G29 FFB settings

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by GertjanD, Aug 19, 2020.

  1. GertjanD

    GertjanD Registered

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    Hi everyone, I have started SIM racing earlier this year and like RF2 a lot. This is my first post on this forum. I have been looking online for good FFB settings for my G29 wheel, but failed to find good settings specifically for smoothing and minimum torque. I know that the car spefic multi should not be too high with this wheel to avoid clipping. Currently I am using it between 0.75 and 0.85 depending on the car and track. After trying out some other games (ACC and iracing) i find the wheel to be very light in RF2. I feel little dampening. The other problem I experience is that it is very easy to get significant rattling of the wheel after you have braked a little too hard. I know you should avoid flat spotting etc, but currently it is too much for me. The smoothing settings I typically run are between 4 and 8. The minimum torque I vary between 5 and 10. What settings do you recommmend/use? Thank you very much in advance and great to be a member of this community.
     
  2. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Just to pick up something here, clipping isn't about the wheel. You'll have the same clipping on 1.0 as a 25Nm direct drive wheel will have, because it comes out of the game.

    The issue with weaker wheels is that avoiding clipping means reducing FFB. So if anything it may be better to run closer to 1.0 on wheels like the G29 to keep the force up a bit. It's a balance between force level and clipping, and it will vary a bit between cars and even setups (especially caster). Strong wheels have the luxury of reducing clipping while still producing high (in some cases, realistic) forces.

    Smoothing to reduce noise, up to around 10 if you feel the need, try to avoid higher. Lower is better. Try not to lock up the wheels ;)

    Minimum force around what you're already using, bit of personal preference there. I don't like feeling the "switch" around centre and kept it low, some like having lots of force at all times and run it high.
     
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  3. muz_j

    muz_j Registered

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    As mentioned there's a fair bit of personal preference involved. I use a G29 myself.
    My settings are almost definitely not perfect, but I've tested a few things and most of the tweaks came from this forum.

    I run the car specific FFB mult at 1.00 - perhaps higher than recommended,
    but I strongly suspect this will depend on the type of cars you are playing with. I tend towards endurance cars, prototypes and F1 cars.
    FFB smoothing I set to 8
    FFB min torque I set to 3.0%
    Steering sensitivity I crank up to 150% ( don't like having to turn the wheel much past 90 degrees - obviously this is down to personal preference)
    I think that's about it.

    >>> don't be afraid to experiment a little and find the right settings for you. it's all fine and well taking someone's recommendations, but don't be afraid to adjust things up or down a bit and find the right balance. As I said above - the cars that you're driving will factor into your wheel settings and I'm sure my own settings won't suit some people (and if I spent time on them, I could probably improve them).

    ...if you haven't checked it, you might want to confirm that the spring centering option in the Logitech LGS / G-Hub software is disabled. Some people run it the other way around, but most people I've seen, disable it - like I do.
    I can't recall what it defaults to with a fresh install, which is why I'm saying you might want to double check it.

    At least that gives you a rough guide and somewhere to start. Your existing settings sound like they're pretty close already.
    I think there was a configuration tweak I made too (from info on this forum). I'll try and double check that and edit this post if I find it.
     
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  4. muz_j

    muz_j Registered

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    I just checked my list of config files - the JSON controller files and I made an intentional edit to this setting at one stage in my G29 Json file

    "Steering torque filter":0,

    the controller JSON files are in this folder:
    \Steam\SteamApps\common\rFactor 2\UserData\Controller

    It looks like a setting to remove or disable a filter on the steering FFB.

    A search of the forum tells me I got that setting from this thread:
    https://forum.studio-397.com/index....actor-2-the-key-to-being-in-the-zone-d.42931/

    I can't find the exact page(s) in that thread and it's pretty long, but that's the only other change I've made (from memory).

    The JSON file has this comment for that setting:
    "Number of old samples to use to filter torque from vehicle's steering column (0-32, note that higher values increase effective latency)"
     
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  5. GertjanD

    GertjanD Registered

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    Thanks guys, really helpfull. Turning op the FFB multi has helped already. But it is a delicate balance, which can only be solved by buying a better wheel. I wonder whether a T300 is already much better (how much force does that one have?). @muz_j thanks for your suggestion to edit the JSON file. Do you know what it does? Did you notice a change and if so what?
     
  6. muz_j

    muz_j Registered

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    As stated in the JSON file and my previous reply - that setting controls the following:
    "Number of old samples to use to filter torque from vehicle's steering column (0-32, note that higher values increase effective latency)"

    Yes I did notice a difference, but I suspect it's not a big difference, but given it was a recommendation from multiple other people (I think I read the same thing on another forum too, but I can't be sure without doing a whole lot of random trawling of a various web-sites) and that I haven't rolled back the change (I create a new control configuration file each time I make a change to it, but suffixing a number to the end of it (in the rFactor 2 interface), which makes going back and checking the changes I have made over a period of time pretty easy - I run a text file comparison script over two files, which show me the differences), I obviously considered it an improvement.
    I made that change about a year ago and it's been in there since.

    If I remember and don't get distracted or side-tracked, I'll try & do a back to back test with it disabled (as it is now), versus whatever the previous value was and I'll tell you what I think.

    You could also easily do the same given it's a simple change that takes you a minute or two to make.

    >>> and ultimately at the end of the day - in terms of this thread and your steering wheel - my opinion is irrelevant.
    What is relevant is if you try the setting and decide you like it.
    Everyone's got an opinion...
     
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  7. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    That torque setting is just the smoothing isn't it? Sounds functionally equivalent, can't remember if we had it in the json prior to the UI. Anyway.

    @GertjanD The Logitech wheels are normally said to produce 2.2-2.5Nm, I think the T300 is around 4Nm. I have a T500 which is around 4.4Nm (there's always some variation in these figures) and the difference is certainly appreciable.

    As much as the power, these wheels are lighter and smoother which helps feel the FFB more.

    I think ~4Nm is a decent level for playing games without too much risk of hurting yourself or needing a proper rig, secured screens, etc. More pro and experienced drivers suggest 6-8Nm allows for better feeling in the corners, and I would aim to get there one day (maybe a 12-13Nm direct drive wheel, with a low FFB Mult to eliminate clipping) but everything needs to be a bit beefier at that point.

    Those slightly stronger wheels (T300 etc) also use belts instead of cogs, you can generally turn FFB smoothing off entirely without making big clattering noises. Apart from the ones the desk makes :p
     
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  8. muz_j

    muz_j Registered

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    I don't think so - but I could be wrong.
    I've just re-checked the UI and I can't see anything functionally equivalent in there and I distinctly remember browsing that FFB thread about getting it dialled (that I linked to) and having a really good look at it, then editing that setting afterwards.
    I went to the effort of updating my controller configuration and making sure I noted the change by incrementing my file name and the only difference I can find between those two files is that line.
    Given the description - it's changing the sampling rate for filtering torque input from steering and increasing the value increases input latency. So setting it to 0 would disable the feature and as a result - decrease steering latency.

    Are you suggesting there's a better way to configure it etc?
    Is it in the new UI ?
    (I reverted back to the old interface as I find there are a lot of things in the new UI that take me more clicks of the mouse to modify, which I would prefer not to do.)

    ...I think I'll try and find the exact comments in that thread, because I've noted it as being a G29 specific tweak and I recall there being an explanation, but I've struggled to re find it.
     
  9. muz_j

    muz_j Registered

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    I think what you're saying and what I'm just realising, is that config file setting is the effectively the same as the one labelled ""FFB Smoothing" in the UI and by setting it to zero, I suspect I have disabled that feature.

    I might spend a few minutes and test it (remove the configuration file change) and see how it feels as it's worth confirming.
    Either way, I'm happy with my settings as is, I'd just like to know if I could have just changed the UI setting instead of editing the file.

    >>> I've just rechecked it now and it's definitely the FFB filter setting from the UI.
    I'm not sure why I seem to have changed it back to 8 after setting it to 0 with the file edit, but there's a huge difference in steering feel and I'm pretty sure I prefer it disabled.
    I wasn't playing rFactor 2 for a while, so somewhere along the line between last november and earlier this year I have reverted back to using FFB smoothing without realising it.
    I'm going to have a bit more of a test with it - but at least that clarifies that those two settings are actually the same thing.

    Thanks @Lazza - I'm happy to learn & in this case, perhaps at some point I mistakenly thought the settings were for two different things due to the difference in the name.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2020
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  10. GertjanD

    GertjanD Registered

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    Interesting your discussion! I learn a lot. If my G29 gives up, I may move up to T300 or Fanatec CSL Elite. For sure no direct drives etc. I don't want a full rig at my home. What I do like is my 49 inch screen. That really improves immersion. Smoothing should indeed be as low as possible, but with the G29 you may get the horrible rattliing. I wonder if that damages the wheel in the longer term?
     
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  11. muz_j

    muz_j Registered

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    I don't quite understand how I reverted that setting after making the config file edit in the first place, but looking at my history of JSON files, it was on zero for a month, then went back to 8, which makes me think I experimented with it in the UI, not realising it was the same setting from the JSON file.
    I confirmed yesterday that the UI just changes that setting in the JSON file.
    setting it back to zero felt maybe a bit too heavy, in terms of steering feel, but it feels like it transmits more surface detail and you can feel the front wheels and weight transitions better.

    right now, I've backed it off to 4 - half way between the two and i'll use that for a day or two, or three and then adjust it again.
    I suspect it may end up set to 3 in the UI.

    I don't mind being wrong in the least - but I was puzzled to realise I'd mixed up the setting without realising it, then continued to play and thought it was one thing and it wasn't. I strongly suspect that the fact that I play multiple racing sims had an impact with it too, as I've gone off and played something else, left the game for a while, then come back and not realised I'd changed the FFB as much as I had.

    but it's a good learning experience and it's clarified that I don't need to bother with a file edit and both settings adjust the same feature - they just have different labels.
     
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  12. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    @muz_j there's also a good lesson generally there. People sometimes get very fixated on whether the FFB is correct, but FFB at the user is all about feeling - and feelings and perception can vary a lot between devices, people, and even recent experience.

    If you find settings that you're happy with (ie it feels 'about right' and you can feel what's happening) stick with them and drive. Trying to find the perfect settings turns into a rabbit hole of arguments, compromise, placebo, and less of what's really important: driving.
     
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