Who's getting VR?

VR: are you in, out or somewhere in between?

  • Pre-ordered Oculus Rift

    Votes: 36 20.8%

  • Pre-ordered HTC Vive

    Votes: 7 4.0%

  • Pre-ordered both Rift and Vive

    Votes: 5 2.9%

  • Will buy VR when rF2 supports it

    Votes: 25 14.5%

  • Need to upgrade my PC first, but will get VR when I can

    Votes: 7 4.0%

  • Not interested in VR

    Votes: 23 13.3%

  • I've tried VR and it is not for me

    Votes: 2 1.2%

  • I've not tried VR but I think it is not for me

    Votes: 6 3.5%

  • Will wait until it is cheaper for VR/upgrades needed

    Votes: 22 12.7%

  • Will wait until VR tech is more developed

    Votes: 30 17.3%

  • I have concerns about the health implications of VR use

    Votes: 10 5.8%
  • Total voters
    173
wgeuze said:
Tried it, liked it as a gimmic, drove rF2 with it, didn't like it. Not for me.
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If you tried VR with rF2 (3d rendering via 3rd party application and tracking via plugin or 3rd party application) you should NOT use that as measurement because it's not a native VR implementation and far from good!
additionally native VR implementations in 2016 will have really high standards.
 
75 votes till now, and we have to be fair. It looks like ISI has made the right choice by not jumping into VR support right now. Not even with their already paid customers.

BTW good thread Hectari ;)
 
DrR1pper said:
So long as you remember to eat, drink and sleep every now and again, you should be fine. :)
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Not so fast http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.p...ke-iRacing-did?p=415925&viewfull=1#post415925

In order to understand some of the potential problems with VR, it’s important to appreciate the biological mechanisms at work when you view a stereoscopic image.

Looking at any stereoscopic display is counterintuitive. That’s because there are two mechanisms at work when you look at something in the real world, and these need to follow different rules for VR.

In the real world, our eyes work to both focus and converge on a point in space when we look toward it — it’s a natural reflex called the accommodation-convergence reflex.

“The distance you need to converge your eyes to and the distance you need to focus your eyes to are the same distance,” explained Marty Banks, professor of optometry, vision science, psychology, and neuroscience at UC Berkeley in a phone call. “The brain has coupled these two response together — that’s why it’s called vergence-accommodation coupling. It makes total sense in the world we live in.”

Oculus Rift is heading to the mainstream soon, thanks to massive financial backing from Facebook.

With VR, though, our eyes always focus on a fixed point while trying to converge or diverge toward objects that can appear either nearby or distant. This mismatch is known as the vergence-accommodation conflict, and it’s the reason many people experience visual discomfort when using a VR.

“We believe the brain has to fight against its normal coupling to handle that problem, and that makes some people uncomfortable,” said Banks. “That makes some people’s eyes tired. There are even some cases where it makes people nauseous; it gives them a headache.”

Banks told me about claims — largely unfounded so far, in his opinion — that people might experience long-lasting changes in the coupling between vergence and accommodation due to VR headsets. “I don’t believe that,” he said.

“Those couplings are fairly plastic. You can learn to change those relationships. The one you have naturally, I think you’ll just go back to that when you take the headset off and look around the room and give your eyes a second to adjust.”

But our experience of VR so far hasn’t included sustained use of HMDs for extended periods of time, especially by a large community. We’re heading into unknown territory, and even experts like Banks can’t be sure what we’ll find.

“Whenever you introduce something that is new that people might be using for a long period of time, obviously you should be on the lookout for potential problems,” said Banks. “That’s just being sensible.”

I asked whether using VR systems for long periods of time could result in long-term vergence-accommodation problems.

“Well, we don’t really know,” he said. “I don’t think there’s a smoking gun out there, but what we don’t know is long-term use — let’s say 12 hours a day — would that have any long-term effect? I doubt it, but I can’t prove that to you scientifically.

“I think that’s something we want to keep an eye on.”

Development builds of Oculus Rift have been around since late 2012, and early adopters have already reported ocular problems with extended use. While these reports aren’t especially widespread, they’re enough to raise concerns.

Reddit user Abore reported persistent eye after using the Oculus headset. “My left eye has been giving me **** due to the Rift,” he said. “Specifically the muscles behind it. Definitely eye strain and it persists hours after I take the Rift off. I’m taking a week off to let it recover.”

And Lee Hutchinson of Ars Technica noted sustained visual effects after long sessions playing Elite: Dangerous on Oculus Rift’s DK2 build.

“I can still faintly see this grid right now when I squeeze my eyes shut, in spite of the fact that I’ve had a solid night’s sleep. It’s superimposed over the usual retina noise I get when I close my eyes—or perhaps it’s better to say that it’s a very prominent part of the noise.”

Newer versions of the Oculus headset have a higher resolution display, but this is still an interesting side-effect of sustained use. I asked Marty Banks about it, but he couldn’t nail down what the cause could have been.

“You could get an after-image,” he said, “but when you get an after-image and then look out at an illuminated world they usually go away within a few seconds to, at most, a minute or so. That sounds — if it persisted longer than a few minutes — that it’s not an after image. That strikes me as odd — I’ve never seen that myself.

“I’m sure he’s not making it up, but I don’t have a bucket to put that in.”

Oculus is already aware that using VR can cause problems with hand-eye coordination, and it warns Oculus Rift users about potentially dangerous symptoms of VR use.

“Do not drive, operate machinery, or engage in other visually or physically demanding activities that have potentially serious consequences — or other activities that require unimpaired balance and hand-eye coordination — until you have fully recovered from any symptoms,” reads the health and safety warning.

Albert “Skip” Rizzo — a long-time virtual reality expert and the director of the University of Southern California’s medical virtual reality department — explained that potential hand-eye coordination problems are likely linked something called past-pointing. It’s a perceptual phenomena where people fail to point accurately to an object in space, first described by ophthalmology pioneer Albrecht von Graefe. It’s traditionally seen in patients with strabismus (or “crossed eyes”) caused by muscle paralysis but also in pilots who’ve been using flight simulators.

“If you’re in a simulation, your brain adapts to the constraints of that simulation,” explained Rizzo. “If you do if for a long time, immediately you get out of the simulation, for a brief period of time, your brain has to re-adapt. If you reach for something you may reach past it because VR may affect your perception of objects at a distance.”

Past-pointing can significantly affect you ability to carry out everyday tasks. Rizzo explained that he always takes care with participants in his VR studies, even arranging cab rides for participants, rather than letting them drive home.

People using VR headsets at home won’t have anyone looking over their shoulder and watching out for them. There won’t be anyone to stop them jumping in the car and driving down the highway after a long gaming session, and that’s something they really shouldn’t be doing.

Despite the potential dangers, though, Rizzo says that the disorienting effects of VR are only short term.

“Do I think it’s long-term? Do I think it’s something that changes people for hours on end?” he asked. “No way!”

Interestingly, Oculus particularly advises against children aged 13 and over using the system for prolonged periods of time, saying it could “negatively impact hand-eye coordination, balance, and multi-tasking ability.”

Rizzo is pretty sure why this additional warning is in place, though. “I certainly think they’re covering themselves,” he told me over the phone, “as any companies making these devices would be smart to do.”
Click to expand...
http://venturebeat.com/2015/04/18/w...-what-vr-is-doing-to-our-eyes-and-our-brains/
 
Eddy said:
75 votes till now, and we have to be fair. It looks like ISI has made the right choice by not jumping into VR support right now. Not even with their already paid customers.

BTW good thread Hectari ;)
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If we count the 5 votes as "pro vr" ur on 40 % for vr. 40 % is as big as u can get for vr lol. Tell me one feature which would get 40 % in a vote what isi can offer ? I think u have no idea how vote results count. example make a vote for tracks comming to a dlc. 40 % would maybe the nordschleife as the biggest map on simrace... And in this 40 % are only rf 2 user who allready have it not new members to come from vr to simrace.
 
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Sorry but that is posturing from someone committed to it, professors getting a fat enevlope.

“Do I think it’s long-term? Do I think it’s something that changes people for hours on end?” he asked. “No way!”
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lol " No Way " wtf does that mean in science ....huh. ?

Any intelligent reasonable person would say until a conclusive study is done in the future you simply do not know ?

By definition prolonged long term use means just that, a decade and beyond, not a few years.


P.S. Look at what we have learned about mobile phones in almost 50 years.

Don't put them in a bum bag covering your balls. ! lol ;)
 
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Eddy said:
75 votes till now, and we have to be fair. It looks like ISI has made the right choice by not jumping into VR support right now. Not even with their already paid customers.

BTW good thread Hectari ;)
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The thing is, getting a sim like RF2 in the Oculus Store would get a lot more exposure than in an overloaded marketplace like steam. VR early adopters will be starving for content and I think whatever it costs to ISI to implement VR, would be recouped fast due to this. It's not just about who would currently use it, but also about bringing the sim to more people. I thought that was one of the reasons to come out on Steam in the first place
 
Kokomo said:
VR early adopters will be starving for content and I think whatever it costs to ISI to implement VR, would be recouped fast due to this.
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I agree 100%.

Regardless, for the ~30% of us who are pro-VR, we will hopefully be supported by the community since it sounds like ISI isn't interested in being a front runner with this tech.

 
At this point it's obvious we will just have to wait, sit back and see the show. Things will sort themselves out at some point. I don't know exactly how long it will take, but when we start getting reports of people doing well in leagues using VR, the skeptics will start wondering if that's why they are losing, therefore trying it, therefore going for it. It may be on gen 2 or gen 3 but it will happen
 
Kokomo said:
............ but when we start getting reports of people doing well in leagues using VR, the skeptics will start wondering if that's why they are losing, therefore trying it, therefore going for it. It may be on gen 2 or gen 3 but it will happen
Click to expand...


I would look for same reports from top shooter teams. ;)
 
DurgeDriven said:
+1

I think if VR cost $100 most would buy it, health implications or not.

I mean we still smoke, drink, eat fast food, processed meats and speed ( as in kph)

lol ;)
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For sure most people would buy if it was cheaper. And then there would be more test samples to me lol
IMO you don't even need to be a specialist to consider something will go wrong with VR use in long term. I'll be happy if I'm proven wrong, but I'm waiting some years before recognizing that, maybe a decade. I'll also be a happy person for not using it if I'm right :D
 
Kokomo said:
The thing is, getting a sim like RF2 in the Oculus Store would get a lot more exposure than in an overloaded marketplace like steam. VR early adopters will be starving for content and I think whatever it costs to ISI to implement VR, would be recouped fast due to this. It's not just about who would currently use it, but also about bringing the sim to more people. I thought that was one of the reasons to come out on Steam in the first place
Click to expand...

MIGHT get exposure.

If it's anything like steam.... rFactor/iRacing/Assetto Corsa are all under the racing heading which is VERY full. There is no separate category for Racing Sim. But if you know what you are looking for, you will find it.

I think the main advantage might be, compared to how many titles there are on steam, there won't be as many that are "VR games". Things easier to find.

Now depending on whether they have their storefront working right, to periodically show content that you might be interested in... then a few people could take a punt.

I also thought they were going to try using a demo feature (right there and then) to check if the game is comfortable for you in VR mode. Refund policies like Steam's 2 hour restriction, probably gives the user enough time to find this out.
 
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