Workshop Discussion..continue here...
- Thread starter Woodee
- Start date
hexagramme
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+1
P.S.R.
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I believe the problem is that, as the modder understands, the quality of the mod is not representative of what rF2 is capable of and, in fact, is downright buggy when used with certain mods and thus is a poor reflection on rF2 which it shouldn't be....along with all the other reasons...
Woodee
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What's the difference? Steam workshop is basically a file sharing site for steam games, if you can't see that then you are deluded my friend
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hexagramme
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This is basically a no brainer.
Of course the original author should have a say whether his content goes on Steam or not.
I'm finding this whole situation quite bizarre.
So no matter what any modder says or does, his content will be put in the Workshop.
If he doesn't wish to do it himself for whatever reason, someone else will grab it out of his hands and do it for him, against his will.
Like I said.. Bizarre.
Of course the original author should have a say whether his content goes on Steam or not.
I'm finding this whole situation quite bizarre.
So no matter what any modder says or does, his content will be put in the Workshop.
If he doesn't wish to do it himself for whatever reason, someone else will grab it out of his hands and do it for him, against his will.
Like I said.. Bizarre.
lordpantsington
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The problem is that they had no right to redistribute someone else's work without permission.
Various musicians have released full length CD, for free, to download. While distributed freely, this does not mean anyone can reupload them to any filesharing site without legal consequences.
Woodee
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But what I am say is, these files are distributed on file sharing sites, in the public domain. Many times there is no author or licence information. Of this is so then that file can be distributed wherever and however.
If the track is released and has licence information (for example, creative commons), then that should be respected. Plus of course if the author didn't attach licence information they can ask for it to be taken down from wherever it is shared. But, the sharer is under no legal obligation to do so, common decency should dictate that they should.
Now the problem with work in progress tracks/cars etc and the author being worried about their content reaching a too wider audience too soon, they should consider a private beta until they feel more comfortable sharing their content with the internet (flaming torches and pitch forks at the ready).
Bare in mind the golden rule of the internet, once something is out up on the net, it is very hard to control where it goes and how. People will distribute even if they are told not to.
Make sense?
MapleHamwich
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Nope, because its circular logic. You're saying because something is released on the internet it's going to be spread without proper permission so you're spreading it without proper permission to try and help the author.
P.S.R.
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[not-WIP] Atlantic Road
Sad to report I've lost interest in defending anything anymore ; especially after the pussy attitude of some devs letting others brazenly rip their content while simultaneously and openly mocking their software as well as their ability to stop the ripping in the most disrespectful and public manner.
To add to this, modders release crap while other modders never finish a project yet others defer to their decade long development efforts only to realize that the modder will never release the track because he never has released a track yet starts five more projects.
Sad to report I've lost interest in defending anything anymore ; especially after the pussy attitude of some devs letting others brazenly rip their content while simultaneously and openly mocking their software as well as their ability to stop the ripping in the most disrespectful and public manner.
To add to this, modders release crap while other modders never finish a project yet others defer to their decade long development efforts only to realize that the modder will never release the track because he never has released a track yet starts five more projects.
Woodee
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I'm not saying I have released this track on Steam btw. I am just talking hypothetically. Also I have experience of how some users treat files on the internet... call me cynical if you wish, but **** happens!
I have personally put 2 mods on Steam workshop and have taken no credit for their production. I have explicitly stated that if the authors do not want them shared (not sure why they wouldn't as it's the same as me emailing my buddies a public link to the mod anyway). I haven't changed the structure of the mod, or repackaged it.
Woodee
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Putting things on Steam workshop is not ripping anything. It is just sharing an already publicly available mod, to another community.
Miro
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If you haven't made it don't touch it. Very simple, really idiot proof. If you haven't done it is not up to you to host it on a place like workshop.
And if you get asked by the dude who has made it to take it down, you simply do so without when and if.
**** happens is not an argument bc people get punched in the face isn't either.
At least have the decency to let the people who create conntent of any kind for you at least get the credit they deserve and allow them please to decide themself if they want to upload the 1000's of workhours, which they share with you anyways if you get to the point that you can use it allready, or not.
It really ain't hard to understand. If you haven't created it do not freakin touch it. It is not your work and it is not up to you to decide what happens with it.
No wonder nobody bothers to do anything anymore if you get me.
There is no argument in the world that actually gives you the right to do so. Everything you pick on are excuses.
But if you really really think you have to upload something yourself then go ahead and create something that is worth an upload.
My 2c
EDIT: As good as it is meant by the people who think they do the community a favour with uploading the conntent on workshop they haven't created, it actually does cause the opposite long term if you ask me.
And if you get asked by the dude who has made it to take it down, you simply do so without when and if.
**** happens is not an argument bc people get punched in the face isn't either.
At least have the decency to let the people who create conntent of any kind for you at least get the credit they deserve and allow them please to decide themself if they want to upload the 1000's of workhours, which they share with you anyways if you get to the point that you can use it allready, or not.
It really ain't hard to understand. If you haven't created it do not freakin touch it. It is not your work and it is not up to you to decide what happens with it.
No wonder nobody bothers to do anything anymore if you get me.
There is no argument in the world that actually gives you the right to do so. Everything you pick on are excuses.
But if you really really think you have to upload something yourself then go ahead and create something that is worth an upload.
My 2c
EDIT: As good as it is meant by the people who think they do the community a favour with uploading the conntent on workshop they haven't created, it actually does cause the opposite long term if you ask me.
Euskotracks
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It is all about respect. Something you clearly miss to have.
You are comparing hosting on the official steam site to hosting in a regular forum. Steam workshop should be for the authors to upload.
We are still waiting for all your fantastic tracks to come yet.
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Tuttle
Technical Art Director - Env Lead
For sure it is not ripping but it's just messing around with someone else product.... (just think about clones, updates, etc..) The Author has to keep the control on his product and its distribution. Easy to understand.
Woodee
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So if someone makes some content, I can't post that link anywhere else to open that up to another audience that the author didn't intend?
How about the person screaming about no content being put on third party mod section?
There are some that mirror downloads to, are they bad?
I think some of you are misunderstanding me about links in the public domain. Do you agree that if some one wanted to do anything with content downloaded from a PUBLIC link, then they can?
There are these people on the internet, shock horror, hold the front page!
Those attacking me personally because they are clearly misunderstanding what I am saying or disagree with it, get a life.
Many of these mods are distributed without author info embedded in the mod information or author distribution licence.
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hexagramme
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Exactly.
There are some very good intentions behind this I feel (a wish that the Workshop is stock full of content mere weeks after rF2 Steam release).
But the execution of this leaves a lot to be desired.
And in the case of Atlantic Road, yes, taking it out of the modder's hands is probably more harmful than good.
Shiet explicitly stated that if the track was not taken down from Steam, he would stop working on it.
And yet the uploader ignores his wishes and goes off on a tangent about "Steam snobbery", "elitism" and whatnot.
What baffles me is the kind of ultimatum that was given to him by the uploader, where no matter what, he would be forced to have the track on Steam, whether he liked it or not.
"You're free to upload it yourself, but until you do, the current track stays" kind of nonsense.
lordpantsington
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http://store.steampowered.com/online_conduct
https://steamcommunity.com/dmca/create/
If your IP was uploaded without consent, use the dmca to get it removed. Personally, I would also flag the user that uploaded the workshop content for violation of Steam Online Conduct.
Generally, posting the link to the page on which a download is located is accepted. Hotlinking directly to the file is not.
Non-authorized mirror download locations have always been bad.
No they can't do anything they want with content freely distributed.
It doesn't matter if there is or isn't author/license info, you still cannot redistribute/reupload without authorization.
https://steamcommunity.com/dmca/create/
If your IP was uploaded without consent, use the dmca to get it removed. Personally, I would also flag the user that uploaded the workshop content for violation of Steam Online Conduct.
Generally, posting the link to the page on which a download is located is accepted. Hotlinking directly to the file is not.
Non-authorized mirror download locations have always been bad.
No they can't do anything they want with content freely distributed.
It doesn't matter if there is or isn't author/license info, you still cannot redistribute/reupload without authorization.
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Euskotracks
Registered
You will not:
Upload, or otherwise make available, files that contain images, photographs, software or other material protected by intellectual property laws, including, by way of example, and not as limitation, copyright or trademark laws (or by rights of privacy or publicity) unless you own or control the rights thereto or have received all necessary consents to do the same.
It is you who is not understanding that steam is an official server. It is not your website.
As a track modder I don't care if someone puts the download links in his hosting site. But let me and other authors maintain the official sites which are:
- isiforums
- remote content
- steam workshop.
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Tuttle
Technical Art Director - Env Lead
Also, don't forget at the time you are uploading a Workshop contribution you signed a contract with Valve about the usage of that User Generated Content by Steam/Valve (in our case, a mod). This means you are infringing both author rights and the Valve Steam Subscriber Agreement. In other words, at the time you are uploading a contribution you are telling Valve you are the author or you have all rights to re-distribute that contribution.