Modder work on ISI download page

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by 88mphTim, May 30, 2014.

  1. Tuttle

    Tuttle Technical Art Director - Env Lead Staff Member

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    Eh eh...

    ...It's strange you're afraid because of modders being hired by game companies. I think this is a pretty good thing. Think the fact we're still working (HARD!) for rF2, as for feels3 making great things for SimBin, I'd say in a better way than before. We can spend more time (because it's a job and not a hobby), accessing proper data to make tracks...and improving day after day thanks to the continuous professional relationship with other artists, coders and GFX programmers. :)
     
  2. Golanv

    Golanv Registered

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    Sorry, I should have made clear that I was being sarcastic, minus the part that I do miss feels3 and following his projects coming to rF2.

    I totally agree, I think its awesome that this kind of movement has been going on. Reiza is a great example what modders can do when they get a chance.
    There is always the "next generation" of modders coming to the scene that picks up the modders torch.
     
  3. SPASKIS

    SPASKIS Registered

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    Hi Tutle,
    I would appreciate if you could answer some doubts:

    1)As professional modders and artists...
    Do you get involved also in 3d rendering technology decisions and projects or is it "pure track design"?
    With technology I mean ...
    ...Where is direct X going?
    ...New shader definitions
    ...Resource and framerate optimization
    ...

    2)Another thing:
    I understand from your post that you have some horizontal relationships with other modders or artists. It is good to hear although I understand due to confidentiality issues, that is the typical professional relationship where win and win sharing is based on personal confidence and discretion where "quid pro quo" rules apply: I give you, you give me.

    Is it like that or is it a more open and healthy relationship?

    enviado mediante tapatalk
     
  4. Golanv

    Golanv Registered

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    Well that was little ambitious questionaire.
    You should know better to ask such big questions about the future. :confused:

    I'm sure he is talking about within the company when it comes to sharing info, rest of it prolly is more in the lines what Nils talked about when he tested AC and shared his views about sim physics in general, and how he and Aris have had a chance to converse about the topic and share the same philosophy.
    How exactly Aris or Nils makes the physics for each car, is most likely very clear to both of them if they just test eachothers products, and secrets as such are merely the data in encrypted car files, and maybe specific tools developed by the dev.
    I'm sure all this applies to graphics designers and artists operating at this level as well.
     
  5. Jka

    Jka Member Staff Member

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    Back to the topic... :)

    I like the idea. Especially getmod part which is, some point of view, kinda broken at this point. This would lead more automated multiplayer experience, without any manual hassle when downloading independent components here and there before possibility to join server.

    Grading system would be nice too, but there should not be possibility to abuse it. Maybe tying voting to rF2 account (one vote per mod) would do that.

    Cheers!
     
  6. Noel Hibbard

    Noel Hibbard Registered

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    Seeing modders going pro could also motivate new modders to get into the scene because it could lead to a paying job one day.
     
  7. Noel Hibbard

    Noel Hibbard Registered

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    I wouldn't say it is broken, modders/admins just don't take the steps to take advantage of it.
     
  8. Noel Hibbard

    Noel Hibbard Registered

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    I like the idea. It would be really cool if ISI could implement some form of content protection too and then allow modders to sell content through this system. Think Apple AppStore for rF2.

    Oh no.... did I just open a can of worms. Hehe
     
  9. KernigWRC

    KernigWRC Registered

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    You can always see how many downloads, views, ratings (positive/negative), comments in relation to how long the track is available yet.
    If you could create a code that calculates a final rating using this^ informations you could make it easy for the players to choose.

    You could also choose some experienced people to rate things like, accuracy of elavation and corners (compared to real if possible), rendering performance, are the colours fitting or does it look strange, and other things wich are important when you try to choose tracks.
     
  10. Marc Coyles

    Marc Coyles Registered

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    ^^^ This... not knowing the profile, age, ambition of those doing mods, having it officially listed on ISI's downloads page (assuming quality control is strict) could be massive on someone's showreel when looking for that first paid job in 3D design etc. BUT...

    <<If can't be arsed with wordy posts, TL:DR summary is last line of post>>

    (Ctd) ...on the same basis... There's much-a-kerfuffle in the arts & music scene here in UK regarding 'artists' being expected to work for free in return for getting their name about. Same for the journalism scene now that large publishers are swiping up hobby-blogger's content to reuse with no reward but byline credit. Paid work begins to vanish when pro companies start using (what is effectively) free content to promote or further their product.

    I feel some reward for a modder (who after all is a digital artist) who produces something of sufficient quality should be offered by ISI, alongside the kudos of getting their work listed on ISI's page. How much in labour hours does it costs ISI to produce a track from start to finish? What ISI saves, a portion thereof should go to the modder in some form... (Vouchers for hardware manufacturers? A day in one of the sim schools who use RF Pro - surely there must be pullable strings there?)

    It's a fine line.

    I love the idea, don't get me wrong... but culturally there's a growing issue here across the digital domain and some big name companies are getting bad press for it behind the scenes in industry press etc to the point that it's in a company's best interests to offer suitable recompense to gain the moral high ground, which is a more respected position to be in as a company.


    On a side-(semi related)-note, I have stuck with rFactor since rF1 mainly because I hate the subscription payment model of others, and ISI offered the lifetime license for rF2. If they hadn't offered this, I wouldn't have gone near rF2 with a barge pole. Technically this is pointless as I don't play online anyways, but still... I'd rather 'own' the product with all it's abilities than 'rent' it. If charging for addons, they must be just that... an optional addon, not something which impacts core / lifetime of the product, and thus the value of the lifetime license. Am certain ISI shares that viewpoint, otherwise legal issues would arise from the lifetime license holders, but still, felt it should be said seeing as charging has been mentioned by some.


    <<TL:DR>>Summary: Great idea, but some reward scheme should be commissioned. If charging, don't let it impact core.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  11. Marc Coyles

    Marc Coyles Registered

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    *sigh* I sodding hate smilies.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  12. freew67

    freew67 Registered

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    I keep going back to Tim's original post and can't find the part about profit sharing.
     
  13. WiZPER

    WiZPER Member

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    About 3): Updates are also not GetMod compatible, put on top all the other issues they are pretty much useless.

    And I agree with alot of what you are saying.
     
  14. Noel Hibbard

    Noel Hibbard Registered

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    Those are great ideas. The matchmaker has most of the data you would need to know what components are "popular". GetMod could be used to track the download count. My system tracks download counts which sort of shows how popular a component is. The only problem is GetMod is only queried if you don't have a component. So the download count alone doesn't fully show popularity. Doing a rating this way would be more scientific and wouldn't require a staff to review stuff.

    I agree with SPASKIS that this sounds more like an effort to make joining easy than a rating system.
     
  15. Marek Lesniak

    Marek Lesniak Car Team Staff Member

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    The idea is very good. I hope though, some track will get some support from ISI and go through a quality check before tagged as "ISI approved" (or something like that).
    I mean, in my opinion, there must be a way to encourage track creators to not release simple conversions or low quality products. We definatelly need high quality stuff.
     
  16. Adrianstealth

    Adrianstealth Registered

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    I know this is complicating things but an online verification of track would be a good thing

    Thus a track trying to be used online from a user that dosn't have the rights to use it will not be able to be used

    This would be good for

    Tracks from an "illegal" source

    Promote mod teams to invest in quality tracks that could be payware (& thus protected from rips)
    (I know some don't like the option of payware - this is fine as there's an option not to buy etc)
     
  17. Noel Hibbard

    Noel Hibbard Registered

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    +1
     
  18. Domi

    Domi Registered

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    That is an excellent idea if you want to kill rFactor 2.
     
  19. freew67

    freew67 Registered

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    +1 :p
     
  20. Jamie Shorting

    Jamie Shorting Registered

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    Looks like Tim was right, people are way over complicating this idea. I just hope there isn't a ranking system because after all this is the internet and people are easily offended.
     

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