Rfactor 2 licences [poll]

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by sommergemuese, Oct 6, 2010.

?

Which Licensing do you want?

  1. Trymedia

    154 vote(s)
    51.7%
  2. Steam

    68 vote(s)
    22.8%
  3. CD-Key Check/Online activation (Securom)

    59 vote(s)
    19.8%
  4. Another one...

    17 vote(s)
    5.7%
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  1. xTr3me

    xTr3me Registered

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    yes sure, but I would rather see every year a rFactor 2 addon for 20-30€ instead.
    I hate to buy something and don`t be the owner^^
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 13, 2010
  2. Max Angelo

    Max Angelo Registered

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    Well, i have the "administrator" tag, but i am speaking here having not any idea about the purchase system of rF2.

    I think i can voice the vast majority of the italian community saying that a monthy fee could be a not appreciated system.

    Furthermore, here i hope my english is good enough to be clear, i see some issues, related to a payment based on monthly, or trimonthly, or annual fees.

    I mean, we have a record in sim racing: iRacing, but iRacing offers a service which makes sense for a payment based on the time you use it. I dont know any other game having a payment system a la iRacing, without a service related to the game.

    So, we can have two ways, thinking to fees: fees based on a service, or fees based not on a service.

    I cant know the pros and the versus of a fee system not associated to a service, only i can see a very slow starting up of rF2 sells, with a fee system.

    But, a fee system associated a to a service like iRacing, makes me see a big versus.

    The service has to be related to third parts addons becouse it works at his best, and here i think can raise a lot of problems.
    Problems between ISI and modders, problems between ISI and the real brands, problems between the modders and the real brands.
    Clear, these problems becouse a service associated to 3rd parts addons, makes these addons be part of a commercial venture.

    On the other side, if a service a la iRacing puts out the addons, the result will be a community separated ... people buying the service and people not buying the service.

    So, wishes of the community apart, i see very risky rF2 based on a service payment system.

    But, I (and i guees the whole italian community) have nothing against the payment for ISI addons or the payment for game updates.
     
  3. Davy TASB

    Davy TASB Registered

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    Totally agree.
    I am not too bothered whether ISI use Trymedia, Steam or Securom, I'm in for rFactor 2 as long as its not for a monthly payment thing.
     
  4. Gonzo

    Gonzo Member

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    ok, agree with the "not monthly" thing ;).
    but i am sure its worth more than 35 bucks as we paid for rf1
     
  5. ORA-Quasi

    ORA-Quasi Registered

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    Buy outright = lots of sales
    Payment basis (like membership) = Not so many sales

    As the head of a community, I can say right now that charging monthly, quarterly, six monthly, or annually, is a bad idea (if an ongoing thing). If racers had to do that they would figure that they may as well jump to iRacing completely, and skip RF2 altogether (as many still do iRacing and RF1).

    It needs to be kept in mind that RF2 will be competing with many more options than RF did upon release. There is now NetKar Pro, GT5, GTREvo (with GTR3 coming), iRacing, etc, so taking any course of action that gives people a reason to look elsewhere is a bad idea.

    An access/membership payment style purchase system is a bad idea. Let us just buy RF2 outright and get on with racing. If making, for instance, 4 equal payments as an option to lump sum, that is a completely different situation and see no problem with that. Although this would only be necessary if the RF2 purchase price was crazy.

    As for the Trymedia vs Steam type option, I'm not bothered either way. I don't mind the Steam option , however the one real negative with that is that if your internet is down, or Steam are having issues, you can't even fire up an offline session in the sim.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 14, 2010
  6. Frank Beuchel

    Frank Beuchel Registered

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    i fully agree with that

    + additional Question: on rF1 you can copy the "rFactor"-Folder anywhere you will (other HD, other Partition, other Subfolder) and it works. So i have many rF-Instances for many different mods and Leagues.
    I think this will not work on steam. (right?)
     
  7. Frank Geyer

    Frank Geyer Registered

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    I am pretty sure that some people might take this as a personal offence for what I am stating in the following. I can only say that this is NOT ment to be that way. All I am stating is based upon my personal meaning and experience on building, setup and supporting infrastructures for long distance races based on rFactor 1.255F including a sophisticated Mod + Track, an automated way of distribution and synchronizing the same, plugins for live timing presentation and scripts and tools for covering worst-case-scenarios in a more or less professional environment.

    For the sake of the huge modding community around rFactor as Sim-Racing-Application, the current way of licensing (DVD, Trymedia, and in somewhat DRM <<< but so far I haven't seen such a licensed copy of rFactor) with its way of distribution (DVD and Online-Download), I can only hope and appeal to Gjon that ISI is not tying down rF2 to such distribution platforms like Steam or Impulse and therefore limiting the freedom of the modding groups, league owners or hosts of special events. The way some people think of combing Mods, Cars and/or Track in any way like an All-Inclusive-I-Am-Cracking-Happy-"Game" and then after all expecting it to run rock solid stable and error and flawless-free is an illusion that cannot and will not work.

    Or in others words: You cannot combine the best of F1s, LMPs, GTs, NASCARs, DIRTs or whatever kind of CAR-CLASS in ONE CAR and then expect it to be an Egg-Craping-Woll-Milk-Pig (a direct translated, nice and funny German expression for all-in-one or swiss-army-knife) which rules the races in any class all over the world. This is an illusion too - on the other hand evolution never has been able to metamorphose such an animal to spend lazy mankind and all-in-one easy to clone food-resource, cause mother nature would probably kill herself trying to do so because all the requirements which needs to be fulfilled to create such a creature ... I guess ^^ !?!?

    The reason why an F1 car beats the crap out of any GT car on every flat track is because of its specialization! rFactor therefore is currently the only Sim-Racing-Application which provides the Sim-Racing-Community for specialization to the modding community for virtual and affordable motorsports.

    A clean rF1 installation (NOT rF-Lite) is about 1.63 GB in size. The current size of the EnduRacers Mod is about 1.81 GB. Most other Mods has a size of around 500 MB to 1GB ... e.g. rFactor + Endu + Other + some Tracks and you will end up somewhere around 5 GB. Who is deciding what will go into the Steam / Impulse distribution or not. I can imagine that ISI is going take responsibilities of what comes out of their pencil, but they are not able to take the same responsibilities for "Mods, Cars, Tracks" written by others. Where is the limit of such a rF2 distribution ??? The HDD ??? To think of it to the extreme - what if one has only a HDD of 200 GB with 100 GB left and the initial rF2 Steam distributed download is 120 GB ... yeah I know what is coming ... he or she should get him- / herself a new system - right!

    As a league or host of special events, one would like to have the event and / or league mod as lean as possible !!! As a Sim-Racing-Driver you don't want a hundred background processes which hasn't anything to do with the stable running environment for the OS or rF raising the chance of interfering game-play in a way you compete in a 24hrs race and be busted out of the race 30 minutes before the checkered flag !!! Even with the possible built-in option in rF2 of rejoining a race session after a disconnect, it will be pretty hard to win a race under these circumstances !!!

    Again: I personally think that rFactor is currently the only Sim-Racing-Platform from racers for racers which gives one the opportunity to do virtual motorsports with all the aspects of its big variety in an affordable way.

    Most professional leagues in these days have invented their own way of distributing / synchronizing! their league- and or events-mods including rFactor + tracks and in that way trying to reduce the faults by drivers not being able to setup a clean installation of rFactor (but on the other hand those drivers are very skilled and talented drivers ... but don't know crap about IT-Systems and / or IT-Infrastructures) and / or cleaning-up unwanted plugins for this rF + Mod + Track-Installation on the local machine with every synchronization to eliminate / reduce faults or flaws during e.g. 24hrs races or driver swaps during long distance races. Even with this scenario you won't be able to eliminate all errors 100% - you can only try to reduce unwanted errors to a maximum possible.

    I could go on and on not finding any reason tying down rF2 to a so called "professional" distribution platform ... but if you guys deciding to do so *cry* for whatever kind of reason I only have one plea:

    Please provide us then also with a way of licensing and distribution like the current way of the same like DVD and Trymedia. That way one would be able to choose which licensed version of rF2 he/she would call his/her own.

    So, this is it from my side to this very hot discussed topic and now you are all free to start picking *a very big grin* !!!

    Cheers
    Frank
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 16, 2010
  8. K Szczech

    K Szczech Registered

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    I think Steam is a good distribution platform, but as for installing games - no, I still prefer to install everything individually and into folders of my choice. A modder would certainly aprecciate the possibility to have more than one installation of a game.
     
  9. ORA-Quasi

    ORA-Quasi Registered

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    That's right Frank, the Steam option offers no chance of multiple installs. Having said that, I remember reading somewhere a while back, in a Q&A, that RF2 may not be structured to allow for multiple installs either.
     
  10. ZeosPantera

    ZeosPantera Registered

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    Arma2 is also available on steam and after it installs you can do as you wish with the "Steam>Steamapps>common>Arma2" folder. Dozens of mods and the ability to let you patch it manually or have steam do it. It doesn't use the steam overlay or friend system directly and when I reinstall I just sign in and tell it to download. There is NO DOWNSIDE TO STEAM if ISI wishes there not to be.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 17, 2010
  11. MaXyM

    MaXyM Registered

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    Are you sure it is possible to do multiple installation of A2 in single system using Steam?
     
  12. ZeosPantera

    ZeosPantera Registered

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    I will test tomorrow. Should be a matter of copy and paste with all the settings A2 uses in My Documents anyway. Multiple installs of A2 arent usually necassary as the launch shortcut holds all the mod loading information. IE

    ""G:\SteaM\SteamApps\common\arma 2\beta\arma2.exe" -exThreads=3 -world=empty -nosplash -mod=beta;@CBA;@CSM2;@TRSM;@WarFXSES;@Tracers;@MAP;@zcommon;@JTD;@duala;@Kibrul;@panthera"

    I imagine a similar system for RF2 would be silly. A launcher with easy mod selection and other tweaks would probably be a better route.
     
  13. Frank Geyer

    Frank Geyer Registered

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    What I do really like is a copy & paste of a default and clean rF2-Lite folder, throw the mod + track data into the new, fresh and independent instance either by hand or a sync tool and launch the app by either double-clicking the executable or gen a shortcut on the desktop ^^ ... would be fracking easy without any other software or a launcher involved !!!
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 17, 2010
  14. Gonzo

    Gonzo Member

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    Hm in the beginning of steam i hate it.
    It came first for us counterstrike users.
    In the beginning it was slow, full of bugs and not useable.

    But today, many years after the initial release it became a great platform in my eyes.


    Thinks like
    Friendlist in which you can see which friend is online, playing which game, directly follow a friend onto a server or invite friends when self on a server.
    You can simply call the steam overlay by pressing "shift+tab" and then you have the messanger in which you can talk privately to all your contacts.
    Steam updates your game automatically if you want it.
    Steam also can better check for cheating.
    When you reinstall windows just reinstall steam in the old directory again and all games you own will be available within some minutes.

    negative is: If you have an issue with the paymant steam will lock your entire profile. I got that once, i have about 30 games in steam which cost about 1000€ or more and then something went wront with my payment of 30€... they locked my entire account. In germany they would get in conflict with the laws with such a behaviour.

    I nt he end steam is a nice tool, which also would give isi the opportunity to get some new player to the sim scene which do not know about yet, cause inside of steam you ll find a lot of games.
    I also have Race 07 and GTR-E bought in steam.
    easy going, buy, sell, download within minutes, play.

    of course steam should be optional and not the once platform.
     
  15. MaXyM

    MaXyM Registered

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    I know how A2 works (have it). But don't know about possibility to install the same title more than once. IMO it must be installed in referenced subdir in Steam folder.
    But I'm not expert of Steam. Waiting for results of your tests.



    It may be really pain in ass in case of problems with new released version
    If I remember correctly rf1 1.250 has some serious problems that's why organized leagues stopped to use it until 1.255 was released.
    When using Steam it wouldn't be possible to control installed version of game (without access to oldest versions etc)

    Again: I would like to have possibility do download rf2 from steam but decide manually if, where and when to install it.
     
  16. ZeosPantera

    ZeosPantera Registered

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    Results are in. Arma2 works fine if you just copy the game Dir into any hard drive you want and run the EXE. You don't even need steam open to run Arma2. Source games have no EXE's in their individual folders and run off the main HL2.exe with a modifier. Other Non-Source games are independent.
     
  17. V6_

    V6_ Registered

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    I'd much rather pay once for the game rather than pay continuously and I'm pretty sure ISI won't do it, just so that they don't alienate their audience.
     
  18. tjg_marantz

    tjg_marantz Registered

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    Thanks for the info Zeos. After seeing Franks post I was going to come here and reply that people should really do their research before declaring platform X will ruin the game...

    Oh and wanting something to come out on Steam does not mean we don't want to see it come out on anything else. We'd just like it to be an option. Why do people insist on thinking it's Steam or nothing?
     
  19. ZeosPantera

    ZeosPantera Registered

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    No Idea. I can think of a ton of Hard copy and steam releases that co-exist just fine.
     
  20. Gonzo

    Gonzo Member

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    Thats not true! You can select wheter steam should keep game up to date or not!
     
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