Unable to control cars properly

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Tom Endres, Jun 30, 2012.

  1. osella

    osella Registered

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    Well it can't set correct steering lock because in many series it varies track to track. In F1 its probably the most obvious, at monaco they can use 22 lock while at fast tracks like spa just 17, while using the same rotation (which is 450 for F1 afaik).
     
  2. FONismo

    FONismo Registered

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    Amen too that ;)
     
  3. tjc

    tjc Registered

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    Yeh I`ve got this covered budd but appreciate the reminder. :)
     
  4. Jos

    Jos Registered

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    I wonder why the default steering lock are so high, 27 for bt20...
     
  5. Digi Lauda

    Digi Lauda Registered

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    I guess with a lower value too many less experienced people would ask why they canĀ“t make it around the hotel hairpin in monaco ;-)
     
  6. jubuttib

    jubuttib Registered

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    Probably because the car in question usually had a pretty fast steering ratio, something in the region of 10:1, and has a lock to lock wheel range of around 570-580 degrees, resulting in the steering lock being 27. Or the other way around, it had a maximum steering lock of 27 degrees, and most often used a fast steering ratio of around 10:1, resulting in the lock to lock wheel range being around 570-580.

    The game really should adopt the clear steering ratio adjustment. Messing around with specific steering wheel ranges and steering locks adds hassle on something very simple.
     
  7. Guy Moulton

    Guy Moulton Registered

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    Yeah Monaco is the only track where I crank up the steering lock to as high as it'll go!
     
  8. buddhatree

    buddhatree Registered

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    Sorry, I was going from memory... which is usually unreliable! ;)

    Here are the correct default steering rotations and steering locks:

    1960's Formula = 576 rotation, 27 steering lock (10.6:1 ratio)

    FISI = 450 rotation, 18 steering lock (12.5:1 ratio)

    FR 3.5 = 540 rotation, 20.5 steering lock (13.1:1 ratio)

    Megane = 612 rotation, 25.5 steering lock (12:1 ratio)

    Nissan = 576 rotation, 26 steering lock (11.07:1 ratio)

    Most of those ratios are way too twitchy for me.
     
  9. jubuttib

    jubuttib Registered

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    Perhaps, but don't go doing the mistake of thinking them to be unrealistic. Road cars can be right up there too, and usually racing cars are thought to have twitchier steering, in addition to having more responsive handling, naturally. For example, M3 E92 12.5:1, Ferrari 458 Italia 11.9:1, Ferrari California 13.3:1, Lamborghini Gallardo Balboni 12:1, Subaru Impreza WRX STI (2002) 13:1, Caterham R500 ~10.5:1, etc.

    Nothing wrong with liking it slower though. =)
     
  10. buddhatree

    buddhatree Registered

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    Ahh good info! Those are some pretty tight ratios. So it looks like ISI got it right.

    I usually get too much oversteer with anything lower than 15:1, so that's where I start and adjust from there if I need to.
     
  11. jubuttib

    jubuttib Registered

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    Yep, if you can prevent oversteer with that then it's great. And sometimes, if the car is oversteery by nature, fast steering can make it easier to save slides. =)

    Also some drifters have almost ridiculous ratios. Fredrick Aasbo has stated that he uses a 720 degree lock to lock rack and has around 64 degrees of steering lock from center to lock. That comes to a nice 5.625:1 ratio. =)
     
  12. Tom Endres

    Tom Endres Registered

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    So, I've just spent some time at Ohio, driving the GT-R. It was a really great feeling and it worked way better, thanks guys.

    :)
     
  13. MaXyM

    MaXyM Registered

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    But most of those cars have more than 720* lock 2 lock angle
     
  14. jubuttib

    jubuttib Registered

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    And? That just means they also have more maximum steering lock, which is useful when trying to park. Racing cars don't need that much steering lock (no often at least, can be useful when navigating the pits though) but usually have quick steering ratios, so they have less steering wheel movement.
     
  15. MaXyM

    MaXyM Registered

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    If you have two cars with different L2L angles and same steering rate, one of them, with greater L2L, will have lower SL (in term knonw from rF setup). That's why providing M3 or 458's rates is not good idea.

    Next thing I'm expecting here, is proving that modern F1 cars make use of 360* L2L only ;)
     
  16. jubuttib

    jubuttib Registered

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    Ummmmmmm, what?

    Take two cars with a steering ratio of 12:1, one with 900 degrees of steering wheel range, one with 360. 900 degrees divided by the ratio 12, means the car with the 900 degree steering wheel range has 75 degrees of steering lock, from lock to lock, or in rF terms (center to lock) 37.5 degrees. The car with the 360 degrees of steering wheel range will have 360/12=30 degrees steering lock from lock to lock, or 15 degrees from center to lock. Both have equally fast steering (the steering ratio is the same), the one with 900 degree range behaves identically with the 360 degree range one until you go beyond 180 degrees to either side, but it has more maximum steering lock because it has more steering wheel range.
     
  17. osella

    osella Registered

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    Uh so what..? Ratio is what determines how "twitchy" the steering is, it doesn't matter whether rotation is 900deg or 90deg. With 90deg you'd just have super low lock -10x lower than with 900deg - for said ratio so you wouldn't make it in any slower corners but it would feel the same.
     
  18. MaXyM

    MaXyM Registered

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    OK, probably I'm too tired today.
     
  19. Tom Endres

    Tom Endres Registered

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    Oh my god...what did I start in here!? :D
     
  20. jubuttib

    jubuttib Registered

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    What, productive discussion concerning car physics, mechanics and game features? =)
     

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