Rerouting a multiple layout track; possible?

Discussion in 'Track Modding' started by Navigator, Jul 18, 2015.

  1. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    Hi guys,

    After having learned the basic steps of altering a track a bit (fast line, corridors, but still learning off course) I thought of a new project I really, really want; altering the Searspoint track to the Indycar layout.
    Now the road is there and it is drivable; there are just some pylons blocking it off.

    What I think should be done is the following (please weigh in)
    - make new waypoints in the new sections
    - remove waypoints out of the old sections
    - make new corridors for cutting and so on
    - make new lines for middle/left/right/fast/blocking
    - move speed traps if in a filtered out section (which is not the case I believe)
    - make a new layout selectable
    - move the pylons

    Now the hard part; moving the pylons........I think. Do I need some program to alter the get files? Because I looked at those programs when I was messing with cars and never got one; they cost to much money for now.
    If I do need that; consider this topic as not written :(

    But; if not needed; I want to give it a go.
    So my questions; do you have any hints or tips for me? Is there anything I miss here? Is it even possible?


    Thanks in advance!
     
  2. Nibiru

    Nibiru Registered

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    I'm guessing this is a private project

    It will be possible with some work. I don't think altering the old aiw will work but give it a try, otherwise you can make a new one.
    3dsimed will let you view the track and find out what the names of the pylons are. You can remove them from the scn or move them to another position export and replace them with the old ones.

    3dsimed gives you a 21 day trial so you should be able to get it done in that time.

    Your biggest issue would probably be that the new sections of road may not have realroad mapped and may not have enough polys. This would have to be done in 3dmax.
     
  3. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    Hi Niburu, yes, it is a private project indeed.

    So best is to make a new AIW; noted!
    I already used up my 21 day trial :(
    However; I can make the track for now I suppose and hit the pylons out of the way first lap.........until I have a solution for that.
    3dsimed is only needed for replacing the pylons right?

    I go and test today and drive it myself to see if railroad is there. The polys you speak of; I notice that if the track is bouncy, right?

    Thanks!
     
  4. Nibiru

    Nibiru Registered

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    If you have a 2nd computer you can use the 3dsimed 21 day trial again

    I haven't used the viewer that isi provide much and I don't think it does but maybe that could tell you the names of objects without using 3dsimed. Then remove the pylons from the scn. You could also read through the scn to see if the object names stand out or use a little trial and error by // at the front of an objects instance. which means the game doesnt load the object to find your pylons.

    If the new sections of road are bumpy thats a fairly good sign that the mesh isn't that good.
     
  5. Drathuu

    Drathuu Registered

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    You could use 3dsimed (free trial) to identify the objects that are the pylons (Open the .Scn file with it), right click the pylons and determine their name.
    You could then manually edit the .SCN file for that track layout variant and remove those entries (instances) of the objects.

    D
     
  6. matf1

    matf1 Registered

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    Copy the SEARSPOINTRW_MAIN folder, call it SEARSPOINTRW_ALT or something identifiable and work with that folder.
    -identify the pylon gmt names
    -remove unwanted pylons by removing or commenting out the object in the SCN file.
    Example:
    Instance=cone01
    {
    Moveable=True
    MeshFile=cone01.gmt CollTarget=True HATTarget=True ShadowCaster=(Static, Solid) Reflect=True ShadowGroups=(12)
    }

    would look like

    //Instance=cone01
    //{
    // Moveable=True
    // MeshFile=cone01.gmt CollTarget=True HATTarget=True ShadowCaster=(Static, Solid) Reflect=True ShadowGroups=(12)
    //}

    Process of elimination may be your only hope here as the GMT mas file is encrypted.
    -You'll want a brand new AI path.
    Use the existing AIW file so we can keep the garage, pit and grid locations
    Create new main path by "record a new path" and when complete choose the top option, "record new path as main" or something like that.
    Objective is a neat centre line around the track.
    Add pit paths and connect "join as branch" to the main path. (see ISI doco for this if unclear)
    -Add fast and block paths
    -clean up corridors
    -Change details to reflect new layout in GDB
    -Possibly rename files slightly to avoid conflict. May not be necessary but it's good practice.


    Hope that help somewhat :)

    * oh the only possibility for mesh and realroad work is Mianiak due to it being encrypted.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 19, 2015
  7. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    Wow, I can work with this; I see it happening :) Thanks guys!

    Sorry for being such a cheapass, but 3dsimed is really no option.......so I have to use the alternative way.
    [MENTION=3167]matf1[/MENTION]; could you elaborate on this one a bit more? "Change details to reflect new layout in GDB"
    Do you mean to get it as a separate track? Should I do that first than to avoid messing up the original?

    Edit; is there a bonus in having the track decrypted; can I do some more in that case?
     
  8. matf1

    matf1 Registered

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    Sure , the GDB information is what appears in game. You can make a separate track or just use separate track folders
    SEARSRW
    SEARSCHIC
    GMT
    MAPS

    So replace instances of SEARSRW to SEARCHIC with a text editor (notepad ++ is great) and you just use a replace all function.

    I hope it's clear enough. I'm a bit rushed for time.

    If it was decrypted, you can view/open/modify/save the models.
    You could PM Mianiak and ask him for them, but little point unless you have 3d tools to do all that.
     
  9. Nibiru

    Nibiru Registered

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    Yes you should already have the track set out as a seperate track. The gdb will allow the game to see it.
     
  10. Juergen-BY

    Juergen-BY Registered

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    just keep in all gdb`s from this track the same VenueName, otherwise they won`t appear under the same menu ingame, if they should...
     
  11. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    Okay guys, thanks, I got pretty far (for me).

    I got the AI now driving the new layout and am busy with a few bugs I encountered;
    - Made a second pit line (waypoints) and set that as the second pit also; hooked it up to the first pit line and 1 car comes out of the pit box and does alright, the other one acts as if there is no path and bounces back to the pit boxes. Had to make a second path as the cars are positioned away from the first path; buildings in between.
    - The sound acts weird sometimes; a high pitch squealing noise.

    Also; I cleared the "special waypoints" but........those were grid positions probably, could that be? They were two by two sets one after another.........Maybe shouldn't have done that :(

    Its a bit harder than I thought, but its getting there (I hope ;) )
     
  12. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    Well, it was fun as it lasted, but I now started all over again for 12 times.........and still not okay :(

    Made the pit 1 and 2 lines, just like in the old layout because they were gone after making a new main path.
    I saw no garage or pit spots and so I started making them as according to ISI's tut; there was already "done" standing there and one time even, I saw the green waypoints on the pit locations.......other times I didn't. But both times, it said "done" already. Sometimes, it says "position recorded" and sometimes it don't..........

    So; ISI's tut is not okay or I am missing something here, but the fun is gone.

    Anyway; thanks for all the help guys!
     
  13. Juergen-BY

    Juergen-BY Registered

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    AIW editing or creating it`s nothing just to learn within hours. It`s a "learning route" within months/years...
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 19, 2015
  14. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    I understand Juergen-BY, I really do.
    But there is a point when I start to get irritated.........again (as with the cars) a lack of information/documentation from ISI.
    I took al the pit- and garage spots out of there, did what ISI said; go and stand there and click on save (or record something) as they were empty; I got now the message "done".
    I made the spots just in the pit lane and not at the back of the buildings. My own car goes there, nice. The AI.......I got the message rF2 is "generating garage locations because there were not enough....... I did have enough though.

    Main problem; the cars don't stop when they come in; they drive through the pit lane and drive out.......getting out of fuel later on.
    When looking at the old version; I see waypoints at the places they should stop and lines between the pitwaypoints and those separate waypoints. I don't have that.

    Its clear there is a missing link between the pit spots and the pit lane.
    I don't mind learning and making lots of errors, but (again) I'm finding things out ISI didn't describe........look for yourself; in the tut it says you make a spot and all is okay..........
    Learning; okay. Making errors; okay. Reading a lot; okay. Working a lot; okay. But it has to be doable...........
     
  15. matf1

    matf1 Registered

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    I really do disagree with this. For a moment, I'd considered that maybe I am doing something special. So I converted Lienz AIW and all. Created a new fast and block path, adjusted half a dozen corridors and it was done.
    Not production quality, but more than satisfactory for amazing racing.

    I also agree that the documentation requires updating. However everything does work... if you know how. That's what takes the months and why I decided to try and write what I know.(yes I know this thread is separate)

    12 months ago I knew nothing. Today it is nothing to bang out a few fixes.

    @Navigator man. Seriously, tweaker to full on editing in 2 days... Impressive.
    It's all about the shortcuts and you probably will never find those in official doco.

    Open the AIW file.
    See where it says [GRID] near the top
    Further down it says:
    [ALTGRID]
    [TELEPORT]
    [PITS]
    [AUX]

    These are the headers for all the information that devmode puts in.
    Simply copy all that back into the new AIW, overwriting the contents you are replacing, not the new paths you've created.
    Nothing further than [WAYPOINTS]

    Work with backups!

    If it is still an issue after that. Let me know and I'll take a look for you... if that's what you want.
    Sometimes after major surgery, it needs a little tlc.


    *The info missing from the doco (or is it just not emphasized, I forget) is the method.
    Garage
    Garage
    PIT
    Garage
    Garage
    PIT
    etc
    I save in batches of 10 garages.

    Deviate from that method and it's nothing but headaches.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 19, 2015
  16. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    Sorry, I do not understand matf1; do I need to copy all lines under those 4 titles from the old aiw to the new? (Altgrid/teleport/pits/aux)

    And making garage/pit spots, I make 2 garage, go back and choose add pit, make one and go back and choose add garage 2 times again?
     
  17. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    Okay, I did that; I copied all content under the 4 headliners: "altgrid, teleport, pits and aux" from the original (with was still in my normal installation so it should be good) AIW file.
    I opened the track and still the AI had trouble getting out of their pit box plus they still don't stop at a pit space when done driving; they brake at the end of the pit lane and almost come to a stop, but then carry on right back on the track.

    What I see, is that there are no waypoints in front of the pit spaces; something I DID see in my (also original) AIW from this track with old layout in devmode. There were also stripes between those waypoints and the waypoints from the pitlane itself.

    A picture:

    [​IMG]
     
  18. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    Well, one win........as I couldn't leave it alone, I went over it a few more times and now the garage exit is working.

    Turns out that you have to set the path in the paddock to "extended 1st pit" or something like that. I did that before, but it didn't work; the game got stuck.
    It had become a mess somewhat though......

    ONE thing left!
    For some reason, I DO have the waypoints with the pit spots now.......wow. However; in the working version, the connections go to the waypoints of the pit lane in a "V" shape and it seems obvious thats the path they take when driving in the pits and go to their spot and leave again; they seem to follow that line.

    Those lines now, are pointed towards another direction; it seems (as I can't find the end of them) they all go to the paddock............
    How can I connect these lines/waypoints to the pit waypoints?

    A quick oversight;
    - got rit of the pylons
    - fast line, middle line and so on are there
    - pit exit and entry are working and smooth
    - AI drives out of their boxes
    - AI drives the new layout

    So; I have done some useful things today; I'm a happy man :) (Could be happier if I got the cars coming into their pit spots though)

    Well, 3:30 am now.......got to get up at 6 am; maybe its best if I shut my eyes for a while ;)
     
  19. Navigator

    Navigator Registered

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    No one, anymore?

    I thought I'd start all over again with a clean sheet as "you guys" seem not to be able to help me out anymore. Not meant in an angry manner, don't get me wrong, but you say yourselves it is hard and you need shortcuts to do it. Those shortcuts shouldn't be necessary if the documentation was proper, right?

    So I threw out the aiw file and kept my fingers crossed for not falling out of the track when clicking "race"..........I didn't :)
    But then; I am IN the safety car! I mean.......REALLY??

    I'm starting to wonder if its all worth it.
    Again; don't mind reading a lot, learning a lot or hard work, but it should be possible and it seems not. It seems ISI's documentation only covers a few percent of what's really to it. It discourages people who want to start out "modding".
    I think rF1 became great due to the community; there was every car or track you could think of!
    Now; its getting to hard to make a proper track (in a reasonable amount of time; I see guys working on a complete new track for years here) and a turbo engine......dont get me started; again shortcuts.........taking an existing version and alter it; reverse engineering is almost impossible. Trial and error, for months. Guys still try to work out what "back torque" is al about for example (and thats nog even the turbo engine alone; that one is for all engines).

    Had to get that off my chest, sorry for that. Its just frustrating that every little thing doesn't work the way it should and there is no proper documentation.
    I for one, am the kind that goes to bed thinking about it........want to get it done........cant sleep, try again.......and again. Cant leave it alone either.
    I should "protect" myself and quit the whole game as I keep running into things like this; is it not cars, its tracks.

    So; thanks for all the help; I nearly got it done. Very nice of you to answer me and put you time in it!
     
  20. Jka

    Jka Member Staff Member

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    If you want new path from paddock/garages to the pitlane, do following things.

    Create path, mark it as "extended 1st pit", join the branch to main pitpath and cap another (loose) end of this new path. Remember to "find corridors" again after creating new path.


    These lines are generated automaticly, based on your pitpath and pit locations, when you reload the track after saving AIW. After reloading the track, you have to re-save AIW again to make these changes permanent. You dont need alter these paths/connections manually.

    Cheers
     

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