Grip

Something totally different. How could we improve the sense of speed, so the expectation you have of grip at a certain speed, actually matches the speed you are going at. Seeing that driving 120 km/h feels like about 40 km/h, one can get the wrong expectation pretty easy. More wind noise? An effect, high frequency shake (but little actual movement)? I don't know, but maybe this could be an area to be improved in

 

Driving a real car at 120 on the motorway, or on the track with a racecar is totally different actually. Indeed the sound alone is quite a big differnece The point is, when driving around in rF2 I think the sense of speed makes you think you're travelling at a way lower speed than you actually are. Imo driving at a 100 km/h in rF2 translates to 40 km/h in real life for example. If we could get those values closer to each other, I'm quite sure the grip levels and feeling of control would become less and less of a hot topic

Motion rigs do have a very big impact on sense of g's and stuff, but that has it's limitations as well if you're looking for a sustained g-force for any long period of time. But it sure does help

A solution for this would be a higher FOV, but since that isn't a realistic one, it's not one for me..

 

+1

I think the green track is about right myself but as you say K, it`s something that doesn`t happen all that often in reality anyway...

 

Yes, drive on green track is like drive on rain. It's absurdly over done. But ISI staff already stated they're not concerned about it. They have professional drivers who supports their ice-sand-wet-green tracks (Who? Nobody knows).

There're tons of Schumachers here saying the green track is ok, they're fast at any circumstances, the grip is fantastic, it's normal to be 20 sec slower in a green track, etc, so it's like preaching in the wilderness.

So, let it be.

 

And there are tons of Buttons saying the is no grip on green track, just saying, but right now grip levels seems to be ok. We just need slider with RealRoad acceleration value

 

Well yes this is what i feel.

After more testing last night it's very car dependent for me but still yes it feels like a wet track rather than a non rubbered track. The Nissan GTR seems to behave really bad for me, it feels like ice skating, it's really poor, you turn in and lose all feel, really can not feel anything, highly funky physics i can not feel the rear coming round it just goes and you are a passenger. You have to rely it seems on visual cues to determine what the rear is doing. Corvette is much the same under low grip situations, i just don't believe purpose build race cars with big fat slicks etc behave in the real world like this.

Skippy feels really good even on the first laps for me, i can't beleive how different the cars feel in how some feel like next gen cars in terms of physics, like the F1, Skiipy and Megane and others like the GTR and vette feel like rF1 cars. The Megane was not great at the start and has moved on bundles so i presume others will get the same treatment.

For the record i can lap perfectly fine with the green track physics, took the F1 and am fine with it, just doesn't feel right.

I await the cheesy video now of someone lapping in a vette saying look mum i can do it, well, i can too, but it still doesn't feel right and still feels like rF1 with some cars.

 

I re-quote myself

 

This is the same problem as in iRacing (and probably other simulators as well). In fact, in iRacing I feel less sense of speed than in rFactor2. FOV has quite a big impact on this. In rFactor the default FOV was something like 60-65 whereas rF2 now defaults to 50. With such a low FOV I think the only way to fix it would be to move to triple screen setup.

 

Should add my testing was done at Palm Beach and feels3's Putnam. GTR for me at Palm Beach it feels like you are a passenger and not in control. Car feels weightless and seems to lack mass etc. Biggest problem is on mid corner and exit, i lose all feedback in the wheel and can not feel when i can plant the throttle when you do the car will not let you know it's too soon and within half a sec you are facing the other way. I don't get these physics and FFB, it feels dated and like rF1. You then try and exit with the throttle a little more progressive, one time you may make it, but that time you don't, i always feel like....wtf . It just lets go and gives no sign it is going to.

Skippy and the classic F2 and F1's i can feel the rear in the FFB and can also feel the tyres at all times. Something feels really off with some cars.

 

@stonec

Even with triple screens you still have the same problems, although you are right that it does diminish a bit, having stuff pass you by in your peripheral vision, but still...

 

would be cool if car's peak power may vary a bit from track to track, because of ambient air pressure as part of the engine torque calculations, so things like elevation and weather will have an impact on engine performance.

 

Also in real life not all cars are a joy to drive, some suck balls some dont, some give you more feed back than others. This was a good little watch, man i want one.

 

Awesome video mate, as always Harris makes anything seem so cool. But totally irelevant to this discussion. we don't have this car in sim. Go and watch a skippy video and i think i see alot of characteristics in the real life videos that i feel in sim with rF2, that's relevant and good to see that ISI seemed to have nailed it perfectly. Still even if it looks the same as the real one in physics, doesn't matter really if the FFB is not giving you the feeling either. Megane is much the same, looks to behave much the same, both cars have great FFB

Go and watch a GT2 and GT1 vette and GTR however and they tell a completely different story. Once track is rubbered up, both cars feel better but they both still lack the feedback in the wheel with regards to the rear of the car.

 

No your right its not that relevant really, but at one point he says it takes him a bit longer to get used to it and dont really get much feeling and not sure where the grip is either. Chris has a cool job

 

Yes mate he does have a super cool job and he is a big Porsche fan so kudos is always given to him from me. I watch all his stuff and wish he would end up on mainstream TV like Top Gear, much better than any of the current line up on there by far.

The grip thing is interesting but yeah within time he would learn that cars charactor and what he can do and not do and would know when he can push and not to. Some cars in rF2 are so unpredictable though as in the vette and GTR with the lack of feedback at times. Constantly feel like i'm chasing the throttle feeling for grip, just can't feel it. You think it's ok and then bam you facing the other way. Or another weirdness to rF2 is the snap oversteer which is crazy at times and countering the snap only makes things worse, there alot of weirdness to some cars.

Skippy you can catch and control all day long, when it goes, it gives cues and is progressive with the FFB.

 

I don't think its just a case of FFB , I think fundamentally allot of the cars don't have the progressive grip (however narrow) you would expect due to the nature of the tire model / physics , Which is highlight in what you said about the snap over-steer and strange balance of some of the cars when getting up to the limit.

Maybe if the cars communicated mass more through FFB rather than track texture it would make up for the lack of on the limit control as drivers would be able to more easily stay under the limit rathan than through memorising the limit.

Allot of people don't seem to think there is any issue with RF2 with the FFB or the physics though , so other than maybe a slight change in the track grip and a moderate improvement on the cars I doubt its going to change drastically when it comes to ISI content.

RF2 will probably end up like RF1 in that its up to modders like Niels to implement cars that drive as you would expect real cars to.

 

Here we go again!

 

Nice one John. A lot of truth there too. I for one don't have issues with green track either for same reasons you don't. I also use higher FOV (and other "impure" settings like head motion plugin, increased tire sounds etc. because.....drum roll.....it's not IRL and there are tradeoffs) to get better sense of speed. Purists can do what they want but then shouldn't complain about not being able to take a tight corner on green track at 100mph LOL

 

Well while i agree there are an awful lot of yes man on this forum or +1 men who i see more, who don't contribute with anything themselves and just +1 everything, same people all the time, typical fanboy behaviour who see no wrong in anything. To be fair it's to be expected on a forum dedicated to the software i spose.

At the same time i kind of feel You base your opinion on rF2 as a whole based on a few cars. On the whole rF2 for me feels right and good. I have no issues on the limit with most cars. But yes some cars are truly funky and feel like rF1 cars and generally my issues in this game are under the limit and in the slow stuff where the game feels broke.

The snap oversteer with certain cars is certainly wrong, just no progression to the physics and plain unpredictable. This happens in pure race spec cars with big fat ass slicks and aero and sorry but I do not believe for one second this is how they behave in the real world.

No flaming but going by your post it seems you read only what you want to read in any post and get all excited and post away. i can drive perfectly fine thanks on a green track but it still doesn't feel right. No adjusting needed on my part.