Sorry ISI but someone must say it ....

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by williang83, May 25, 2013.

  1. MrDarceh

    MrDarceh Registered

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    I thought that was just me hahah. I do like that the cars now seem to throw themselves off the road if you drop a wheel in the dirt though
     
  2. zenrael

    zenrael Registered

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    Just feather the clutch a bit in first or second gear, and slowly creep off the grass.
     
  3. Nuno P

    Nuno P Registered

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  4. ZeosPantera

    ZeosPantera Registered

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    What is really needed to sort of Kick off the rF2 community is the community mods. Even if they are just hacked over initially. Get a few hundred cars and tracks out and update, update, update.

    My favorite mod for rF1 is HistorX and I know they are sticklers for getting things right before a release but they have to get it on here sooner rather than later.

    I would love to see a WIP wall of projects.
     
  5. 10speed

    10speed Registered

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    With the basis you are working on continuously changing this is not going to happen. Why would you release a mod (call it work in progress or whatever), then ISI decides to change e.g. physics/coloration/reflection in the next build and you have to adjust all the paintings/physics to the new "standard". There are many other features of rFactor2 where this applies, too. ISI says it is constantly evolving which you would suggest is kinda positive, but that's wrong. So far there has only been proper track-modding as this area is not affected by ISI's updates so much. All the experienced modding teams are still waiting for a basis to work on. Some (like CTDP) even started working on a mod and gave up due to the above.
     
  6. Johannes Rojola

    Johannes Rojola Registered

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    I agree with this.
     
  7. coops

    coops Banned

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    Certainly if you understand that it is still evolving then you could do it if you were willing to update i understand that is a lot of trouble. but there a few mod friendly games in the same position. it would be a good ? to put frwd to the developers ? and answers.
     
  8. MarcG

    MarcG Registered

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    been saying that for months, thing is RF2 wont get to a stage where it's "finished" for years yet so what do mod teams do? hang on and wait? mod along the way and have to update their mod everytime a build is released then 1 week later another Build comes along?!

    ISI say its ready when people feel it's ready for them, but without knowing the future changes to systems within the game then you cant blame modders for still wanting to wait until the base is fully structured, it's not like rf1 where patches after mainly fixed issues, Builds with RF2 change a lot...it's a tough one for modders to call.

    Take the recent Sound updates in 218, 3rd party mods need to release a fix to adjust their sound settings, who's to say the next Build wont change that all again meaning another fix?! Mod teams are gonna be fixing their mods more than actually improving them and if I were a modder I'd be pretty annoyed with that.
     
  9. Denstjiro

    Denstjiro Registered

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    Not to mention drivers and leagues. how many are waiting for rf2 to become 'final' , how many are aware that it 'might' be final already..

    When I try to find this out as league admin, we are currently re-directing the league and have to decide which sims to embrace in the near future, there is too much confusion about rf2.
    Sure, when rf1 was released our league was flexible enough to go along with rf1's updates, things changed, people adapted. But this seems a bit of a different situation, not entirely sure why. Probably because its not 'new' anymore.

    Its likely indeed the structural changes we see in builds, and the way we are informed (or how others make all kinds of assumptions and claims, only to confuse even more) which doesn't only effect our decision, moreover, we don't have the userbase because the majority of our potential rf2 members are also awaiting, and some are not even bothering to dive into rf2 much until they get green light, which might not be given at all.
     
  10. 10speed

    10speed Registered

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    Yes, and as soon as you do so there will be the usual "you are whining"-accusations. I was an avid-rFactor-racer, loved the diversity of content available and especially endurance-racing with driver changes and all that. I'm sure someone who just wants to have a good time racing the K.I. while enjoying the good bits rFactor2 offers can ignore its flaws. But for me personally the current state of the rFactor2-development took away the joy and exitement I had with rFactor while with rFactor2 there was never so much exitement but lots of shaking the head.

    The recent rFactor2-versions had lots of flaws which made it nearly impossible to make proper use of it in a league. Weird tire wear, strange behaviour in the wet, online connection issues, problems with gravity transforming cars into skyrockets when crashing etc. Some of them may have been fixed now but there is still a long way to go. There may be some leagues trying out a few things but the majority sticks with rFactor.
     
  11. MarcG

    MarcG Registered

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    It's a risky move from ISI, I can imagine the bigger Mod teams brought in extra rf1 sales and vice versa for this title should they mod for it, they decide to move to another title and that's potential customers gone from ISI. Maybe that's why we're seeing much more official content and more official licensees to bring in more customers from that angle.
    Time will tell if this "constant development" approach will work for mod teams in general and it'll be interesting to see how Kudos attack the situation as they're esentially doing the same thing!
     
  12. coops

    coops Banned

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    IMHO RF2 will be the no:1 sim... But it needs to get to the stage that it is mod and league friendly at a high level (ASAP). That is what will bring it up to standard for ALL users, mods and new players will come from everywhere when this happens.
     
  13. Denstjiro

    Denstjiro Registered

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    In all fairness, rf1 was new, we had no expectations, no knowledge. With rf2 we do, allot, and so does ISI, they too must have started this all with a higher level of expectations then with rf1, knowing much more about the sim and how it translates to their users.

    So we are more spoiled, have more demands and are much more critical because we all will have some set ideas on what should be....

    As an effect its much more difficult to satisfy us then with rf1. especially because Beta where we all can voice in, and whine, and tell each other how bad it is. I would not be surprised if some peeps don't even know why they are complaining :p
     
  14. rogue22

    rogue22 Registered

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    Well put!

    I happen to like the constant development idea. Its nice to watch a sim like this grow.


    To the negative ones, Some of you are exaggerating just a bit. Yes the sim will change constantly since its only had a short life as of now, but it will get to a point where the updates become smaller and less obvious to a point where a simple patch fix to a mod is all that is needed.

    This thread was one was showing some appreciation for whats finally starting to turn into a fine product. Not for bashing there development process. There's plenty of threads going for that.

    No offense man, but the same song gets old.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 29, 2013
  15. 10speed

    10speed Registered

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    I cannot see any exaggeration. The current build causes huge laggs when someone leaves the server. Just recently I was very lucky during a race, all the disconnects happened on a straight. About 20 laps into the race and the inevitable happened: After the lag my car was demolished and undriveable, repair did not help. And yes they say this problem will not exist in the next build. Like they said there are no flickering shadows anymore while this issue is still present.

    Currently rFactor2 is not usable for any leagues due to "constant development" and "persisting bugs". It's alright for those who drive from time to time against KI though.

    What really gets old is you praising a product which is neither feature-complete nor usable for serious league racing. Arguing with you guys is like talking to a religious fanatic lacking any logic thinking.
     
  16. Marc Collins

    Marc Collins Registered

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    Unless it's wet grass. Hope they remember to model that along with the reduced grip on wet pavement.

    But agree the off-track grip is out-of-whack at most tracks.
     
  17. Jamezinho

    Jamezinho Registered

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    Being brutally honest here, I find this statement from ISI to be a complete cop-out. It's like they are scared to commit to any time-frame for this game. I can understand their reasoning i.e. not creating unrealistic expectations or bringing community pressure on themselves, but at the same time this game needs to reach a point where they stick a fork in it and call it done. Continual development sounds nice but in reality it's unworkable when a game relies so heavily on mod content.

    As this situation continues it is entirely possible that modders and fans will look to spend their time elsewhere.
     
  18. Jello

    Jello Registered

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    There is a lot of good, fair & true points written in this thread. But I guess the bottom line is we are all here for the same reason. We liked & enjoyed rF1 with vast amount of mods that kept the game going for so long & most definately we are all a bit disappointed in different ways about rF2 as a few of you have said as "we have expectations for it".

    Myself, I'll be hanging in there, I am getting enjoyment from rF2, I can see it is improving & the ISI team are working hard as they would have expectations as well & hopefully the modders will hang in there as well & rF2 will at some point (soon I hope) become the sim we are expecting it to be, with again a vast amount of mods to keep us all busy racing for some years. Besides, are there actually other racing sims that the dev's provide so much information etc for the mod community? I don't know as I'm not a modder.
     
  19. Johannes Rojola

    Johannes Rojola Registered

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    It looks like that AC is taking a bit different course by providing modders all the tools and information in well thought package. The mod development will be built into the game, so that you only import source files (3d models and texture files) and build from there. Depending how good the actual sim is, this is something that I am personally interested of. (+It was confirmed that AC will have Drag Racing!)

    I am kind of lucky as these both titles are unfinished (and badly so) as currently I don't have much spare time to do modding.
     
  20. Rony1984

    Rony1984 Registered

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    Would that also mean that modders won't have the freedom with rf2 because they are more tied to the AC mod tools?
     

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