Discussion in 'News & Notifications' started by 88mphTim, Nov 12, 2015.
Probably best trying an email address on this page: http://imagespaceinc.com/contact.php
The fact that ISI has changed its mind about using older builds proves several things:
1. That the claim was licit being the greatest barrier for many to move to steam. The short lapse of time it has taken to be implemented is meaningful of its importance.
2. That ISI cares about his users
3. That in order to get something you need to fight for it.
Calling griping to ask for something that was highly required and requested and suggesting that we complain for complaining really says a lot about you
And it is you who opens useless threads trying to help modders to put all our stuff together. Tyres, helmets.... WHAT WILL BE NEXT?
I would suggest you to learn some modding before trying to help modders Mr "Now with GJED and RTB creating tracks is easier than ever".
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Do you ever stop complaining? GEEZ!
You are even complaining that I am trying to help people? Omg!
I am trying to bring people and teams together, pooling resources together so modders don't need to "re-invent the wheel" when making new content.
Making resources that others can refer to if they are stuck. Which is why I made an unofficial wiki that no one wanted to be the first to share any knowledge and no, I don't need to have put out some content in the form of a car or track to try and achieve the above.
I KNEW you would have something to complain about once the beta builds you cried about being such a big problem "even though you and your members hadn't moved to steam".
My niece acts better than you and she is nearly 3!
You think that you are helping but actually what you are doing is quite useless. I would dare to say that you are doing it just in order to get some recognisition.
I am not complaining. I am attacking you. If you don't like being attacked do not provoke saying that we will now complain about something new.
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The complaining is very tiresome for something that doesn't need griped about. Many members take this hobby far too seriously and forget some use it as a fun past time! Don't make it a chore for those looking for fun!
Useless? No... Endless complaining about non-issues is useless. I'm not wanting ANY recognition, I want the rfactor 2 modding scene to succeed. Also want those that didn't think they could mod, to use tools, files, graphics and tutorials by those more experienced. Modding in this community should be about sharing knowledge not hording it thinking that is what you need to do. You seem to see my willingness to help others as a threat which I find confusing.
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Please explain if you refer with griping to asking for the possibility to roll back to other builds?
Or maybe to when I asked for rF1 gmts to be readable with GJED and some editing options to be implemented?
If not to those please EXPLAIN what has been griped about?
Yes useless. Let's see if you understand.
You have no idea of what modding implies.
All rF and rF2 modders have made their way to where they are basically by investing hundreds of hours in learning.
All the information is spread and it is not usually easy to find an answer to the issues you encounter when modding. You get very skilled in finding answers and in imitating something that performs as he expects.
Using others' work is common so any modder knows how to grab a texture or a material setting from some reference track/car that performs OK in the issue he is trying to solve.
Do you really think that a modder is not skilled enough to grab the tires from any car he likes and to put them in his own mod? Come on!! Don't make me laugh
What needs to be done to support modding would be to create an appropriate easy to use tool and create libraries to share. A modder should be an artist for tracks and an artist + an engineer for cars. However you need to be a computer and text editing guru instead.
It is a great shame in that sense that Brendon abandoned BTB to restart from the beginning with RTB.
In my opinion BTB just needed some improvements to be the perfect tool. The amount of xpacks was simply huge. Brendon received an extraordinary feedback in the official forum. (You can try to find my feedback about it. An amateur modder would easily find it compared to the solution to some modding problems.)
However as said, he started from scratch and in my opinion the result in terms of road and terrain editing is much worse. Why?
- It is much more difficult to control road shape with the new spline algorithm.
- the terrain is not so bad but as well it is difficult to get the desired result
- Using Google elevation data is only good for a rough approximation. You can check in Google earth a route around your house or a very well known place and check the elevation data.
I own both and if I make a new track it is clear I will keep on using BTB. I know that with RTB there is a big chance of spending a lot of time with a bad result or no result at all. BTB directly converts to rF1 format and RTB still doesn't and AFAIK it is not confirmed as a future option.
And by the way do you know why do I think Brendon has made this errors?
Because he is not a modder! He is looking at several things from the programmer POV and not from the modder POV. I gave him and advice not much ago:
"Build whatever track you have nearest to your house and make it work in a racing platform. Then you would know what modders need when creating a track".
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....just drive the frakker.
Not everyone is born with this information and they shouldn't need to hunt in multiple threads to get the required information. That is why I thought a wiki would be an idea. I have always wanted to support those that have no knowledge (including myself that knows limited bits) so they could get into modding and not feel too daunted. Is that a bad thing? More modders, more content... more community members, more assets, more information, less time spent in production. I am under NO illusion how long mods take to build. In the end.... MORE FUN.
But again... I do not NEED to have released anything to prove my worth. It is like you are saying I am not allowed to be a member of this elitist club of modders, that is in your head, because I have created no/little content. That is elitism at it's finest!
I don't think anyone on this forum would be appreciate being called USELESS... so an apology would be nice.
All I want is for this game to thrive... it has been a fun community to be involved with since rF1 came out. I think we have just scratched the surface of what is possible. Both ISI devs and other modders are learning things as they go along, I don't want these little tips and tricks to be lost.
When I get the time and energy I have a few things that might help other modders create content.
Now rather than try to dissect me, can we get back on topic of discussing rF2 on steam please? Thanks.
Oh dear... please...- not!
This is a place to be, not to waste....
Life is too short!
Sounds like a great idea to me.
I think people who spend quite a bit of time on forums (most of us here) tend to forget that 80%, maybe 90%, maybe 99% of players do not spend a lot of time on forums if any at all. Most people buy a videogame to play (and sometimes mod) it, not to become part of a community to have talks, discussions, give advice, give opinions, complain, etc. Most people simply buy videogames to play them. The majority of people don't care about forums, and/or have the time of day to go searching and reading them especially considering most people play multiple videogames from multiple genres. If [enter videogame name here] was the only videogame that existed then maybe it would be a different story but obviously that's not the case.
I think we forum regulars tend to forget that there's a whole-nother world of users out there and, not to mention, that it consists of probably much more users than us regulars here in "planet RF2 Forums".
I see this as a hobby rather than playing a game. Discussion is a part of this hobby. It mainly includes asking and giving advice, making wishes, not ranting.
I do play games also... Star Citizen, Football manager, f1 manager, WiiU titles... I also go outside form time to time I suggest people try these other things too. Don't be a hater.
See you on track!
I think the point is that just about everyone on here that has been here pre-Steam is NOT representative of the general purchasing population. Especially with Steam access, there will be many casual purchasers. Anything that helps those people jump over the months or years of fiddling and experimenting to ENJOY USING rF2 should be the priority. Otherwise, Steam is either useless or even a negative overall effect. We'll all still be here, but without the benefit of the much larger user-base brings to any title.
Helping modders is a whole other story. I doubt anyone smart enough to actually mod something as complex as rF2 comptently needs help finding resources the way the common user needs help finding DLC (which is perfectly facilitated by the Steam Workshop). But I wouldn't complain if someone wanted to put it together. It couldn't hurt. We already know what typical users need (a simple and central location to get content and updates--Steam). One would have to talk to modders to find out what they would find useful, or not. Steam did that and does that for their user-orientated platform. Whoever builds something for modders would need to do even more since it is a much more technical and specialized function and needs.
Yeah ............and they drive offline Historics races with 3 colours for 4 years.
Get your act together on Steam Workshop.
Start submissions and requests for skins for every ISI car, whether you offline/online steam or no-steam it does not matter.
Tell me when you get them started, I will buy steam. lol
Imagine Spin, " casual drivers " you could have numbers from 00 to 999.
Add 100 cars each pack, then start a new one but make that one up-gradable till its finished so drivers could be added regularly.
200 drivers 1GB there or abouts, hardly the 3GB lol you worried on. p
Or would it be better for 90% to have to trawl sites for individual skins then learn how to make a skinpack just so they can use them all offline.............
Durge, I think the whole car select thing is the problem in RF2.
For eg. If all 3 of the default 60s Eve F3s are 100% identical in every way (physics, sounds, graphics, upgrades, etc.) except paintjobs (skins), then it should only come up as 1 car to select not 3. There should just be 1 F3 Eve to choose from then from there you should be able to quickly scroll through all the available skins.
At the moment, we have a combination of things happening simultaneously. We have A) multiple instances of 100% identical (except skins) cars to choose from (eg. the 3 different stock F3 Eves) each with their own skin, and B) selectable skins to choose from but only specific for each particular car (under the tuning menu click "variants"). So you need to select from 3, or 10, or 100 different versions of identical cars for different skins (car select menu), then, within each particular version, you might have further skins which are only exclusively available to the particular car chosen (under tuning --> variants). You basically have particular skins to choose from within skins to choose from.
If there was just a single car to choose, and then a global list of skins to choose, everything would be simple.
A lot of people aren't even aware of RF2's great feature of auto-downloading skins because A) the skin auto-download only applies to 1 particular car (for eg. the second Eve F3 in the car-select list), and B) they don't know about clicking on "Tuning" and then "Variants" to see further skins (not to mention having to repeat that process for every car in the car-select list to see which skins, if any, the other cars have).
That is one point of Mats and my concept pack but Spin
1. To get rid of loose skins, they are a nightmare.
2. No need for tuning or scrolling skins with indecipherable file names.
This concept you see ALL skins in Car Select other methods you see nothing.
3. No repeat skins, one of the biggest problems of a single car is this.
This concept you get ALL different skins selecting up to 44 ai , never a double.
Loose skins you will always get doubles.
4. Gets rid of all skin transfer bugs, no debate please.
5. With no skin transfers and packed cars a online room boots like a offline ISI mod, no laggy start or warping skins because there is no transfer and they are all loaded.
That is only a few plus, I have more.
The biggest is after 4 years I had a dozen or more regular drivers just would not get a skin.
I tried everything, pleading even.
2 weeks after this pack 10 people never had a skin suddenly had them........wow miracles. lol no not a Miracle.
and they like it !
It would do the same thing for steam casual off-liners they want to get involved.
See it was never about having great skins and just slapping them together in a "community pack"............... my ideas always had a little more scope then that.
UI needs a complete re-do in this regard. It is barely comprehensible to us old-timers. A new user would be surely lost for quite a while.
In what regard ?? the Ui works perfect for me ??? I have been online hosting every day for 4 years ???
Spinelli can't get into a room without whinging about something or saying something don't work... hehehe
You make a good couple.
You want ISI to rebuild the bloody Ui after 4 years, lol ....crazy talk.
If people can't open their eyes enough to find tuning and its purpose they want to give up and go back to bloody arcade, seriously.
A new UI would be very welcome for so many reasons.
Yeah so would a new F3-Eve package ?................ lool
But you don't hear me whining about it every day either do you ?
4 years........... like I said I am ready for rF3 but all you newts say I can't even talk about it. ! hehehe
No you rather wait till rF3 is out for 4 years then ask for things all over again.
I don't get people.
Why does anyone think I started talk about rF3 in the first place ! ( because I don't like rF2 ? ) some people are so naive.
I wanted to talk about something different ! something without without fault ! positive ideas for the future !
But you lot just tore it down like you do everything.
Separate names with a comma.