I own the Roccat Kaves too.They not so much heavey as some reviews said but the earcups are big so that its getting warm over the time. Edit: And they sounds very good !
5.1 for the win. My z5500 amp decodes 5.1 to work on my headphones. flashy soundcards are pretty useless since due to openal (vista/7) which kind of killed off creative's monopoly. It all depends on what your doing to use your system for, here is a list: Type | native output Audio CD | Stereo DVD | 5.1 Games | 5.1 Blueray | 5.1 Saying that stero is the ulimate is pretty werid. And due to the power of windows we can do this.
If you think soundcards are useless then you dont know what your talking about AT ALL lol. And about the stereo vs 5.1 thing, well I am a supporter of 5.1, but I also have to agree that 2 very good speakers in a 2.0 or 2.1 setup absolutely destroys a crappy 5.1 setup. I sold my logitech z-5500 after a week. You know the 5.1 system that everyone seems to have a hard-on over because they think having a huge sub and 500 watts means they have good speakers? ya that one, and I went back to my speakers from my panasonic mini system, the sound is 900 times more insane in everyway except the fact that I dont have surround telling me whats behind. Then when I hooked them up to my new soundcard, WOW that just brought the speakers up to a whole new level, same with my roccat kave headphones. You should seriously research "signal to noise ratio" "DAC" "Op-Amp" "total harmonic distortion" etc etc etc if you think aoundcards are useless today, it has nothing to even do with windows or any software in any way, its all hardware related. Those might be some geeky audiophole terms but trust me soundcards make a huge difference, maybe not in rfactor 2 im not sure how quality the sound engine is in terms of fidelity from its audio etc etc but anything with at least a decent sound engine you will notice a big difference. Battlefield bad company 2 sounds beyond insane. Blu rays just sound nuts. I watched Thor on my peice of crap Sony 5.1 blu ray home theatre in a box setup upstairs, it sounded good because well you naturally think that just because its surround and you put the volume high and you feel the bass booming, whatever any decent speakers can have high volume levels..... then I brought the movie downstairs on my quality stereo speakers matched up to my soundcard, WOWW!!! Thor was a different movie!! Every single freakin sound effect was being shot out of the speakers, sounds I didnt even hear up stairs, that big huge robot looking guy if youve seen the movie sounded 100 times crazier and wayyyyy more intense and powerfull on my quality speakers with soundcard, even at the same or much lower volume levels everything just sounds wayyyyyyyy more quality, sharp, intense, you also get WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY better sound seperation, etc
I have X-Fi titanium and DDT3500 Digital Decoder and Speakers 10 years old lovely sound and it mixes "anything"
Wow, thank you Nand. I see when someone knows what he's talking about and you do, so I listen. You're right. Gamers don't know about sound that much really. That's why I wanted someone's opinion who's "audio guy". So, I guess I can't do this cheap if I want quality. It seems I have to buy everything, soundcard included. I don't have the money right now so I'll do it over time.
Ok, spinelli seems to know his thing too. So I'm a little lost with this "fake surround" stuff. That turtle beach promo made perfect sense to me, you only need stereo to make real surround, even if it is "fake" or simulated, it seems to work logically thinking. After all, we have two ears only, it's all about the direction of the sound. If they can do it with stereo, why would I invest in 5.1 or 7.1?
The DDT3500 amp sounds better then " fake surround " because it has its "own decoder". I tried a few better cards with just 5.1 speakers and they were hopeless.
Research? Months? Let me give you a tip. Try years - decades - of actually BUYING what you are referring to, instead of trying to claim that browsing the internet (specifically gaming gear review sites) qualifies someone to know more about sound technology than anyone. Roccat Kave? JUNK. Just the next version of "the next new thing". A studio friend owns them (he bought them to test them out for his job - 5.1 reviewing - because they were so cheap), and I have used his. The bass response is pitiful (they dont even use a proper driver for freq under 100hz), and the included 4X40mm drivers are terrible (what do you expect from a company trying to make a profit on drivers they sell for under $12 each?) Anyhow, you mention sennheiser - and that's exactly what I referred him to - the cheapest ones. You didnt even read before you wrote "I can name 100 different denons, audio technicas, sennheisers, grados etc etc etc in that price range that are way better especially for games and movies that are way better than those mentioned." The internet is full to overflowing with experts - but reading gaming gear review sites will never make you a sound expert qualified to give advice "way better than those mentioned". stobe84: Just start with good stereo headphones. The Seinheisser HD 215 are awesome because of their full enclosure design (you "disappear" into the sound) - they keep out environmental noise without having to resort to sound-cancelling electronic trickery (which affects the sound).
Ear of the beholder, But really what you're after is the sound behind the system, this being a band, movie or program. 5.1 vs 2.0 is really is the beholder of the format you're listenng to. 5.1 is great for games where its good to know what is around you and also for movies. for music yeah 2.0. I can tell you're massively into your sound, I am myself are massively into computer systems with a little on the edge of sound. Its lossless vs mp3, some people are happy with it while some must have lostless. What i was saying that Microsoft pretty much killed Creative's hold on the soundcard market with openal due to the fact that Eax was made worthless. Which it was. now creative do software overlays to realtek chips.
lol I researched for many months on the cheap gimmicky gaming headsets as I wanted a "true" 5.1 pair of cans. Ive been into audio for years aswell, and like I said before real 2.0 or 2.1 sound systems will always destroy 5.1 setups of lower quality. I know the drivers in the roccat kaves are terrible compared to true quality phones, but for regular people who arent audiophiles trust me they wont just be happy with the kaves they will be blown away. Ive tried many different of the "cheap gimmicky" surround gaming headsets including the Earforce HPA2's, Logitech g35, tritton ax pro, pnes from razer and steelseries aswell, and if you were talking about all those only the roccat kaves are easily the best in my oppinion when it comes to sound quality. I get decent bass response, and to any normal person they will be BLOWN AWAY by the bass response. Your choices for some decent heaphones for $90-$200 are horrible for gamers. If the guy wants surround but we try to convince him to go with REAL heaphones with real quality drivers and forget about these gimmicky gaming headsets, then atleast recommend headphones that will excell in gaming and 3d positiong, like the audio technica ath-ad700 or the Beyerdynamic DT 770, those are some of the best pairs of cans you can get when it comes to gaming and using "virtual surround" with CMSS-3D or Dolby Headphone. The ad700s are a little lacking in bass to some peoples ears, but the mids are soo beautiful gamers will be picking out every sound in movies and games, itll just suck you into the game with its immersivness, HUGE soundstage, people will be hearing sounds they didnt even know existed. If your more concerned with gaming and 3d surround I wouldnt go with dj headphones, they tend to be boomy, thats a real genereal statement i know, but im trying to keep things simple here. Go with.... AT ad700 Beyer DT 770 or if you dont want to add a $10 clip on mic and you just have to have it built into the headphones then get the Senn pc350/pc360, but id honestly get the ad700s over those senns anyday. If you want to go higher than $200 I can recommend you more models like AKG 701, Beyer DT-880 which is one of the best pair of cans for gaming under $400 period, theres some real good ultrasone models, I can go on and on but please research the forums on the at-ad700the pretty much are THE cans when it comes to gaming, ans positional accuracy. Man you can find a pair of ad-700s for like $90-130ish and they blow away almost all other headphones even at much higher costs when it comes to 3d postional accuracy and soundstage. And yes I have tried most of these models and lots probably 100's of others out over the past i dont know 7 years or so. Also if your going to give the guy advice why are you telling him about $1200 studio monitors, I doubt a first time buyer is going to want to get a pair of studio monitors in the $1200 region. And by the way a full enclosure design does immerse you more in the sense that you dont hear any noise from outside, but for gaming and especially for "virtual surround" " soundstage, "a 3d feeling of depth and space/distance to the sound" etc etc you will notice that its the OPEN phones that are more often that not known to excel in that area. I thought this too but after tons of research I found out its not neccessrily true, im not going to go into details because I honestly dont understand how it works yet but ive read from a few very knowledgable people that any game that uses openAL can still have EAX effects and take advantage of the x-fi chip in that regards and also in regards to taking stress of the cpu. Im still not sure how it works though, the info is hard to come by as most people think x-fi is worthless now that the directsound API and EAX as we once knew it are "dead", but this is one of the most mis-understood things on ALL of pc audio from what I have apperently learned so far i would have to say. Ill try to find more info on it, as im really curious myself....
Well you have asus soundcards now. you never had that before. I have an onboard xfi chip but its a software overlay, still very nice. http://www.ebuyer.com/search?page=1&sort=popularity&limit=10&store=2&cat=148&filtermfr=148 they look pretty good too.
I use a X-FI titanium with sennheiser pc350's and the sound is really good. When I hook up my cheap creative 5.1 surround speakers the sound is crappy. A good sound system really improves immersion. I'm starting to think the ones who complain of the sound(I don't think the sound is mindblowing but good enough) have cheap speakers.
Spinelli, i have major issues with 5.1. It certainly has its place in Home cinema, but i have never been so happy as i am playing game sfrom a good quality good SNR soundcard (always creative for me) using nothing but 2 channel headphones. I have ALWAYS been able to tell when someone is behind me, it just works. And in the world of RF2 at this moment in time, headphones sound awesome (im using senheiser HD595 not cheap and a few years old now). Now my background is stereo, before i was into PCs in such a large way, i was a stereo perveyor! My current setup is around the £10k mark using Primare Pre and dual power amps - a fairly costly setup. I have massive Focal JM labs speakers and a couple of subwoofers one of which is an REL stadium (£1500). Now headphones will not give me the 12hz bass note of an REL, but its damn close from good headphones and its pinpoint sound directly off the back of a good creative card with high SNR is simply stunning. And where you state that good stereo trashes bad 5.1 is absoultely true. In my case, my £150 headphones actually trash a £10k stereo system! And yes i have full DTS5.1 within the same system but its simply awful in comparison. So for you guys seeking audio nirvana, and don't want to piss off your family, GO FOR HEADPHONES abd a quality creative card (Hardware only) but a really good set as you will be amazed by the depth of bass and the ability to pinpoiont sounds. Only buy into 5.1 headphnes if you can test them first and test them over extended period.
Yes I believe we agree on everything haha . I have to admit I am shocked that those phones as good as the hd595s are, blow your £10,000 system away,
I love my stereo don't get me wrong. But when you compare £160 with £10k then the £10k setup is a bit silly really. But to make good bass in a largeish room, it takes quite a setup. And when i say headphones blow away expensive setups i mean in gaming, not in CD replay for example. CD replay throught Cyrus 8X and PSX-R power supply is stunning!! PS. I don't use MP3's cos all but the highest sample rates suck!! And if you cant hear this difference then get some headphones )
Hi there! Oh, it´s all about sound, so I think I have to comment this too! First: I also can´t make my freedom with 5.1 (for music useless, for gaming I´m lacking of experiance). The major-problem with 5.1 speaker-systems is that people spend too little money (50-500 Euro) for 6 speakers! That MUST be crap! I even won´t spend that less money in a stereo pair! So, if you can´t spend thousands of bucks for good speakers, the solution should be headphones. But I can´t believe that a surround-headphone can work propably!? (am I wrong?) My opinion (and expierence): Get you a nice little Sennheiser or AKG in the mid-price-sector and you have a 1000% jump compared to ANY PC-speaker-system! Second: A good Soundcard is VERY necessery (for serious audio over PC)! I used a M-Audio Audiophile 2496 for many years, but with my new PC I needed an USB-device. So I got me a Creative X-Fi HD (not the 5.1!) and the result in quality is the same. Third: If you have a proper speaker system or good headphones you don´t want to hear ANY MP3´s anymore! (electronic music in 320 kb/s is more or less acceptable....) If you don´t hear the difference of Mp3 in comparison to a lossless-format then a) you have to go to the doctor to blast out your ears, or b) you need better speakers/ headphones and maybe soundcard. cheers Pete
