Question About Tire Wear

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by TChapman500, Nov 28, 2013.

  1. TChapman500

    TChapman500 Registered

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    Does rFactor 2 have the same tire wear and heating issues as rFactor 1 and the other simulators built with the ISI simulation engine?

    Example:
    On an oval, simulators built off of the ISI simulation engine (either from rFactor 1 or an older version of the ISI engine) would often have the left side tires heat up as much if not more than the right side tires. The same would go for tire wear. Yet on an oval, the right side tires have the most load, so they should be the ones heating up the most. This would happen even if the heating and wear coefficients were higher on the right than on the left. Does rFactor 2 have this problem?
     
  2. Guy Moulton

    Guy Moulton Registered

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    I've gotten uneven wear left to right on lots of tracks with lots of mods. But I haven't done any oval racing with rf2
     
  3. coops

    coops Banned

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    tire model not finished. this might be the reason. it is a new tire model.
     
  4. TChapman500

    TChapman500 Registered

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    coops: The question is does this bug from rFactor 1 (and earlier ISI-based simulators) persist in rFactor 2.
     
  5. Jim Beam

    Jim Beam Registered

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    Coops answered your question...its a new tyre model so it cant be a bug leftover from rF1...but its not finished so there could be a new bug that does the same thing :)
     
  6. Armando

    Armando Registered

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    As Guy said, it's common to have uneven wear between left and right tires.
    For example, in a clockwise track and with an understeering setup, the left front tire wears much more quickly than the rest.
    That is if you avoid locking your tires under braking, which is the quickest way to wear a tire.
     
  7. Comante

    Comante Registered

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    In an oval circuit, yes the external tires are more loaded, but wear and heat come fast with friction. So, considering that higher is the load, more is the grip, chance is, that it's the internal tires to slide the most if the driving style and / or setup make so. For example, and high toe out in an oval, would make the front internal wheel, slip almost constantly, overheating and wearing it quite fast. But if this is the case, this is not a bug, but a setup error.
     
  8. Minibull

    Minibull Member

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    Loading can heat up the carcass of the tyre a massive amount though, and have a big impact on how the tyre is working, especially it's impact on pressures. Dunno about oval racing as I've never watched it, but the outer tyres inner structure must get hammered. In rF2 I'm guessing it just doesn't show up on the surface temp monitors.
    Although if there is a small bit of sliding from the front left, in an oval race I'd say the speeds are so high that it would get munched real quick.
     
  9. Domi

    Domi Registered

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    At higher loads you have "more grip" but the real friction coefficient is lower than at low loads.

    About rF1's heating and wear "issues", it's more likely a modder mistake using incorrect values on the tire files. Anyway rF2 tire model is much more sofisticated so I'd expect to have proper wear/temperatures on oval tracks, in fact doing some modding testing some time ago I had higher tire temperatures (wear I don't know, didn't check) on the external tires, using rF2 dev mode oval track.
     
  10. TChapman500

    TChapman500 Registered

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    The thing about setup errors is this: If you take a setup from say NSR (a pre-rFactor, ISI-based simulator), and put it in NR2003, run at the same track at the same speed (setup errors and all), the right side tire heating and wear will be significantly greater than the left side. On NSR, the right side tires might be higher than the left. But the wear on the left will be significantly greater. Even though the heating and wear coefficients are sigificantly higher on the right than on the left. Convert the NSR track and vehicle to rFactor (taking into account variable name changes between the ISI engine versions) and you get the exact same results as in NSR. Remember, in real life, on ovals, it is impossible for the left side tires to even match the temperature and wear on the right side, no matter how badly you set up the car.

    I guess I should ask, if on an oval, you made the left and right side tire wear and heating coefficients the same, would you get realistic results? These cars are pulling upwards of 2.5Gs in the corners. The load on the right sides would be tremendous while the loads on the left side might not even exist!
     
  11. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    There are still some 'temporary' parameters in the tyre files, and during some straightline testing (albeit with decent downforce) I found it difficult to generate a lot of heat through rolling even with some extreme values. Of course it doesn't help that rF2 shows the surface temperature so judging carcass temperature effects can be difficult. (I was using a normal circuit as well, so the straights were obviously interrupted by corners). So I'm not sure if the necessary parts are in place yet.

    And having said all that, if you knew which values to change you could definitely get extra heat from load in rF1. Unfortunately a lot of mods used a lot of copy-pasted values from other mods that were themselves largely copies of ISI original mods but with a couple of strange changes.
     
  12. 88mphTim

    88mphTim racesimcentral.net

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    I suggest some more research might be required. Current NASCAR cars can wear more on the left side than the right. So it actually depends what type of car you're talking about, not the sim.
     

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