“ are rfactor2 physics broken” video

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by GTClub_wajdi, Dec 29, 2020.

  1. romaFC

    romaFC Registered

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    Yeah lets compare apples to oranges.

    We are talking about rf2/iRacing/ACC here not what is done in real life.

    And no real teams do have data. They send out that michelin or pirelli or whatever brand to rig pay $20-50K and will get full report.
    Because wasting time on real track trying to figure how to maximize contact patch is very expensive.

    Pro drivers opinion is just opinion.
    Its not set in stone.

    Comparing real data to game is the only way.
    If real thing matches 90ish percent than its done correctly.

    And I will repeat again.

    If rf2 gets Mercedes/McLaren/Audi GT3 handbook. That includes suspension geometry/dyno/gear ratios/damper dyno etc. It all part of real life FIA GT3 Homologation.
    Guess what iRacing and ACC will get same.
    The same will go for aero data.

    The only difference between these 3 games now is the tyre model.

    Which is anyone guess which one is closest to real thing.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2021
  2. Yzangard

    Yzangard Registered

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    Well, ACC's physic is very good imho but the FFB is terrible, just plain horrible.
     
  3. Yzangard

    Yzangard Registered

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    About the bold section, just watch this :



    Not that much of a "problem" it seems...
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2021
  4. Yzangard

    Yzangard Registered

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    Those parameters are accessible to anybody with knowledge, time and will to modify them since they are in the car's files. Pretty easy to change actually, there is even a website with all required material to edit those files to make them like we want, not to mention ttool that is within rFactor 2 itself.

    As stated several times before : this is the tyre definition that is to blame and this definition lies within car's files.

    As a consequence, it could be pretty easy as well to modify default files to create a new car with completely OP tyres and make a video blaming rFactor 2's physics (I am NOT implying this is what the OP's video author did !).
     
  5. pilAUTO

    pilAUTO Registered

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    145 messages in just 5 days, finally there is debate on the subject of realism and the physical engine.

    S397 can no longer turn a deaf ear to these concerns.
     
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  6. Slip_Angel

    Slip_Angel Registered

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    No we don't have access to DLC car data , we can't modify them.
    We here in general talking about DLC official cars.
     
  7. Slip_Angel

    Slip_Angel Registered

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    cool video, i have already watched it.
    but you are omitting serious details..
    1.If you here what D61 says about that technique he CLEARLY says that this technique is horrible and induced UNDERSTEER
    BUT in rf2 you have to use such extreme steering technique to get maximum front bite ....not inducing understeer

    2.Completely different tyres, this is again stated in video that tire that alonso drove were pretty edgy so to COUNTER it he purposely induced understeer going into the corner.
    No racing cars use grooved tire anymore(thankfully) PLUS this technique would NOT work in modern race car....not a single one.

    3. Further more in RF2 this excessive steering goes even beyond what is shown in this video.
    take a look at theses fast laps done by alien guy->>



    More, take close look at steering angle at eau rouge and pouhon




    You see the difference ? in RF2 the tire generating big grip even when driven in such bad manner.
    IRL you see can go straight with such bad steering technique but in RF2 the car follows the line.

    IMG_9478.JPG

    If you see the cornering speed that guy playing RF2 is achieving is actually very fast... DESPITE using such terrible technique.
    So not only he is fast lap times wise but he is also carrying amazing speed in corners with such bad technique.
    This is not a driving preference, there are certain ways a car and tire needs to be driven, your driving technique HAS to work with laws of physics and vehicle dynamics NOT the other way around.
    Drivers who force their bad driving technique on car and setup are most the time at back of the field, good driver works and adapts with car.
    You can't expect the car and tires to do as you wish....the limits are already set by car and driver HAVE to use good technique to get close to those limits.
     
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2021
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  8. SoloWingX

    SoloWingX Registered

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    To all those, who vehemently protect the current state of rF2... the "opposing party" only wants to see your favourite sim improve, not fail. That's why they care and provide feedback. Keep that in mind when replying.
     
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  9. Comante

    Comante Registered

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    You need to know the steering angle that they use, because I noticed myself that often, reducing it, prevents excessive steering input, and I personally go faster, with a lighter car that would otherwise be too sensitive to steering and would spin a lot. But I suck and to turn the wheel so fast I would have to reduce FFB , and I don't want to do it. What I mean is that you can make functional setup that don't need too much steering input to make the car turn.
     
  10. Remco Majoor

    Remco Majoor Registered

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    Nobody in here is saying that rF2 doesn't have problems in the physics. I bet you everyone agrees that definitely the GT cars have too large working ranges, don't punish you for going over the limit enough, that too extreme setups work too well. Where the tension starts to rise is when the 'discussion' starts going on about what exactly is wrong or when someone questions slip's claims. Let me quote a few of his replies.

    "the only problem is guys like you getting in way of simulation.
    If you don't know how things should work then please don't comment on such complex topics you are actually misguiding people."

    "any real sim enthusiast CANNOT drive without thinking about it."

    "Do you like unrealistic sim ? or you like to fool yourself ?"

    About the active development from S397> "Yea very active, taking them years to fix these exploits."

    Talking about vehemently, if someone doesn't agree with him they apparently aren't allowed to comment, aren't sim racing enthusiasts, or when we talk about the devs active development, since it's not exactly developing what he wants, it's not active development.

    I wonder why 'the opposition' gets so much opposition.
     
  11. Martin Dyrlund

    Martin Dyrlund Registered

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    Onboard from one of the front runners of GT Pro:

     
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  12. Martin Dyrlund

    Martin Dyrlund Registered

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    https://forum.studio-397.com/index....l-properties-in-tgm-files.65553/#post-1020803

    Even the material properties of the tyres in the official database is wrong.
     
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  13. Slip_Angel

    Slip_Angel Registered

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    Nice video, thanks for contributing to the topic. some people just trying to divert the things from issues to things that don't matter.
     
  14. Filip

    Filip Registered

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    One of the reasons it looks strange is because replay quality is low in this video.
     
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  15. Remco Majoor

    Remco Majoor Registered

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    This is a better video as an example indeed
     
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  16. Martin Dyrlund

    Martin Dyrlund Registered

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    Go into settings and override the steering angle to something like 200-240 degrees. Thats how it was driven in GT Pro. Nothing to do with replay quality to low. The Callaway needs to be driven like that to be fast...
     
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  17. Martin Dyrlund

    Martin Dyrlund Registered

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    You found a onboard video driven with LeMans low df package, on a track like sebring... Do i need to say more?
     
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  18. Kahel

    Kahel Registered

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    One of the strangest comment I came across... and it got one like :).

    Ps: it got 2 now... why the hell not, to stay in the absurd vibe.
     
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  19. Remco Majoor

    Remco Majoor Registered

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    Exactly, which is my point
     
  20. Ermz

    Ermz Registered

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    FWIW, these criticisms came up while Formula E went virtual (particularly the driving on the throttle thing - criticized by the actual Formula E drivers themselves), so it isn't just confined to the newer GT cars.

    The Daniel Abt debacle was a good case in point:

     

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