frustrating cut track penalties turbo mode

knackko

knackko

Registered
Hello,

About the system penalties for cutting the track, is it possible to avoid the several penalties distributions for the same driver in the same second that occurs sometimes after going outside the track ? This mechanism can reduce the interest of a race as the driver have to do S&G 3, 4 and more times (last week a driver get 7 cut penalties in one second) ! Ok an admin can avoid the penalties with cmd, but think that the admin want to drive also and it is not the work of the admin to prevent of game or tracks issues !

There is maybe an issue about the track but every track can not be tested. So I think that the game have to prevent from giving more than one penalty in an interval of time (1 or 2 seconds).
 
knackko said:
Hello,

About the system penalties for cutting the track, is it possible to avoid the several penalties distributions for the same driver in the same second that occurs sometimes after going outside the track ? This mechanism can reduce the interest of a race as the driver have to do S&G 3, 4 and more times (last week a driver get 7 cut penalties in one second) ! Ok an admin can avoid the penalties with cmd, but think that the admin want to drive also and it is not the work of the admin to prevent of game or tracks issues !

There is maybe an issue about the track but every track can not be tested. So I think that the game have to prevent from giving more than one penalty in an interval of time (1 or 2 seconds).
Click to expand...
On what track?
 
I suffered from this last race to. I spinned my car and in order to rejoin the track with safety, I cut the track, very slowly. The game punished me with 7 stop and go in the same second.

Could you fix that problem? I suppose that you can first limit the number of stop and go (If we cut the track, we should not take more than 1 stop and go). And in a second time, we should not take a penalty with a low speed. I am sure that with a fixed settings like that, we will have less issue in race...
 
David.V said:
I suffered from this last race to. I spinned my car and in order to rejoin the track with safety, I cut the track, very slowly. The game punished me with 7 stop and go in the same second.

Could you fix that problem? I suppose that you can first limit the number of stop and go (If we cut the track, we should not take more than 1 stop and go). And in a second time, we should not take a penalty with a low speed. I am sure that with a fixed settings like that, we will have less issue in race...
Click to expand...
What track did it happen on?
 
I can test on official track, but as said before, what will be the conclusion? :)

I got this issue a lot of time during a few races, and a lot of drivers got it. Penalty management is not optimum for me. When you have already a penalty, it should have a minimum delay before you get another one. And penalty should be not set under a minimum speed. May be you could think a customization system for this penalty, in order to activate it or not, etc... It will really improve the game if you think about it. rFactor 2 is a great simulation but this kind of bug is too recurrent...
 
You are on to something here, i wont deny that. However the game is set up to penalize (according to what the cut track is set) and also how the track is made, with a lack of the right term, there are more objects you can go over on modded track, which means it will penalize you for each object you "cut" (larger objects on the official tracks).
The admin or track modder could easily adjust the cut track though, but again i understand what you are saying. Though this is not a bug, it should be on the wishlist instead :)
 
Jimmi Allison said:
The admin or track modder could easily adjust the cut track though
Click to expand...
Can you explain how it can be easily done? It means that admins have to validate the track before each race, to do task+1 for admins ! :eek:
If it is to test cut tracks by driving, it is not an efficient and reliable way to do it.
I understand that it comes from track lacks, but the thing is to make confident admins and drivers in their race events. Remember that admins are not modders.
 
In one of my tracks, I had a cut track warning by going straight on the grass and nosing into a tirewall.
It's easy to always blame modders (the party line at S397), but here, if it's not a bug, it's a fault on the sim's logic on how to handle penalties. Because in my book, going straight into a wall on a 90° corner is NOT cutting nor gaining time.
Oh, and giving 7 penalties in one second IS a bug, not a feature.
 
knackko said:
Can you explain how it can be easily done? It means that admins have to validate the track before each race, to do task+1 for admins ! :eek:
If it is to test cut tracks by driving, it is not an efficient and reliable way to do it.
I understand that it comes from track lacks, but the thing is to make confident admins and drivers in their race events. Remember that admins are not modders.
Click to expand...
Yes its a task to edit cut tracks if they give a cut track, theres nothing to do about it, but as i have said you might be on to something about the logic behind it. But since im not a dev i cant comment on it, but make sure you post this in wishlist.
jpalesi said:
In one of my tracks, I had a cut track warning by going straight on the grass and nosing into a tirewall.
It's easy to always blame modders (the party line at S397), but here, if it's not a bug, it's a fault on the sim's logic on how to handle penalties. Because in my book, going straight into a wall on a 90° corner is NOT cutting nor gaining time.
Oh, and giving 7 penalties in one second IS a bug, not a feature.
Click to expand...
If you re-read my post i think i did not blame anyone i simply explained how it works.
Maybe the pitwall and grass was 2 different objects and you had a penalty for cutting the track for that? i think its safe to say it is not a bug - it does work as intended on the tracks S397 released, can this be adjusted and become better, yes im positive it can.
I have not tried your track, so i cant say whats wrong with it. However again lets put this on the wishlist instead.
 
Thanks Jimmi, I will add this in wishlist.

So there is a validation subject of 3rd party tracks which have to be discussed also, considering that:
- the error is human and the fact that modding is more and more complex, modders can make mistakes
- most of modders fix the issue of their tracks but they can do that if we find and notice them of issues ! ...
- ... sometimes, the modder of a track is not available to do fixes (that's life) and doesn't want any modification of his track by anyone else
- admins have to be confident in the track they put online for their events. They should know easily if a track meet the minimum quality

There is nobody to blame, just facts which show that something is missing to increase the events quality: test&validation, but not only, the validation status have to be shared to admins at least, it is mandatory to increase the 3rd party tracks quality.

How can it be done? with a check list. This check list should be shared to everyone but reviewed/edited by S397 and/or well known modders or admins. So for each checked point of the list, the final result is a public card of the track giving the OK/NOK for each point + the names of persons which made the test.

Who can do those tests?
Tests should be done by anybody with the required skills to do that, and I think that in modders and admins, we are some able to do that.
 
The best option remains to deactivate the anticut code and to use conventional systems, like sausages or gravel traps. You avoid problems like unwanted sanctions and ruined races.
 
Something like this should be in the tracks GDB file to tune cutting. That plus the AIW cut track stuff should fix most/all bugs.
Code: 
// Cut track penalty threshold adjusters, to help tune, check score.cpp in a +trace=3 trace.txt file

CutLeavingThresh = 1.02
CutJoiningThresh = 0.0
CutPassPenalty = 0.4
CutTimeRatioMax = 0.92
CutTimeRatioPenalty = 0.42
CutSecondsSaved = 1.0
CutWorstYawPenalty = 1.2
CutDirectionalPenalty = 1.0
CutWarningThresh = 1.201
CutStopGoThresh = 3.2
 
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