Leading modders in the community ... who are they?

So who are the modder/mod groups you consider are the leaders at present ?

For me, the likes of Enduracers are certainly on the list in addition to those mentioned already.

It seems to me there are alot of fun mods [read low fidelity] which is fine. I think some may get played more than others but some are 'experiments that got out of the lab' and do not get a lot of serious play time in the main.

On the other side, there but only a small number [single digits number] on high quality ones.

Paying a few bucks in principle seems to have some level of acceptance here [subject to working out the details naturally]. Put another way, the idea is not a complete No-No.


I regularly ask myself what the motivations of those leading modders are .. that they choose to do so much work and distribute such great work openly in the community. I guess they can only reply with the answers ... my opinions are just speculation.

I also ask myself what the biggest concerns and worries of the modders are? Again, not being a modder or dev myself, I don't really know.

I can speculate plagarism as a likely frustration given the community is an open one. There is the obvious environment that I could decide to effectively take other mod's work and use it myself, citing that it's a free and open community so i can do as I please.


I would like to support all modders who are taking our hobby forward. I value their contribution and a few beer tokens is an easy decision for the few mods I feel deserve it.

I feel that with rF2 comes a golden opportunity to achieve a renewed platform for the modder groups in our hobby.

If there ever was an opportunity for the leaders within the mod community to come together and develop a cooperation, surely now is the time.

An opportunity to spring the clean the shelves and categorize better all the existing stuff for example.

Note: I would not advocate dumping anything!!!!!!!!! Just organize it better.



The racing community get this stuff without having to put their hands in their wallets but we know that this stuff is not free so to speak ... it costs time effort, work and stress. That it's a passion is the motivation I suggest, but that it's your passion in no reason for me to treat it as a gimme either.

As racers, we all can choose to support the modding community that gift us such great work. We can feedback constructive criticism and reviews ... promote the best of the best and encourage the lesser stuff. We can choose to self regulate know plagiarized and abused content by highlighting it as not welcome. We can if we choose, send a message to the modders that we respect them, support them and want to protect them

 

For me Virtua_LM, CTDP, HistorX Mod Team, iDT Simulations, rFactorSeries with their Formula Nippon mods, and Team Players are who I consider the top mod groups of rFactor. I have not mentioned my group in those as that may make me sound big headed. Even though I feel quality wise we are worthy of that list, the amount of mods they have released compared to us at the current moment is why I consider them higher. They are the teams that make me and my group strive to be better. When we see how good they do their work, it makes us work harder to make our work better. Our F1 2007 mod got a lot of great runs back in the day, a lot of people loved the mod and we hope they will like our future mods too.

For us our motivation comes from our love and passion for motorsports and gaming. We love motorsports, some of us only follow one form of motorsports, others of us follow several or all. Our modelers generally look at what they like to model, what they'd like to see in a game, and we make mods based on what we love and enjoy, and hope that the community will share in that enjoyment. A lot of people have asked us why we're continuing to make our F1 2008 mod. Aside from the fact that we've done so much work on it that we don't want to see that time go wasted, we also love the 2008 season. Its the last season of the older style cars before 2009 brought the new version of the cars which I myself hate to be honest.

We are driven by the desire not only to create something great, but to also expand our knowledge and our skills in the various areas we work in. My modelers love to learn new methods of doing things and with every car they do that provides them with new challenges, they raise their knowledge and skills further. This works the same for texture artists, physic coders, sound composers. Watching the level rise and rise with each item completed is what makes it all the more worthwhile.

At the same time however. Many of us have to battle real life things. Jobs, school, family etc, we work on mods as we can and as time allows.

In regards to mod leaders getting together to categorize things better, that's wrong in my view. I don't see why there is such a problem for two mod groups to work on the same seasons individually. Both groups share a passion for that season and both groups want to create and show their interpretation of that season. I myself talk and co-operate with several mod teams. One of them being Virtua_LM and one of the main reasons we have never done a le mans or PTC style mod is because we respect their quality and experience in that category and don't feel we need to compete with them. They are more then capable of producing a great mod for the community.

Same with F1 2006 Mod. We decided to cancel ours which we announced because I felt CTDP was more then capable of producing the best quality F1 2006 Season as a mod and so we moved onto 2007. What did that get me? a bunch of flames and bashings from the community because we supposedly promised the mod and we didn't deliver.

One MAJOR!!! thing I have to make clear, and I emphasize the major is that no mod group, especially us, announce a mod with the intention to not deliver. We announce mods with the full intention to deliver but things occur that either delay the mod or force us to give up on it. Whether that thing is a key person leaving, or jobs and school getting in the way, for a mod group to abandon or not deliver a mod, its due to a very valid reason and the community needs to stop berating mod groups that fail to deliver. TRUST ME, Its more painful for them then it is for you.

My group has yet to deliver on some mods, others we have abandoned, very old ones. But it was never announced with the intention to be cancelled. As the saying goes "**** Happens" and we just get left with having to pick up the pieces.

For me the major issue as a mod group leader is the misunderstandings between mod group leaders caused by members of each group. As a leader, you like to make sure you keep your staff in check, but that's not always possible especially when everyone works remotely. Leaders need to learn how to talk to one another and resolve things peacefully so that hostilities don't arise and ruin relationships. By doing this, the situation can be resolved, the person/s involved can learn their lesson or be removed from the group depending on what they've done, and the two leaders can see that each has handled the situation in a logical manner that benefits both groups and keep the friendship alive.

We also need more groups helping each other. I understand why certain groups don't. Members can become attached with members of another group and decide to stay there, but there needs to be a level where we can work with each other and respect each other enough to not take each others staff.

The modding community has few quality modders left in it and it is our responsibility to help those who want to learn, to learn so that not only we can gain benefit from teaching them and having them help and work on our own projects, but also to benefit them in learning, and the community by allowing it to grow further with more capable modders.

I hope that rF2 can help mod groups become more united, if ego's can prevail, its not impossible for mod groups to colaborate and work together.

 

I think, at begining we have to say for our selfs what does 'high quality mods' mean. Or what we expect from modders work.

Modding groups you listed give a lot of effort to build mods - it's true. They products look great and even have HOF. But some of their mods (I mean cars) are quite off comparing to reality in physics area). Any one who is more experienced in physics will see huge issues in tires or suspension definitions, aero, inertia of separate parts etc

Expecting some answers I must say that I'm sure (from our experience), while all put values are real, there is no need to make some intentional tricks/changes in physics.

And there is a question: what do we want from modding groups? Just nice looking mods, or mods to be representing RL as close as possible.

best regards

 

Here's the thing though. You talk about physics being unrealistic. How do you know? have you driven the real car? This is a major problem in the community. Sim-racers who are fighting tooth and nail to say the physics done by a group are not realistic when they themselves have either not yet gotten their road license or have never driven that car let alone a race car.

A lot of gamers have become delusioned with game physics that they think slippy and slidey and a car feeling like its on ice is realistic where any driver and team can tell you its not. The fact is, without having a real driver beta test and give feedback, no one knows, and especially no one (except real racing drivers) in the community can talk about what is or isn't realistic.

 

No arguing of course. What I meant is. If anyone is qualified to tell a mod group what realism is, its a race driver who drives the car in question, not some sim-racer. The fact is, realism can never be simulated into a game or mod 100% There are just things in real life that cannot be simulated. Its not possible, and henceforth, I think the challenge should be more about making physics that relate to the majority of sim-racers rather then "supposed" realistic physics. I am sure that if the community has a mod with physics they love regardless if they are realistic or not, the fact that the physics appeal to the majority of sim-racers will make it one of the most popular mods. Realism is just a figment of sim-racers imagination. It won't ever exist in sim-racing 100%

 

Thanks for the replies so far.

As said, I am not a mod but I am both impressed and amazed by all the modders who work on this stuff and what I can benefit from. [and I mean all the modders frankly because to me as a racer, you are one group. perhaps, as a modder, I could identify more than one sub group but I cannot do that ... so I refer to you as one group].

I am sure that those with the skillset to build such mods have the maturity to have a conversation about delicate topics without allowing emotion and hysterics get in the way. They hopefully also have the judgement to recognize and not overly react to anyone with opinions that go in an extreme.

A public forum, such as this, is frankly not the place the try and delve into the finer details of subjective topics and they are not for this thread in any case.

Taking the subjective and highly explosive forum topic of "physics feel and realism" for example, Modders do and should continue to lead the way and remain confident in their judgement as far as I am concerned. Hell, you are already leading by build the mod in the first place. As I say, impressed and amazed.

Racers also have a responsibility to temper our expectations and our reactions and in some cases wise up to the reality that is rFactor community environment.

I feel a responsibility to show my gratitude and respect but not necessarily to lick ar$e or cow tow! If I have some constructive feedback, surely you want to know it. If it's serious enough for me, i'll find an appropriate way to pass it on.

So I feel annoyed when I see/hear/read poorly presented complaints or worse, arrogant bashing and attitude. I hope this is not having too lasting an effect.

I, in my opinion only here, think that the individual mod groups themselves are best left alone to do their thing. Who am I to instruct anything to anyone? I am absolutely not suggesting or inferring anything like controls or regulations or rules or police of whatever just in case that may in any have have been communicated in my Op.

I do however think that any interaction that exists between mod groups is a good thing and it should be encouraged as I've experience of the same in other fields [personal and professional]. I did not know to what extent this already happens of course and I learn that is does happen between some groups.

If there are fewer quality modders still in the community, that surely is a call to action for the remaining leaders within the mod community.

That is a very selfish but very honest comment from me at the end isn't it.

Thanks for sharing a little of the modding world with me. I appreciate it

 

i don't know if this topic is really usefull. but i take the opportunity to ask if somebody know if RacingLine Developements team is still alive ? they made their fantastic CART Factor mod and no news after this.

 

Personally I think modders have many reasons and motivations for doing what they do but it doesn't entitle them to immunity from a harsh critique, attention or anything else for that matter. If someone wants to put something up for public consumption that's their lookout, I don't see how it puts any obligations on anyone else.

If a modder is doing something for the gaming public at large the gaming public at large has every right to tell them what they think and if they aren't does it really matter what anyone thinks?

As for realism/feel, I fall in to the category that wants to know what a car's like, to try and master it no matter how awkward or difficult. Hell, I'd delight in a mod that simulated a car with a double-down clutch, tiller steering and lever brakes. For me the purpose of a recreation in a sim as much as to have fun is to drive a car that I never could in real life. There's space for fun mods too, of course, but if someone wants to, say, recreate cars from the 1950s if they drive like they have wings I reserve the right to be disappointed. Maybe sulk a little.

 

fanlebowski .... guess it depends on who you ask. It is for me ... but I would say that wouldn't I

Guineapiggy, it is fair enough what you say. They put it out there and they are big boys with their own eyes open and all that. And no where did I suggest we, the racers, can never feedback [good or bad] news to the modders !

I would say [and hope you agree] that HOW we choose to feedback our constructive criticism is important. Without showing an appreciation of the modders work, what should be a communication of a problem can become an insult or an abuse.

If modders love their challenge and their sense of achievement as reasons why they do what they do but they are going away from their hobby, we as racers should be sensitive to this and willing to try and help where we can. Afterall, the mod we get to enjoy is at stake here!

 

ORSM are my personal Heroes, their V8Supercar mods are amazing

 

When we released the Formula BMW mod there was a problem with one of the springs iirc, We had Tommy Milner testing it the whole way through dev as he had run that series the year before and even with the spring problem he was really impressed with the physics being very close the real thing. After release I remember certain community members arguing with him that he was talking ****e and that it couldn't possibly be right, so no matter what your experience of a car is there are always those who believe they know better.

I do wonder if rFactor had locked/hidden physics files so people couldn't see an error like that whether or not they would play the damn thing and enjoy it more without analysing it to a ridiculous degree.

 

International pro-modding ,the FSONE V2 is the best F1 mod for me

 

DRM modding groups DRM Revival mod is one of my all time favorites, can't believe it's not on the hall of fame list at Rfactor Central

 

For me:

-Armaroli...Reiza Studios

-V8 Unleashed...Team ORSM

-Touring Car Legends

-Historic GT&TC...HistorX Team

-VLN 2005...NLC Team Players

-Formula BMW...iDT Racing Simulations

-F1 1979...Grand prix Classics

-Enduracers...Enduracers Modding Team

-DRM...DRM Modding Team

-Toyota AE86N2 Club...Gonzo-kool/Batvill

-WRC Subaru....Stigg & Goibaka

-Tracks:

-All VLM Tracks--->best tracks for Rfactor without any doubt.

-Com8, Carrera 4, SLN, Madcowie....and many more.

 

RMT and their WSGT2 looks stunning. Without this mod my hype for rF2 wouldn't be the same.

 

Can't agree more Jethro.

Seen threads from a new released mod were people had pull the physics files apart looking for anything that looks out of place and before even driving it their back on the forum asking "why is it like this" rFactor want work exactly like real life. The physics in rF are not a perfect reproduction of real life and some things need to be altered to get the best possible feel out of the cars. In most cases if you build the physic to perfectly represent the cars suspension more so it can be un drivable in-game.

Formula BMW. Great mod. We use it at most LAN's we have. thanks jethro and team.

 

As a racer there are some mods I've stuck with and others I've not. I like that I can even go into the files and make some small changes to suit my own needs ... [e.g. FOV changes .. OK, hardly worthy of the term mod but it is a tweak!]

So I'd like to keep all the files open and accessible but I do fully appreciate why a discussion about hidden or locked files should be had.

Those of you who actually are modders will need to lead this one. Afterall, whether released freely or not, these mods are/were your babies to begin with.

Now I don't know how much of a problem for mod groups the above example really is but it is obviously there. I tend to skip the thread when folks with arrogant and rude posts come on thread.

On a positive not, there is usually a poster who calls in a reality check anyway.

I hope all the modders and groups don't get annoyed, disappointed and demotivated. I'm sure some do though!

If it's a widespread problem, then I'm sure the mod groups can choose to address it themselves. They are best positioned to understand the problem and devise answers. If it's not that big an issue [as in a certain amount of this comes with the territory so I can roll with it] then all the better.

As said, I really look forward to the next evolution of the mods they make and I don't want a few picky and out of touch folks ruining it for everyone. [there I go with my selfish attitude again ... ]

 

[there I go with my selfish attitude again ... ]

haha... no not at all. There's nothing selfish about it. We're looking forward to see the next generation mods and track whether we're in a mod group or not.

Though to correct you here, Those files that are being mentioned are a part of the mods themselves. Their not in the some areas you change the things you've mentioned. =Your-PLR file in user data. So the end user (You) would still have complete access to set FOV and many other things manually.