Would you pay for the laser scanned Nordschleife from rFPro for rF2?

I don't.

I just don't think it fits who we are very well. Gjon has always been keen to appeal as affordable. I've brought it up every-so-often, it just never feels right.

I should say, *I* would pay for a 'ring DLC for rF2. I guess what I am saying is that I don't want others to be expected to do the same.

Plus, I know what it takes to be competitive at the track in a sim. The only time I ever managed it was with GPL. I do find myself internally (not inside ISI, in my own mind) questioning whether many of those who ask for the track would ever get any real use out of it, compared to a shorter track (or, rather, 5+ shorter tracks that could be built within the same amount of man hours).

 

People not liking this track. blasphemy! repent!

 

I'm also from that strange crowd who doesn't drive Nords. Ever.

The actual racing today there are cars that have no major interest from me, and it's too much to learn enjoyably.

As a paid DLC idea, I think it might have had a point if it came up before the excellent 24h layout we now have. You're going to struggle selling a "Tourist" version now if there's an even better version around, even if not laser scanned.

 

People may think laserscan is fastest and more precise than standard. That's true and false at the same time;

Point cloud is not directly converted into visual 3D. This kind of data it's usually split into 2 different workflows. First is the point cloud being used as a reference into a 3D scene, where artists has to built everything from scratch, using standards low poly methods. Also, sometimes point clouds are not used at all for buildings and structures for various reasons. Main laser targets are the road+edges while other 3D assets are using rational mesh, where you have to quantize A LOT the level of chaos and non-linearity of a real world. This task it's much more complex and long than a standard workflow, especially if you want your mesh to be solved as much as possible similar to your P.C. reference.

Second is the point cloud being converted and/or used as a invisible flow of data to be sent to the tire/CP. There are several methods to do this, more or less advanced. rFPro use a point clouds terrain server which is the top in terms of precision and level of tire/terrain interaction. Others are using bump maps, or invisible dense mesh averaging the point cloud itself into something working at the available physics frequency, other a mix of canned effects and real 3D bumps...etc.

Said that, it's clear the point cloud itself it's not going to produce the same level of precision between different platforms...so the rip/porting option from another software it's not that clever, apart the visual aspect of the mesh (which is probably correct in terms of pure vertical alignment and cross-fall, still normalized between samples)...but as for bumps and surface roughness everything depends on the simulator software. A straight porting it's just moving a mesh between simulators, the real point cloud flow of data it's not in there.

 

And Gjon managed to do that I guess. When the first beta version of rFactor 2 was released (January 10th it was?), I immediately bought the lifetime version, because I knew how much time I would put into this, coming from rFactor 1 with a 5 digit number of hours spent in that one. To be honest, it feels quite weird to get updates (not just fixes, actual updates with new added stuff) for free years after its initial release ALONG with new, high quality content.

Looking at some other games and franchises, they release games of a single series on a yearly basis, at full price. Comparing those installments with their predecessors, you can quite often see only minor changes and additions. Some developers (especially those who got a big publisher standing behind them) are going overkill with DLCs, obviously cutting them from the original content for the final game just to make a bigger profit. Looking at rFactor 2's lifetime cycle, this can hardly be compared to said other examples. I am one of the people who is really against "day one DLC" because it really is a design to maximize profit, but in rFactor 2's case, like I said, it actually feels weird to get big updates and fresh high quality content for years.

Maybe it's because I'm getting older and see how expensive a lot of stuff is, on the other hand outsiders have no insight to ISI's financials of course.

TL;DR
I simply don't expect stuff to be released for free for years when I paid a one time fee. I don't like subscription based models, but after all, salaries have to be paid, licensing costs for the new content, servers...

 

I can understand how you feel. But ISI has been around a while, Gjon likes how things operate and actually, so do I. A lot of studios hire and fire per project and I hate that. There's so much money involved per project, and bankruptcy is way too common. I guess (this sounds corny) ISI is more of a family?

We probably have more streams of revenue than many companies, without investors that most rely on. You can actually google to find investors for companies a lot of the time and the numbers are shockingly large, often in the least successful products. ISI operates with no investors or debt (loans) and always has.

My main job, and what I was actually hired for, was management of a particular revenue stream. Everything else I do sort of fell into my lap. That's why I am often quiet here, depends on the workload, and this year I've put a little more effort into it and seen the benefits through January, so I've been quiet.

 

paid DLC for rfactor 2 from ISI or anyone else is not really going to happen unless rf2 is updated in some way to verify content
eg at point of launching a piece of regisitered DLC content it is online checked & certified as genuine paid for etc

of course only for the DLC that's registered & approved by ISI
(current content & unregistered DLC -like the sort that's currently available will be uneffected by this)

ISI could also take a small commission for each sale their time managing this
rf2 could become the hottest title to mod for

laser scanned content (not saying it has to be laser scanned) may start becoming available then,
ISI could even hold preordered purchases monies until the DLC is quality checked & available to download (from ISI )

at the moment the risk is to high for a comercial company to invest in content for rf2 as it will simply become shareware & to many users will be using it without paying, this addition could bring some seriously good quality content as rf2 could become a surpurb platform for the teams with know how ( & kit ) to produce & get paid for their work.

it's good for ISI , rf2 , the community , the mod teams

unless I'm missing something it's a no brainer

ps I'm not saying theres not already a growing amount of quality stuff now becoming available for rf2 but this additional system would surely promote more that otherwise would never have been seen ( & possibly a laser scanned track pack)

pps re.Nords ...why wouldn't who ever holds the rights to this mod not take some cash for registering it with ISI for official DLC ( after relevant conversion )

 

It's about having enough money. I doubt anyone would say no.

 

So where is the laserscanned version of Spa avaiable?

 

What's wrong with DJC and Tosch's Nordschleife? Those guys have made it with such high quality I don't really see any reason to look anywhere else

 

All around. Not teasing for illegal content. Once 3dSimed is able to open some game content, that's it.

 

So no league is using it, and there isn't any single video of it on Youtube, but it's all around. I see

 

So what you don't know doesn't exist? Hmmm...

Maybe you're using it and don't even know.

I present you 3d Lidar working in rF1, GTR2 and RaceON (aside Assetto Corsa, of course) Omg, maybe it's a delusion!

 

Absolutely nothing's wrong with that track. in fact, I applaud to these guys for their dedication and the track has come a long way. It's hardly the same track anymore from the GPL or rFactor 1 days, and the work really shows. I enjoy this track pretty much, yet still I would switch to a laser scanned version if it was available and if it was of high quality. Call me a freak, but for me, it is a difference simply knowing that the layout is accurate, even if you don't drive that track in real life on such a regular basis that you would gain a lot of experience from its laser scanned, virtual counterpart.

 

I have also opened it with 3dsimed, but that has nothing to do with what do you originally said. I never stated that it's not possible to convert, only that I've never seen it anywhere.

 

Believe me, there is. And that's not nice, because it creates a dilemma: if you block your content, there's no mod, if you unblock, they'll rip.

So this is pretty much that story of short blanket, you either cover your head or your feet. No way to have all.

 

There will always be conversions. The rest of the game's package is what will bring in the users and attention. There are many tracks converted to MotorX and GPBikes. The former is garbage, the latter has a small base and is in ever beta stage but they're two tiny fish that people don't "care" for and they don't provide the racing experience found here. Assetto provides a racing experience but the game is at a stage where the core is missing a few aspects but yes, tracks do get converted to it. Tracks also get converted to rF2. I'd love AC's Spa making its way here, or pC's Suzuka and Watkins but how often have we actually seen stock content that isn't F1 201X/Race 07/GTR2/GRID/GTL get converted?

 

+1

Bunch of whiners is all they are.

 

Hard to answer. I would pay for it because it's a one time thing, just like I would pay for a super-quality (physics) version of any track, not just Nords. But if there were many other tracks out with the same "uber" physical quality, and they were also being charged for, then probably not because it would just be way too much, they add up like crazy.

 

Yeah supporting you on it, in my case I'd pay a equal lifetime rF2 licence amount for a modern Le Mans lidar.