Are motorcycles possible with the tyre system?

how about some flyable helicopters for the admins to watch the cars on multiplayer, ISI all ready worked on fly sims before this should go on the "wish thread"

 

If you have admins who are good chopper pilots. I can already see them crashing on the racetrack causing mayhem and destruction.
Honestly, I don't like the idea very much.

 

I love bikes. I used to live on the NorthWest 200 track.

I think we'd have to say that we never say never. I'd not thought much about it, but I think it would be cool if the engine were to officially support what needed supporting. I am sure that rF1 physics is 'fluffed' to some degree (although it looks as good as MS GP500, which is the last good bike sim I played).

 

If you thought dynamics of 4 wheeled vehicles was difficult, it's nothing compared to that of our 2 wheeled counterparts. I ran a wind tunnel test project for a prototype road bike about 15 years ago and just the aero side of things was a headache, I didn't even touch the dynamics which was thankfully left to some mathematical wizards in the team!

After I fell off a bike years ago and smashed my rib cage I decided to stay away from riding them myself so now just watch (and love!) motorcycle racing. How good was the Moto3 race at Le Mans last night?! Amazing!

 

Very!

 

Im suprised no one has ever done a wipeout style racing mod for rfactor, it was good fun back in the day on my playstation

 

I thought I had seen one?

 

Oh I must of missed it, any news on the matchmaker coming back online Tim cant get our servers back up

 

Jeremy posted to say it's related to the new update and that he is working on it.

 

Holy thread resurrection batman!

I have been giving a lot of thought recently to simulating a motorcycle and possible controller (as I have my bike sitting next to me).

A few things could be using current motorcycle parts to feed into the computer for a new controller axis. I am not sure how to do this yet, anyone have any ideas? Or pointing me in the right direction?

- Throttle using a cable system, pulling open a spring loaded mechanism to snap back. (obviously controlling the amount of fuel into the engine)
- Clutches and brakes working the same way.

So that is 3 axis already.

Measuring the turn of the front wheel with similar system used for pedals right now (or even the wheel).

I have even thought of how to transfer putting a foot down to an ingame instruction.

Feedback
That is the basics but none of that includes the feedback that would need to be given to the user.

Turn of the handlebars would need to be tight or loose dependent on what is going on with the bike.

The push up and down through the forks due to terrain.

There would need to be some feedback when pushing the forks from left to right.

I will need to make some sketches as I am not sure I am explaining my ideas very well

 

This things came first with carts:
How to do the weight transfer per human input?
On bikes this problem is raising.

How about designing a new controller that is able to transfer all these things to the sim?
Could be a challange!

 

weight transfer is a problem yes, not quite thought about that bit yet

As with most controllers we can put more input in where in the real world it would be harder or impossible.

So for example if there was a car crash, you see drivers take their hands off their wheel because of the torque. Our wheels will never produce that torque. It all has to be a compromise.

I bet if there was a controller for a motorbike that I would be able to throw that bike around much easier than I would in real life.

 

my best idea i came up with in mind would be a motorcycle handlebar mounted on top of a joystick. u can use the rotate function for the steering input where u turn the frontwheel with it and also use the x and y axis of the joystick for weight transfer. the next step would be to build a forcefeedback function of all this like a ffb controlled joystick for flightsims. so u would be able to feel everything.

 

Motorcycles are the only thing I can't adjust to in a simulation. The MotoGP console games have a fairly sophisticated steering and weight transfer control system but it just doesn't work for me. At low speeds especially, the model falls apart. I gave up after trying two versions.

 

Wow! This thread is still alive? I totally forgot about it. lol
I used to play MotoGp3 (or whatever it's called) on the PC...with a keyboard(!) once you get the hang of it, it can be quite fun actually.

 

Anyone have an experience of arduino?

I am planning on sketching out a motorbike controller... I have a few motorbike parts (and custom parts to make depending on how it interfaces with the computer) to sketch out a possible useable interface of a controller.

 

Woodee, I've spent last three years with motorbike "sims" and given much thought to it. I've also spent the last two years doing some trackdays on my Daytona 675 so I have a basic idea how real life racing feels (though I suck).

For sure "angle of front wheel or handlebar" is not a valid input method for steering. On the real bike, as you know, the actual change of angle is very little, a few cm at the bar ends if that.

What would come closer is a pressure sensitive handlebar, that at zero pressure HOLDS the wheel in a given angle. So you push left to tilt the bike left, you release pressure to stabilize the turn (the software keeps the signal "at angle"), you pull left to pick the bike up (counter steering).

Weight transfer and tuck-in could be done with some trackIR like solution, capturing where your head (and therefore your torso) is. Here again a problem is that you can't "hang off" a static bike replica because it lacks the centrifugal forces to stabilize the seat position.

So the closest approximation might be that handlebar, plus a footset (shifting/braking) and some head mounted or kinetic-style full body tracking which exagerates movements (like TIR does currently).

 

Yes I had that thought to.

Also, imagine the difference between motocross and road racing. In road racing you may not turn the handlebars an awful lot, but motocross might and it might need the foot down for stability.

May area of specialism (i'm a pure amateur) is speedway and turning the handle bar (although the other way) is pretty important

What I interested in at the moment is transferring the basics of the brakes, clutch and throttle to the computer with a similar feel as to the real thing. On a speedway bike as with many other bikes maybe, the throttle turns a quarter turn then snaps back on release (the spring in the carb). Also an analog clutch lever would need to be controlled. Where possible I could use cheap(ish) bike parts for some things, but also make others if I needed.

I still have yet to transfer all the ideas I have up in my head into 3D to get some idea on what I am dealing with, other people like yourself with first hand experience of bikes (forget sims up to this point for now) would be very useful.

 

I had made a drawing once, basically the base of the handle would be a sphere, to allow for forward and rearward motion to simulate the rider leaning back or forward. It'd also allow the handle to pivot in a more realistic way than just a central pivot point that is flat, that doesn't go with the bike lean. To simplify it, think of a Dyson vacuum that has that ball where it pivots around .
FFB would be the issue but it has to start somewhere, right? Just vibrating motors (two inside the ball) applying pressure to each side. It's better than just rumble effects!

Now about engine capability, I can't speak but I'd guess it's not able to simulate bike behavior. Tire certainly, but body and aero I don't think so. There's a reason why we don't really have PiBoSo's stuff overlapping into one game.

ps: ATVs and 3-4 wheelers partially don't count

 

Don't forget counter steering. If you made a bike controller, you will have to reverse the handlebar input. For those that don't know, on a bike, to turn left, you actually turn the front wheel to the right. Hence, counter-steering.