Some trick to braking in RF2?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Rapala, Mar 7, 2016.

  1. Rapala

    Rapala Registered

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    I've been sim-racing for 2 odd years now and my level is now pretty decent, if I had to classify myself, in Iracing terms I'm 'bottom of the top split' if that makes any sense. When competing in Iracing, and watching hotlaps of the aliens, my brake points are the same, it's just the other little things that make them faster, usually about 0.5 second per minute faster. In RF2 leagues though, I'm just getting absolutely smoked by the front of the grid by around 2 seconds per minute. I was watching the top time guy in practise and what really amazed me was how much later his brake points were. I tried copying his brake points (using trail-braking too) and would just go flying off the track with absolutely no chance of stopping. I tried increasing brake force but that just leads to lock-ups so I'm genuinely perplexed as to how it's done.

    For example with the nissan 350z at sebring, at the end of the long straight just before the hairpin (which is about 1/3 of the way through the course), my brake point for the best line I can handle is just before the 400ft mark, but my alien friend was braking just before the 300ft! Would appreciate it if one of you fast guys that's able to make this late brake point explain how in the world it's done?

    for reference, the track was fairly well rubbered in at this point and the top guys were hitting times of 2:11.2, whereas my best was a rather sad 2:15.5.
     
  2. peterchen

    peterchen Registered

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    In general this people are using lots of engine-braking (trail-braking?), but the main point from my experience is:
    You have to use the brake-pedal progressive, brake with more feeling. Don´t know how to discribe it better, it´s something you got to learn
    so practice, practice, practice.....
     
  3. gt40

    gt40 Banned

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    Could setup also be a factor, especially in bumpy braking zones?
     
  4. peterchen

    peterchen Registered

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    Sure you have to play around with brake-bias and braking-power and figure out what suits you best....
     
  5. Comante

    Comante Registered

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    I'm slow, let's start from this consideration, but I don't think the 4.3 seconds came from braking later, but from accelerating earlier. So, I think the problem is from braking to accelerating, it maybe that you make your inputs (wheels and pedal) too aggressively, going over the grip limit too often during each turn, I don't know what wheel/pedal you have, but those matter too if they are too cheap, you won't be able to fine tune you inputs.
    In RF2, hardware permitting, there is a tight driving condition where you can slide into a turn but still be able to handle the car, I say "hardware permitting" because you can feel it in the FFB, well, this is where alien drivers make their times, because they can remain into this tight condition for most of the lap, while people like me can sort of make 1 or 2 turn like that, and then make a mistake, or feeling the urge to back off a little to regain full control over the car.
     
  6. Bjørn

    Bjørn Registered

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    First, I would get your friends hotlap replay. It's important to get HIS file. Then you got your own hotlap replay to compare carefully alongside. Just to get the braking points just right. Because in the replay you can see when people are brakking with the telemetry overlay. There can be a tiny bit of delay on stuff from other cars on your own replay. So get your friend's file.

    After that you ask him to install DAMPlugin - because then you can see what he is doing differently with the Motec i2 Pro analysis program.

    An effective braking zone should look something like a "shark fin" tall at one end then progressively decreasing. You have the downforce that gives you max adhesion so you can use the brakes if not fully, then almost fully with a sensible brake bias. Then as downforce decreases as you slow down you put less input into the braking system.

    Install DAMPlugin and get familiar with Motec i2 Pro and the channels of importance (speed, braking, acceleration, lat g+long g). It is an extremely powerful tool and WILL tell you what is being done differently. Put your friends lap and your lap on top of each other and see what's evidently done differently.

     
  7. Rapala

    Rapala Registered

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    Didn't know about these tools, thanks!
     
  8. Denstjiro

    Denstjiro Registered

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    4.3sec sounds allot indeed for just braking, there's bound to be other areas to improve as well. all above advise is solid.

    I would also try the Replay Office plugin, you can combine (overlap) different replays and compare lines etc. a bit easier then motec imo, not as in-depth but able to give quick pointers.
    http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.php/21289-rF2-Replay-Office-(set-of-tools)
     
  9. Bjørn

    Bjørn Registered

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    If you need help understanding how the plugin logs files and what these files can be used for, just ask. I will do my best to try and get you set up. Probably also other racers on here can chip in.
    Basically when you have the plugin installed it'll create log files here: rFactor 2\LOG
    You can then open these files with the Motec program and it'll be possible for you to backtrack what you've done in the previous session. Everytime you have been on track and go into the garage, it'll tell you that "log-building (is) finished" and it'll be found in that rFactor 2\LOG folder.

    When you've understood how it works (enabling, adding / disabling channels) you can try and persuade your friend to install the DAMPlugin as well and ask him to send a log file containing a fast lap.

    EDIT: Denstjiros suggestion will be a quicker way to see what might be done differently, it'll definitely give you an idea. If you then want to know precisely what is done differently Brake/throttle input, then you will need to analyse it more closely using DAMP and Motec :)
     
  10. Emery

    Emery Registered

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    Don't forget your pedal controls. For myself, R3E clued me into turning down the brake sensitivity. Try 70% and see if that gives you more control.

    Otherwise, yeah, Replay Office, Motec, and DAMP.
     
  11. Led566

    Led566 Registered

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    Don't know what kind of rig you have, but a good set of pedals with load cell makes wonders.
    You can start with a used csr elite pedals for example. They are good enough.
     
  12. DurgeDriven

    DurgeDriven Banned

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    Maybe the guys you race with are aliens.

    You say they doing 2:11

    rF2 Rank fastest lap 370z@Sebring is apparently 2:13 ? ( sounds slow )
     
  13. Rapala

    Rapala Registered

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    haha, maybe they using grip hax! Perhaps their 2:11's are due to extreme rubbering of the track by the end of the race? Where do you find this rank info?

    @Led- equipment is good, T300 with t3pa brake mod pedals
    @Bjorn - when I said 'alien friend', I didn't actually mean 'friend', more like 'that alien dude'. English is funny sometimes.

    If there's any fast guys who willing to do 350z hotlap at sebring on heavy rubbered track and then upload the data, so I can compare the telemetry with all these new tools, I would definitely most appreciate it.
     
  14. Gavin Newcombe

    Gavin Newcombe Registered

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    Are they using Aids. Are you using Aids
     
  15. Led566

    Led566 Registered

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    Was that in the REVS server?
    Guys lapping at 2:14-2:15 are generally pretty fast.
    Of those lapping 2:13 onrace I know some that are killing fast.
    Your lap time seems not so bad.
    About the t3pa, I used to have the T500 pedal set with a brake mod (not load cell) and I used to think it was pretty good.
    Until I bought the CSR Elite pedals with load cell.
     
  16. DurgeDriven

    DurgeDriven Banned

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    Mind you that may not be right..........just a thought.


    Sign up here:
    http://rf2.gplrank.info/laptimes/580/
     
  17. Rapala

    Rapala Registered

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    Yeh it was the Revs Nissan 350Z league race last night (sunday). At least I know now my lap time is not abysmal, those leaders are just crazy fast.
     
  18. bwana

    bwana Registered

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    You also may be losing a lot of time by trying to brake too late.. Effecting ovverall corner speed and being able to get back on the gas again
     
  19. mastersvodka

    mastersvodka Registered

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    They are cheaters
     
  20. romano2603

    romano2603 Registered

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    We are not cheaters, I just had good setup and good practice.. We couldn't cheat because we had Anti-cheat software running.. Just need to know the car, it is not about braking.. This car has lot of turn in understeer and turn exit oversteer.. Some playing with preload and wing helped car a lot.. Of course, springs and dampers were important too.. I could make time below 2:11 if i had qually fuel.. Rubber was fine, but still not nearly full
     

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