF1 and besides you need to do this only once per mod version.

Now you can then either make backup of old tires and replace with those new tires, or edit TBC file's TGM line to match filenames of new tires and after that one can do some testing.

Common error becomes from .gen file editing, path is slightly different FormulaISIr instead of FISIR, that ccan cause some trouble, however that is how I got it to work, should be possible for anyone by following steps I wrote, happy modding

 

[martymoose]

Thanks for the guide very helpful for a reborn Noob like me

I did redo the TGM files this time at DT multiplier .90 it froze at .95 and 1.0. I deleted all the files from my first tests as I think possibly the app crashing leaving behind files in the backup folders may have caused some form of corruption in those first files I made.

These should be better I hope, file sizes are more like the originals. Last time I did alt tab out after saving one of them and then I couldn't get back into the app and had to force close it myself. This could have caused the issue that corrupted it first time around.

http://www.mediafire.com/?dyaic1gir10rrb2

Is anyone else having trouble running RF2 in window mode? mine wont go to window mode no matter what I have tried. I tried disabling SLI, shutting down MSI afterburner and all options within the game I could think of but it boots full screen no matter what in both dev mode and single player. I haven't tried multilayer in window mode yet but dont see why this would be different to the other 2.

I am using latest Nvidia Beta drivers 305.53 on win 7x64 with 2 x GTX480 sli but same issue single or SLI. I cant alt tab out of dev mode and get back into it so its a bit of a PITA.

 

[MJP]

Is anyone else having trouble running RF2 in window mode? mine wont go to window mode no matter what I have tried. I tried disabling SLI, shutting down MSI afterburner and all options within the game I could think of but it boots full screen no matter what in both dev mode and single player. I haven't tried multilayer in window mode yet but dont see why this would be different to the other 2.

I am using latest Nvidia Beta drivers 305.53 on win 7x64 with 2 x GTX480 sli but same issue single or SLI. I cant alt tab out of dev mode and get back into it so its a bit of a PITA.

If you run in a window at your desktop resolution it will look like you're running fullscreen, if you run in a window less than your desktop resolution then it will show window borders.

 

[martymoose]

Thanks, I had tried lower resolutions before and it had no effect. Just tried again and I can now get in full screen even in full res so not sure what I did but its working now.

Ok edit its kind of working, I have window mode in Single player but dev mode is still booting in full screen no matter what I set the screen up as.

 

[jtbo]

Thanks for the guide very helpful for a reborn Noob like me

I did redo the TGM files this time at DT multiplier .90 it froze at .95 and 1.0. I deleted all the files from my first tests as I think possibly the app crashing leaving behind files in the backup folders may have caused some form of corruption in those first files I made.

These should be better I hope, file sizes are more like the originals. Last time I did alt tab out after saving one of them and then I couldn't get back into the app and had to force close it myself. This could have caused the issue that corrupted it first time around.

http://www.mediafire.com/?dyaic1gir10rrb2

Is anyone else having trouble running RF2 in window mode? mine wont go to window mode no matter what I have tried. I tried disabling SLI, shutting down MSI afterburner and all options within the game I could think of but it boots full screen no matter what in both dev mode and single player. I haven't tried multilayer in window mode yet but dont see why this would be different to the other 2.

I am using latest Nvidia Beta drivers 305.53 on win 7x64 with 2 x GTX480 sli but same issue single or SLI. I cant alt tab out of dev mode and get back into it so its a bit of a PITA.

I had some issues, configure sim button does nothing for me, I need to set resolution ingame, also sometimes when I go windowed or full screen it just does CTD.

So far haven't found reliable way to replicate that, so don't know.

Those originals seem to be working fine when I just put back what was missing from them, I try new ones too, it really is helpful as with my computer no chance to compute under 4 hours single tire. I upgrade when my lottery winning arrives to my bank account, still would need to win in lottery though, but minor hurdles...

As I fooled around in loop I sometimes landed so that car was running on two wheels and it did look very convicing, now only thing that would be needed is special track to fool physics engine.

 

[MJP]

Thanks, I had tried lower resolutions before and it had no effect. Just tried again and I can now get in full screen even in full res so not sure what I did but its working now.

Ok edit its kind of working, I have window mode in Single player but dev mode is still booting in full screen no matter what I set the screen up as.

Dev mode has its own config.ini, plr and controller.ini too. Just click on 'Settings' at bottom of window once you've launched dev mode.

 

[Gearjammer]

Just curious, but you all know that running windowed uses more resources and slows down your frame rates, right?

 

[martymoose]

Yea I wouldn't actually race in windowed mode but doing things in the dev mode its handy to be able to get in and out of it as alt tab doesn't work too well.

My PC does ok in both modes and I just did a quick test with no difference at mid ohio, all settings maxed aa set in game to level 8, 29 AI all visible, HDR only thing of is FXAA which I dont like blurring textures and also 8x transparency SS AA in Nvidia control panel. Just ran a few laps and FPS never dropped below 60p with vsync on set to display in game, I use Vsync because I hate the screen tearing without it.

Funny thing is in full screen even though its sticking to 60p its not exactly 100% smooth to the eye, just then in 1080p windowed mode it for the first time looked as smooth as RF1 with a very smooth 60p. I expect windowed to be a little slower but as I stick to 60p nearly at all times just a couple track have a couple of slight slow downs with mirrors enabled down to about 45-50p, if it stays smoother I will just stick to window mode for a while.

MJP thanks I didn't realize dev mode had its own control settings, that would explain it lol.

 

[jtbo]

Just curious, but you all know that running windowed uses more resources and slows down your frame rates, right?

Yes, but when modding you really want to do it in window, much easier to survive from lockups etc. which are quite common, I mostly run windowed all the time, also when I compare 1024x768 windowed mode performance to full screen 1920x1080 I would say windowed runs better, using 1024x768 on my monitor full screen is out of the question

Also when modding, I just keep rf running, check out logs, adjust some things, enter track again, saves lots of time, alt-tab has never been reliable in any game I have had.

 

[MJP]

Just curious, but you all know that running windowed uses more resources and slows down your frame rates, right?

Yes, at least that's always been my findings with Nvidia cards at least (never had an ATI card). I only run in a window for testing and checking stuff, go fullscreen for proper racing. As an example on my current hardware 1920x1200 fullscreen runs better than 1280x800 in a window.

 

[Jameswesty]

Yes an F1 car can drive on a roof so long as the car is moving fast enough that the force of air pushing on the aerodynamics is stronger than the force of gravity. ( there are also other affects that help it stick to the roof )


In the image the car on the ground and on the roof are both moving at 150MPH from right to left .

The car on the Roof will be stuck to the roof at 1G less than the car on the ground is stuck to the floor.

View attachment 3738

The image is a gross oversimplification of aerodynamics just to help explain