Released GTE and Oreca 07 New Tyre Update

Discussion in 'News & Notifications' started by Paul Jeffrey, Jul 5, 2022.

  1. maikoheart

    maikoheart Registered

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    I find the "too easy" remark a bit ridiculous. I've been practicing for a league race since about a week ago and the new update had erased our progress, which is fine. The previous tires though felt insanely lazy and nervous, with the back end always wanting to kick out and never giving an intuitive and easy experience. These cars are not drift cars in real life, they give some slip angle but like with any modern GT car it's a very sharp peak and going over it will lead to a spin or a general time loss.

    The new update is genuinely awful however. There's zero grip on the rear and the tires wear far too easily. At Le Mans you see teams double stinting these tires all the time, however it's impossible to even double stint the mediums. Softs which would be optimal at such a track with not many turns to build pressure and temperature into the rubber completely give up by mid stint, and mediums don't wear much better either.

    If these were the same tires they used in real life, 3/4ths of the GTE AM field would not be able to finish the race by even the 1 hour mark. Yet the tire update feels fine on the Oreca 07. Did they just fit on the parameters from the Oreca to the GTE cars and just call it a day?
     
  2. L0P3X

    L0P3X Registered

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    Probably even the engineers themselfs think that the designers of the real car are actual "zangüangos" :D

    I saw some videos after noticing the new steering rack limit, for example, check how the driver reaches the physical limit (which seems to be exactly the same as it's right now ingame) on La Source here:
     
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  3. MBA_PRO

    MBA_PRO Registered

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    I'm not keen in any discussion about comparison between real life racing and virtual simracing. But I'd like to comment regarding the real life thing: Drivers can kill soft tyres in 1 lap. They do so during qualification, they push to the max. But they can do full stint with softs only by managing tyres.
    Now back to the sim: previous tyre model allows you to push hard with softs for 1h or 2h while keeping laptimes consistent. But with the new tyre model you can use soft for qualy and if you want to use them in the race, you have to manage them, meaning your laptimes will be slower and your driving needs to be more precise and gentile.
    I remember in 2017 i have raced with a GT3 mod "BES GT3" which uses a tyre model similar to the new one. the races were 1h long. So some teams pit to change tyres during the race and others don't. teams who change tyres gain back the time lost during the pit stop by attacking hard and teams who don't change tyres they try to keep a reasonable pace and keep the tyres good. There was a real strategic decision to make.
    Nowadays simracers used to not care about tyres too much because they were 100% sure that their tyres will last at least 1h.
    So with the new tyres, you need to work more seriously on your strategy, your setup and your driving style. This is what we have been asking for.
     
  4. Simulation_Player

    Simulation_Player Registered

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    that is not tyre most likely, that was broken aero.
    now tyres are actually edgy while aero is more realistic.

    if you haven't seen this >
    https://streamable.com/dt6q6l
    as you can see rear have enough grip to slide continuously in 3-4 corners, that was done on P1 wing too. it can't get any easier than this sorry, it is already seems to need tweaks.
    both tyre wise and aero wise (yaw sensitivity).
    As for wear i didn't drive enough, honestly what matter most if tyres matching IRL handling behavior first then wear behavior can be bit off and it will still be more enjoyable and realistic.
     
  5. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    If you try hard enough you can find almost anything you're looking for. Let's see how it gets driven in competition.
     
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  6. ThomasJohansen

    ThomasJohansen Registered

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    try open the setup file in notepad++ and open another setup you made for this car, and compare some class info, maybe there is something wrong. If I remember correctly it orientated from a setup I downloaded a year ago and have altered to my needs and drivingstyle.

    its probably this line you have to change something in:
     
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  7. Simulation_Player

    Simulation_Player Registered

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    actually didn't need to try hard at all ;) , but yea lets see how things are at top level. hopefully setup wise realistic approach matters too.
     
  8. vava74

    vava74 Registered

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    Watched the video and, personally, my perception was that:
    - you did not seem to be going fast;
    - the slides seemed to be induced by a drifting approach to turns - "scandi-flick" - which is something that theoretically can be made with any car.

    So, in my opinion, it would/will only be worrying if:

    - you can slide while driving on the limit (without losing control);
    - the sliding does not overheat and wear the tyres; and
    - you don't lose speed while sliding.
     
  9. Simulation_Player

    Simulation_Player Registered

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    i think i said it in my OP as well, this is a demonstration of ease of over the limit behavior not the fastest possible way.
    that being said new tyres still exhibit that excess steering and rear sliding behvior as old tyres. which could be exploited in some specific turns and probably only last of qualifying but this bit is my opinion we will have to see how esports guys do with these new tyres.
    also the aero yaw behavior seems bit too forgiving , that i'm skpetical about too.

    in rf2 defense you can slide the slick tyres quite a bit as seen this video >



    (yes its a cup car, but its 992 version with better aero and ofcourse slicks).
     
  10. MBA_PRO

    MBA_PRO Registered

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    how do you define a realistic approach?
    and have had real-life data to compare to?
     
  11. Simulation_Player

    Simulation_Player Registered

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    yea this is why i used term "realistic approach" and NOT said that these car HAVE to match IRL setup.
    edit : for some cars u can find what works IRL by looking around blogs and talking with real engineers who worked on these car etc , then u simply compare what works in a given sim by doing test by yourself and ofcourse looking at what aliens are doing.
    ofcourse there are variables that you can't know but its better than nothing , especially better than just sitting around and accepting whatever is thrown at you....i can't detach my brain while playing a sim...i take this seriously.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2022
  12. MBA_PRO

    MBA_PRO Registered

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    Yes we always need to criticize and be curious..otherwise, things won't improve.
    Do you know that detached front ARB in an LMP2 car is often done in real life?
     
  13. Simulation_Player

    Simulation_Player Registered

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    I don't have knowledge about lmp2 tbh.
     
  14. MBA_PRO

    MBA_PRO Registered

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    real data is extremely confidential and very hard to get. So I try to enjoy the sim as much as I can, it has so many great aspects that cover any lack of realism. The real thing about any sim is to finish the race first if you can.
     
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  15. Alex96

    Alex96 Registered

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    Thanks for the interest L0P3X, but the video is from 2019 so I decided to search on my own.
    Here I can see that Alpine LMP1 turns to the right more than 180 degrees to avoid the Glickenhaus who has spun; and I think LMP1 and LMP2 share a chassis (same wheelbase and width?) and it seems strange to me that the Alpine can have a minimum 380 degree turn and an LMP2 does not.
    Watch this video between 1h:59:30 and 1h:59:40 and set the playback speed to 0.25 =>
     
  16. Robin Pansar

    Robin Pansar Member

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    The user manual of the car suggests a setup where the front ARB setting is D22 S-S, which provides a ground stiffness of 241.5 N/mm. Softest setting available is nowhere near detached state, so you can with confidence, even with basic knowledge about tyres and aerodynamics, that running detached anti-roll (or soft roll stiffness in general) is very silly in a car with high aero. This thing with soft suspension is a game issue, which has existed for a long time.

    It's better to look at onboard from the Oreca07 than assume based on other cars.

    Turn 2 at Portimao that looks like full lock.

    Turn 1 at Spa looks like full lock.

    Only info I have on the steering is that the steering ratio is 13.7. I'd be surprised if the developers didn't get the steering right when they have accurate setup options, engine, aero, etc.
     
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  17. Simulation_Player

    Simulation_Player Registered

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    I too enjoy sims even though i know some of their shortcomings, but sometimes shortcomings are way too broken, like how GTE cars were before this update. now i can enjoy them again even if i'm not 100% satisfied with tyres aero and interior etc.
    I just wanted to post my findings on new tyres , maybe there is no issue but if there is i wanted help improve , give feedback as a consumer as much i can.
     
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  18. davehenrie

    davehenrie Registered

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    Are Oreca's locked in with a fixed steering ratio or can they use different steering boxes to affect different ratios at different tracks?
     
  19. GTClub_wajdi

    GTClub_wajdi Registered

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    Are you a real GT racing car driver?!
     
  20. Simulation_Player

    Simulation_Player Registered

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    exactly why it shouldn't be this easy for me ;)
     

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