FFB, Steering Rack & Power Steering vs ACC (Nils Naujoks comment)

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by prceurope, Dec 4, 2020.

  1. prceurope

    prceurope Registered

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    Pro sim racer, Nils Naujoks, left this reply in a thread on his 911 GT3 hotlap of Imola (1m40):

    upload_2020-12-4_15-20-32.png

    YT link here:

    I am a newcomer to rF2, and I am wondering what he is referring to by: "you mean model it without considering the steering rack and power steering?"

    I have searched for these terms in conjunction with rF2 and I cannot find what he's referring to. To me, compared to rF2, ACC feels somewhat numb, especially when it comes to road feel, wheel oscillations, etc. How is the steering rack not modeled when I can feel hits to the wheels resulting in strong FFB movement of the steering?

    I'd appreciate a clarifying reply. Thank you!
     
  2. Comante

    Comante Registered

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    You should ask him honestly . But maybe someone who makes cars in RF2 could know what he means.
     
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  3. Eddy

    Eddy Member

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    Power steering and steering rack, but power steering most have a dampening effect on the forces that get to the wheel. Acc has overdone this dampening effect a bit some say, where rF2 is more rough and has almost none dampening effect. In the end it's all a matter of personal preference. But in both sims i have the ffb pretty much feeling like i like it and yes i still prefer rF2 feeling over acc. But overall both have their pro's and cons.
     
  4. Korva7

    Korva7 Registered

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    Not sure what effect steering rack simulation would have. Maybe non-linear steering? Modders should know if there is a parameter for that. I think power steering would have numbing effect on ffb and it's possible to numb out the steering with filttering. Imo it's better to not have that effect forced on players since in simracing we are lacking some of the feedback we would have in real life.
     
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  5. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Non-linear steering is definitely possible in rF2, but it's kind of impossible to know if that's what the person quoted in the first post meant (or part of it). I'd be interested to know as well, but there seems little point in trying to discuss it without the actual person involved.
     
  6. Largo LaGrande

    Largo LaGrande Registered

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    Hi there, im mechanic engineer.
    With the steering rack he means the reduction that is produced due to the differences of diameters between a) your wheel and the gear attached to your steering column and b) the gear attached to your steering column and the gear attached to the steering rack
    This reduction allows to reduce the torque you have to do in your wheel compared to the torque that your tyre needs. ( It is a question of Work, you do more travel in your wheel in order to reduce the torque)
    And with the power steering he means that a power steering system is going to help you when a bump tries to move your wheel in the same way that helps you when you try to turn your wheel.
    This said, this two factors are gonna reduce (much more reducing than dampening) the forces you feel in your wheel when your tyres are doing their thing in the road. But make them (the forces in your wheel) disappear is not realistic at all. When i hit a bump with my real car i can feel it in my wheel. Havent tested ac competizione a lot, but having a light feeling of the irregularities of the road while driving straight is legit, in my opinion of course.
     
  7. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    @Largo LaGrande rF2 handles both the gearing advantage between the pinion and rack, and a crude mechanical advantage (let's call it a form of power steering, without the complexity of an actual system) by allowing a change in the effective pinion diameter without affecting the rack motion relative to wheel rotation.

    That is, when modding if you change the steering ratio the strength of the FFB changes accordingly.

    This is why IMO there's no point in us guessing what he meant.
     
  8. Miquel Ramos

    Miquel Ramos Registered

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    I've tested a lot both sims. It's difficult to say exactly which is better. You have dampening options in ACC and Road effects multiplier. For me FFB is amazing, you should take account in ACC only drives GT3 or GT4 cars. There are a lot of factors to feel FFB, and the most important maybe are tyres and suspension

    rF2 also have an amazing FFB, specially with some open wheel cars you feel grip on the road and bumps in a wonderful way. Also you can change parameters like FFB smooth, so it's impossible to compare, only with same car in same track

    Then you have iRacing that doesn't feel road, kerbs... but there are cars where FFB is not bad. In general iRacing FFB is worst
     

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