Pivot point on spindle.

Discussion in 'Car Modding' started by Navigator, Jul 11, 2018.

  1. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    Hi guys,

    In the conversion I'm doing, there's a problem with the front wheels touching the suspension.
    The spindle is turning at a weird point and I'm looking to reset it to.....well, somewhere else that seems okay.
    Now I read about it, some say the pivot point on the spindle should be the same as the mounting point in the chassis.ini (or the pm) but that doesn't work; the spindle is high up in the air.

    So now my question; what is a good way to set- or better; alter, the pivot point on a spindle in 3Dsimed?
    And; if I do so, I would have to do the same to the rim and the tire I suppose?
     
  2. Nibiru

    Nibiru Registered

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    All the pivots should allready be set from rf1. The spindal should have the same pivot as the wheel and rim it sits with.
    Just copy the wheel or rim pivots and paste them in the spindals pivot.
     
  3. Navigator

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    But that's the point; out of rF1, it is off in rF2.
    When I look at the wheel/rim/tire/spindle; they all have 0,0,0 so I cant copy.....
     
  4. Nibiru

    Nibiru Registered

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    Simed mustnt be reading the pivot.
    Try an older version of simed as it use to.
     
  5. Navigator

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    Ah, wil try that tonight when I’m back from work. Thanks!
     
  6. Bernd

    Bernd Registered

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    In reality, there is only 1 pivot point per wheel and all connected parts, around that the parts rotate when you steer, which is between the upper and lower outer wishbone mounting points.
    You have 2 possibilities to get it working.
    The first one is, to set all pivots of the meshes in the wheel and spindle instances to 0,0,0.
    For that, you can load all these meshes from all 4 wheels and spindles, together as objects into 3dsimed and export them again.
    Normally, all pivots are set to 0,0,0 by 3dsimed then.
    The following underlined is not correct and corrected in my next post below.
    If you want to give them the 'real' pivot point, you have to find out where it is, which is easier to do by using a rf1 pm file, instead of the rf2 chassis.ini.
    Then load all wheel and spindle instance meshes, again all together, as objects into 3dsimed.
    Now mark all front left meshes with ctrl and 'frame' them with holded left mouse button, then select
    Objects -- Set Tags.
    Now check the checkbox 'edit' at 'Pivot XYZ' and enter the proper values.
    And on the left side, check the checkbox 'moveable', that it is checked dark black, not grey.
    Then click OK and do the same for the 3 other wheel and spindle parts.
    If all is done, export the objects.
    One important thing is, that all meshes in the wheel and spindle instances for each wheel, have the same pivot.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2018
  7. Jokeri

    Jokeri Registered

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    In our current project 3dsimed resets the steering wheels pivot point unless I tag the steering wheel parts as movable. That is something I have to do every time.
    When you do initial conversion, tag every part as movable and export..
     
  8. Navigator

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    Ahhh.......not yet! But I'm getting to understand a bit more and thats the key to problem solving, right?

    Well, I took the values from the pm (old one, still had it) and when I fill in those numbers, the wheel goes everywhere......
    The only way the wheel sits in its place, is when all values are 0.
    Well, except for the x-axis.

    But; the steering/hinge point as seen on the backplate, doesn't have a pivot point in the middle; it turns around (see the backplate as a clock) the 11 and 7 and not between the 12 and 6.
    So I offset it a bit and the whole thing (tire, rim, spindle) start to turn around that, making the wheel jump up and down and round and round (there's a song in that, I know).

    So I cant fill in anything else than 0,0,0

    Something else I thought off; I set everything to "movable" right now, but the spindle is the only thing that shouldn't turn around its own axis, right? I cant see if it does that too; goes to quick, but am I making a mistake with that?
     
  9. Bernd

    Bernd Registered

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    I have to excuse myself, because i have written something, that is kind of wrong, in my above post.
    It's the way, how to set the pivot points, if they shall not be 0,0,0.
    Use the XYZ center of the tire as pivot for all wheel and spindle instance meshes.
     
  10. Navigator

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    Ehm, now its getting hard...... you mean the numbers that are near the bottom of the screen in 3dsimed when you stand on the mesh, right?
    If thats the case; I tried that too; wheels go everywhere still.......
     
  11. Nibiru

    Nibiru Registered

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    Right click on a wheel and open the object instance.
    Click the + tab on the very right of the instance toll out and click center pivot to object.
    Now use these pivot values for everything with that wheel. Repeat for each wheel
     
  12. Navigator

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    Going to try that, thanks!

    Will report back but at work right now; may take a while.
     
  13. Navigator

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    Executed that; now I see the pivot points for every mesh as I see them in the lines near the bottom in 3dsimed.
    Thats good, and then I make the y-axis a bit more the the driver, changing the line y=1,256 into 1,156 for instance; now in game, I dont see a change?
    When I save and reload; they still (all) have that same line of 1,156
    Even when I make it weird (so I could see) like 0,5156; it still pivots around the centre axis in the game?

    I must be doing something wrong, but I cant come up with it........
     
  14. Navigator

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    Edit;

    I set the values to the middle again (or; geometric centre) and got the numbers where they sit in 3dsimed again.
    Now to test, I loaded up only the spindle and not as an object. I did "edit pivot point" (like with the steering wheel) and saw again the numbers (while it was always 0,0,0 at first, so something did change) and went from there to alter the y-axis, set it 10 cm back so I could see difference.

    Well, I did see difference; the whole spindle had moved(??) but was still pivoting around (like it seemed) the centre of the wheel, making the spindle move very sideways when steering........



    Could there be something weird with this whole car?
    For instance; last night I wanted to make the front rims a bit narrower and so I did the scale to 0.88 The rim did get narrower, but moved to the centre of the car too......
    So I did "position" and moved it back out.
    In the game, the rim had moved to the INside.
    I double checked; in 3dsimed it was good.
    Could there be some weird "attachment" to some part of the car?
     
  15. Nibiru

    Nibiru Registered

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    When you scale move rotate an object it does it from its pivot point. If the pivot isn't in the centre then you get strange results .
    Now if you want the spindle to move then you need to move the object in simed export. Reload the object ajust the pivot to what it should be and export again. Now the object should move in game
     
  16. Navigator

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    Its going wrong; I made a mess of my story!

    No, I didn't move anything when busy with the pivots; I just moved the pivot points in the way explained.
    The story about the front rim yesterday, was just because I thought something weird was going on. But I replaced that with the original again and went on with the pivots.
    I leave the rim size alone for now.

    Problem consists; the pivot point doesn't move backwards, it doesn't move at all (keeps middle of the wheel I mean) and when I try it with a single import (not as object) then it just moves the spindle itself when I alter the pivot point.
     
  17. Nibiru

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    Just because simed shows the objects in the correct place if the pivots arent the same for every object for the front left for eg then weird stuff happens. If the mod has multiple wheels and tyres then they all need setting the same.
     
  18. Nibiru

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    All the object listed in the gen under the wheel and suspension entries need to be the same.
     
  19. Navigator

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    Thanks for all the help!
    I must be doing something wrong as it doesn't work.

    I'm a "physics guy" and since this was such an awesome mod, I wanted to publish it.
    But I havent been around the physics anymore for two weeks; just messing with the .gmt files at which I really suck.
    Have to ask a lot, even simple things and still cant get it to work.
    Not doing what I wanted to do, just getting my blood pressure up; this is not going in the right direction.

    I just leave it alone, best for the health ;)
     
  20. Nibiru

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    I think the latest versions of simed is screwing up the pivots. I just tested some things and its not working correctly.
    If you can go back and use v3.1f it should work
     

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