Breaking is very hard part to do for me. Watching AI drive around track. At each first turn from full speed. AI start break at 100-150 m billboard with 100% break pedal then control and apply (80-100%) downshifting from 5-4-3-2-1 very quick. For me I must apply break before AI plus 50-100 m at same speed. I can apply break 50-max 70%. If I apply break 100% same as AI wheel lock up car unstable and spin when rear wheel in grass. Question 1) AI apply threshold breaking ? Why AI apply break 100% first then control 80-100% without unstable car ? How do you know exactly that you reach that limit ? FFB tell you or something please explain. 2) How to break with H pattern gear box? 2.1) AI downshifting from 5-4-3-2-1 respectively. What's correct in real life between downshifting 5-4-3-2-1 respectively or downshifting 5-2-1 , 5-1 ? 2.2) AI finished downshifting before turn very quickly. If I downshifting like AI, rear wheel lock up car spin. I must apply light break to turn in and downshifting when car in turn. This is correct or mistake to do like this. 3) 1 year for rF2 is so amazing but breaking is still very hard. How do you practice this ? Thank you for your advice.
AI don't have the same physics (wouldn't be possible to run them realtime with your physics), but the way they drive is pretty realistic. Most racing cars use sequential gearboxes. Unless the gears are managed by software, they'll go 6-5-4-3-2-1, not 6..... 2-1. Anyway, a lot of what you're asking varies a little depending on car, but you can get some ideas from the profile pages: http://rfactor.net/web/rf2/cars/dallara-dw12-honda-and-chevrolet-indy-car/ http://rfactor.net/web/rf2/cars/marussia-cosworth-mr01/ http://rfactor.net/web/rf2/cars/chevrolet-corvette-c6-r/
Well that's exactly what will happen, don't put your wheels on the grass especially in breaking zones and also watch out for white lines on wet tracks you will very quickly be facing the wrong way. Also don't base your driving based on the AI's. Drive how YOU drive, speed and perfect braking spots will follow with practice not by trying to force it. Also remember braking the latest is not always the quickest way around the corner, simply making sure you brake, hit the apex with good drive off the corner will win you time over trying to pinch 10m in the braking zone. I've raced in a number of online leagues and even then I only use other drivers braking zones as a guide and find what fits my driving style. Also trying to brake as late as possible and bang down the gear box as quick as possible can and in many occasions have a negative effect on the car's balance, and will spit you off the track. You will need to practice and learn how the gearbox works for whatever the particular car your driving. I remember having troubles at first with the Ferrucio GTE on Sao Paulo in some corners with the car just breaking away from me at low/med speed, after looking back and going over my laps i found it was simply me trying to steal an extra gear down the box on corner entry with causing the whole balance to change/snap.
My favorite car is Skip2000, BT20 ,NSX with H pattern gearbox. I use paddle shift with these car because easy to drive now I can feel comfort to drive these car and would like the realistic so I try H pattern. AI Apply break + downshifting from 5-4-3-2-1 respectively before turn. What's correct in sim or real life between I downshifting 5-4-3-2-1 respectively or I downshifting 5 goto 2 or 1 before turn? Thank Tim for clear about AI physic.
Have you tried turning brakepressure down until wheel lock is more likeable? I have too on almost every car (using a old G25)
First turn of Sao Paulo is very amazing when I saw AI apply break. I would like to see and race with online racer but in my time (GMT+7) zero participant. I have breaking problem when I go to another sim such as Leaderboard challenge in R3E DTM, WTCC, GT. After try hard 2days and comeback to rF2 BTCC, Urd T5, GT I apply break very hard same as leaderboard challenge result car unstable and spin every corner need to tune driving style at lease 15 min to drive car in rF2. I don't know real life perform like this or not but I love this perform. It's very fun and challenge to drive compare to other sim. Thank RJames for sharing your advice
Here is a fantastic tutorial on braking. It's very old but it still applies I think: http://www.nogripracing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16021 (continued next post)
General advise: - move brake pedal more progressive: start low, then every milisecond harder until you notice it´s getting unstable, then release in a faster "curve" - set brake sensitivity in controller-settings lower! By the way: for some cars it´s not blasphemic to use ABS! (at "low" at least...) Some GT3 series at example uses ABS....
Does rfactor 2 use the same system for aids as assetto? Meaning that if a car has abc or tc, even if you turn off all assist you will still have those available if the real car have them?
No. Only active if you turn it really on with F8 (ABS) or F9 (TC). For both you have 3 steps: low, mid and strong.
Other little tips. The car will brake better once tyres and brakes have some temps. Check your brake balance, if one end is locking up more then move brake balance away from that end. Brake balance will also evolve over stint. In all cars as temps come in, real road too and tyre grip improves brake balance can go forwards. As wear occurs it would come rearwards again in a saloon but in a very light open wheeler the fuel load reduces a lot (rear) and it might actually go forwards a tiny bit. Check brake temps. Too cold or too hot will cost you braking performance. Your downshifts should only be limited by rear traction*. Downshift as fast as you can without locking the rears. The less rear camber the better the rears brake, fronts too actually but they are required to turn the car so need more camber). This will vary of course car to car. Play with you braking sensitivity in controller settings. In some lower performance cars use 100% in some high performance cars such as F1, FR 3.5 and LMP1 cars I use 65%. Find the limit and try to get a close to it as possible time after time. Know your braking markers. Move it closer to the corner a few metres at a time till it is too close. Ensure your (steering) wheel is dead straight when starting your braking. Ensure you use the rubbered line to brake. Do some laps where all you play with is braking.
The AI is a kind of automatism, not to compare to the driver physics. Unfortunately the braking is a guessing game, with the standard pedals and there fluctuating pressure point but the missed body accleceration and motion adds another disadvantage to it, and the software which don't cleary indicates max deceleration due to braking otherwise, makes the braking inaccurate at all, and the driver ends up with braking by chance, until it all becomes a sort of automatism as with the AI, in contrary to his usual practice of the reality. Ofc the better the hardware the better the feeling but the pedals and the ffb steering wheel alone, won't leave to the optimal braking, but a motion rig maybe can when it actually indicates load distribution and max deceleration with body motion, where the motion is in sync with the load distribution and virtual car body movements. So it may is possible to understand where the limit of max deceleration is before the tires lock up, but how it is with static equipment, standard pedals and just the ffb steering wheel and how the software mediates it to the driver is weak imho.
I don't know what exactly would be usefull or if any sort of feedback would help without to have the body movements, and i always find it hard to adapt to the static environment, especially when the pedals are everything put not realistic and dynamically connected with the software, the would controle the resistance, pressure, disc friction, fading, ABS, overheating fluid, overheating brake pads/discs, .....etc. The same goes for the static toy shifter, the don't simulate transmission dynamics. In my opinion the consumer software and hardware has still a long way to go, until it roughly simulates car controle.
Yes something like that is imaginable. The motion sys is something i'm not familiar with, but i think the forward and backward movement isn't a real problem to cover and simulate, everything else i have no idea how well it works or not with what is available to the consumer, but what i know is that it leaves a lot to be desired when it comes to controle units and the simulation of effects, such as the other example with the H-Shifter which just would need a ffb system with a e-motor on the central axis, the would generate a effect and wouldn't allow to shift when the transmission is out of sync, and or moves with engine/transmission movements.
Yes, i understand that the acceleration and deceleration can't be exact like the real world, especially when it just uses your body weight as base for G's while pitching the body left, right, for and backwards. There is no real acceleration and deceleration going on when it just tilts. The only way to do this would be to put the simulator on rails, the acclecerates and decelerates the whole simulator, but that even would have to pitch, otherwise it would need to have the power of the simulated car and lengths the car needs to stop generating G's on you body. This is longitidunal, the same it would need for lateral, where it has to move the whole construct, incl. the longitidunal rails, and that all becomes and sounds somewhat incredible, and it would still questionable if it would behave beliebvable. The shifter in the vid looks like just connected with the clutch pedal, what actually is a very simple sys, because it could be hardwired on the pedal directly, the would release the resistor at the shifter by a signal from the pot. I'm dreaming from a simulator based controle unit, the controles it by the physics.
Altough it could be easy to controle via software. The shifter just need to use a part of the ffb joystick tech with some modification to the mechanics, and electronics. The feature is already there and just needs some modification, as two pots detecting the x y axis of the shifter while the software would have to controle the resistors and effects. I was on the way to building one with a Logitech ffb joystick but stop that because i have no clue about programming as i don't know if the plugin sys of rf2 would allow to controle it, apart from the fact that i even have no idea how to use the plugin sys. The same tech could be used for the pedal simulation where it even would be more easy to controle, due to the movement in one direction. Maybe we are awaking some sleeping engineers.
How to do that? Brake later in the curve and be SUPER gentle and SUPER fast, how to achieve? practice a LOT.
