What and how much does one can feel from FFB on the steering wheel in rFactor 2

I found rF2 missed Camber data. Camber of each tire varies considerably while cornering. It is very sensitive to tire dynamics and temp distribution of contact patch, which is also particularly linked with suspension system. Without it, of course FFB feel would not be right. There must be a bug or something really not right here (??)

 

I wish people would understand "feel" is highly subjective. Get someone to touch a snake blindfolded and they'll say it's very smooth. Get someone to touch a snake without the blind fold and people who dont' like snakes will say it feels gross and slimy. I don't expect people here to understand because apparently "pudding and spongy are scientific terms.

 

Or it is just a WIP.

 

Probably , as there is always a certain camber angle when a tire touch the ground, this data is embedded somewhere else in the physique engine, and not explicitly output as a telemetry data. I doubt that the engine "does not take it into account", is something as big as not taking in account contact with the ground.

 

Let's talk about it again when the tires are complete. It was and is already the best and most authentic driving emotion, it can only get better.

 

The Camber is listed, but outputs all zeros ---- not variable. My fear is that they might have only use the initial value of Camber set and treat it is constant instead. I can speculate a reason on this however.
In their new tire model - "thermodynamics tyre model", they are modeling "thousands of points" of contact area of a tire. Each point on surface of the tire represents a rubber element contains itself thermodynamic properties and as result in affecting the grip properties. As Camber varies in time, the distribution of thermodynamic properties on contact area is changed too. That will lead to much more complex in calculation.....

 

This will also be the reason why the vehicles do not follow a clear trail and temporarily produce a spongy feeling, because only a non-directional surface controls trail. Let's see what happens with the upcoming tire udates. I have no concerns about the talent of the programmers and their knowledge, it is just a matter of time.

 

I can remember Mr. Groening saying that they do not measure certain tire forces as they are all natural consequences of the physical tire model. Can't remember whether it applies to camber as well though.

 

Sure, I bet they knew. Below video demonstrated as if Camber varies how much deformation of the tire would be. Imagine if camber dynamically change in time, how much complicated calculations implemented in Tyre Thermodynamics would be in "real-time". See starting at 1:20s

 

errr, camber does change. Take a look at your motec data.

 

@ Joe
Yes and another factor is the more the camber the more the wheels tend to run to the outside and this should not only contribute to the heating in respect to termodynamics but also for self/alignment. I just don't know how much about all that is feelable on the steering wheel. Sure is it's brutal what the developer can and have to deal with.

@ Joe
The deformation is another story but i have the feeling that works quite well. It is mainly just the directional control while cornering which isn't that clear, because it feels like as if just the patch would controle this, while some influencing factors are too low presented on the steering wheel.

 

In rF2, per data shown, camber seems static.
In real car, camber is NOT. Camber is very sensitive to suspension links. Chassis movements (such as roll, drop and bump, etc) all cause camber changes.

 

Yes, and feeling wise camber does change nothing on the feeling of pneumatic trail in rf2, apart from the non working heat distribution.

 

You have no idea what my brain is able to forget about. No seriously, did you feel a difference, me doesn't , at least with the T500Rs.

 

Hi speed1: I do not know. Here is my take on this. Camber change is true lateral effect on the tire. Therefore, it could directly link to steering feel. rF2 is excellent sim. This is really "Black art" part for rF2, I think. If they can implement dynamic Camber, that would be "perfect".

How much we will feel (FFB) diff from such implementation? we just do not know. In theory, as simple example, say from -3 degree to 0 degree in camber, to see if one can feel any differ between, while cornering. After all, the goal is to have camber close to 0 while at max cornering in order to get max grip. At straight, we want to some negative camber so we have inward lateral force for stability.

 

Yes rf2 is a exellent sim, otherwise i wasn't here, and i know they can implement it and they will do, and how much we will feel, i don't know, but what i know is we should, and no we don't want 0 camber, because it depends on things like as example, the height of the sidewall, the width, how stiff the tire is, how grippy the rubber is,...etc. Zero camber on a soft tire wan't have the same effect as on a stiff tire. We want maximum friction resistance ?...... yes.