UnitedRacingDesing presents...

Just because you have built something from scratch it doesn't mean you haven't copied a design. It seems to me you were inspired to replicate a BMW M3 DTM minus the badge, there are some slight differences but it is too similar to say that you did not create it to be perceived as the real thing.

I'm not commenting on the legality of it, that's not for me to judge. I am also not saying whether it is right or wrong.

A little more restraint and professionalism on your part will be more beneficial. A lot gets lost in text and can easily be misinterpreted, just open your mind to take on board anything that can be turned into a positive to aid your project.

Opinions are like farts, everyone has them, some keep them to themselves, some share them only with loved ones and then there are people who fart in lifts. If you are in a lift and someone farts, you can breathe it in and annoy yourself for the reasons you may assume they have done it. Hold your breath if you like, but there is no escaping until you reach your destination. You can laugh it off or let it upset you. Everyone loves their own brand, it might be exactly the same or very similar as someone elses but it doesn't mean you will like it(or have copied it ).

 

@Hectari and youre right.

"A little more restraint and professionalism on your part will be more beneficial." about that its true, i could but im not allways the best in talking but i do try my best and in polite way.

 

I'm not so sure about this idea. If selling mods takes off for rF2, eventually (for this and other games in the future) it will have a direct effect on the success or failure of the actual base software.
Look, if people consider buying this game but believe that future mods are going to cost them extra, it may well put them off, reducing sales of the base game, and killing its chances. I'm not sure anyone has the right to charge for their mod if they are affecting the success of the very game they are riding on the back of. Take it a step further - maybe they should purchase a licence to sell their mod, direct from ISI? Then there would be no issue.

 

It has been done for years in flight simming.

Actually the quality of payware mods advanced the reputation of flight sims by far.
At the same time, there were tons of freeware stuff, some of them with lower, similar, or better quality as payware.
Payware and freeware coexist happily, one can choose what he wants and both add to the reputation of sim (Im talking particularly of Ms FSX).

While I admire modders dedication to freeware stuff, I also respect somebodys wish to earn his living doing his hobby at the same time (if he succeeds selling it that is).
As for licencing from auto companies, that looks like a good reason freeware stuff will always be needed, to provide us with Ferraris with the horse on them
But lets face it. Freeware modders cannot produce mods at a steady rythm, eventually real life gets its toll and I have great respect for them, for this reason too.

I do remember Targa project at GPL, taking years to complete by the time the particular sim was close to obsolete and Isle of Mans project never been complete. Heroic people, but so long waiting is sometimes pointless.

 

And I've paid to fly a Spitfire and a B-17 around. Interesting, huh?

This bit isn't to you, but to the topic:
I think people need to look at paid mods as an OPTION to be welcomed. People are still going to do free ones, you know they are. But, imagine the perfect scenario, if you will... Someone sets up a kickstarter, someone trusted who has released good quality content before, and they say they'll build something YOU want, get licensing for it too. Are you seriously saying if YOU wanted it, and the guy had gone to the trouble of licensing it, etc, that you wouldn't be happy with your pledge? I distinctly remember people in a thread here offering ISI hundreds for certain tracks "I'd pay.... for ...." is a common post! The community can do this, and the community could take it. And if not? Well, as someone said above, maybe this is just history repeating itself, it isn't the first time someone tried this.

 

But these paid for mods wont be anywhere near enough for any mod team to survive on so essentially its just like pocket money to them for doing their hobby, real life will still get in their way, they will still need a full time job to look after themselves/family. The way I see it is this system is just that...Pocket Money, which for Modders is probably cool and fair enough for them if they want to take that route but doubts still remain.
I mean:
Who in their right mind is going to spend X amount of money on a single mod when X is equal to the cost of the original game itself?
Who in their right mind is going to spend X amount of money on a single mod when X is equal to half the cost of the original game itself?
Who in their right mind is going to spend X amount of money on a 5 mods when X is equal to triple the cost of the original game itself?

I'll tell you Who...iRacing fans! If you want to pay for continuous mods with future guaranteed support then iRacing is the perfect platform and it already exists, which is way if this system is to work the Mods have to be low amounts. Can you imagine Johnny X getting into RF2 in 5 years time - seeing 10 mods and 15 tracks he wants and he has to pay (for argument sake) £5 for each.....watch his heart sink when he relaises how much thats gonna cost him! It'll be ok for the early birds who arrived on the scene and could spread payments out to each mod overtime but not for newcomes further down the line.
Not to re-mention (again) the fact that a free mod could have better quality than the paid version...then its a no brainer as to which people will download, and again then add in all those who will Rip the paid mod anyway.

There must be a "Try Before You Buy" system or a proper Refund System in place beforehand, unless you're loaded with cash and will part with it willy nilly then fine but in these financial times people lean towards downloading a Demo/Beta/Trial beore they purchase. This area seriously needs to be considered if its to take off at all.

Plus should the Paid Mod not be licensed but obviously be a DTM mod for example what happens if DTM decide enough enoughs and want compensation or take legal action as the original mod is blatantly a Rip of their real life design? Just like Porsche (?) was it recently who stopped a mod team (was in the Sim news some months ago) from releasing their mod because they copied real life design.

Theres just too many ifs and buts for me and from the OPs reponses it does'nt sound very well thought through...like its just a sudden idea gathered a couple of weeks ago and on a whim he's going for it. Plus so what if its worked in the Plane Sim world...good for them, does'nt nessacarily mean it'll work in the Sim Racing world.

 

People will say anything to get what they want, example : if ISI promised me Bathurst by March then I'd pay £10 towards that, of the 100 other people to promise to pay £10 in that thread how many would actually pay? not 100 thats for sure, some will look to ways of getting it (Rip) for free, others will wait it out until a Free version came along anyway no matter how much they want the track, others may wait longer until the Price came down.

Plus someone trusted who released good quality material does'nt give anyone that guarantee that they'll be there after release to support and fix things should they be needed, which is way the Paid mods have to be of low cash sums and again nowhere near enough to help that entire mod team or even an individual to earn enugh to live off like the software company in the first place.



Sure for me if the mods are of decent quality, there are no other Free variants, the mod team does provide proper future support and if theres a Try efore You Buy option then personally I'll check it out and would welcome it.

 

@MarcG it was sayed allready few times, it on us modders to get license or make fictional content.
We approched first cars whit T5 series.
Do you have pCars? Looks inside there and there were more games and even simbin is going this way. Check there cars how they look and what names they use.

 

That bit there is the problem, if you make fictional content that is too close to reality and you get a legal letter through the post, that is what I was referring too. Dont npretend like it'll never happen as I've said its happened before so it could well happen again and if it happens to you thats your game over...period...every fictional mod you release that has an incling of real life about it will need to be pulled for legal reasons as you're technically in a legal battle and certainly production of future mods will be affected.

 

on the contrary, Im still having fun flying a freeware f16 over the Aegean

 

@MarcG i completly understand youre point but i did alot of researches around this issues. I didnt just decide over night about this and i did prepare myself all around that for months.

 

someone trusted who has released good quality content before, and they say they'll build something YOU want, get licensing for it too. Are you seriously saying if YOU wanted it,

And this is the main issue with most of the posters here.

1) I don't recognize this team as being a producer of great quality work. (I say great over good because it would need to be so if anyone it going to pay for anything.)

2) The OP has suggested they want have or be trying to create licensed content. This is a issue apparent being made be many posters here that these mods could attract the interest of the brand/Trademark owners to seek compensation closing down this site and servers that supply the paid user their codes to allow them to use their purchase.

Your scenario description I think would be far more acceptable to 90% of posters. Unfortunately your scenario is not the one we see being offered up by the OP.

 

FATCITY: my poll i suggested would be on how you heard about the mods b4 you dwn loaded them? most of the mods i have installed on rf1 where the 1s i had feedback on and friends told me about. yes i have tried a few and then deleted if i didn't like them. so i don't think i would just go buy mods without some trial EG:12hrs or feedback from friends or others, b4 its worth spending my hard earned cash.

 

Yep, some sure truth in that all.


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True. I guess I find myself debating the issue, more than the OP involvement.


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Fair enough, I understand that some people get mods by the word of mouth style and others do it my way as in trolling ( such a Sheldon word lol ) forums for releases and others will just buy them.

But I still dont want to waste my money as I,m sure you dont either.

I also agree with MarcG in that the OP's responses to a lot of questions and the responses from MAK- corp to questions seem to me to be heat of the moment answers, not ones that have been thoroughly thought out over the months.

But anyway, Alles has got the attention he needed for his mod and we all agree to disagree.
Some people will buy it and some wont.

Next topic please.

 

Guys if youre for it im prepared to release a beta of one car from T5 series. I think this can help us to build better physics and you to get what you need.
It will be bit streched down as for example the low poly cockpit, no templates...
But it will show the direction we are going and you can give us feedback on direction if something needs to get better.

 

Go for it Ales cant see how some beta testing could ever be a bad thing

 

great idea Ales what helps you helps us to get the best mod for the majority of ppl. cant please every1.

 

Hi Ales,

looking great! I see you also experience the slomo problem?