Please sign my petition for ISI to include a realistic clutch option in rFactor 2

Discussion in 'Wish Lists' started by Guy Moulton, Jan 4, 2013.

  1. 88mphTim

    88mphTim Staff Member

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    I've been living in the US since 2006-2007 and automatics are quite common here. In 2011 I was in the UK and needed a rental car, all they had was manual, and of course I hadn't done it at all since I'd moved to the US... By the time I dropped the car off it had all come back and I was fine... But, my wife just cannot do it, she's never had to. I fear that a lot of simracers won't use what they're asking for. I'm not even sure I would... With the little time I actually get to race the thing, I'm not sure I'd be in-tune with the different cars enough to use it... But anyway, I'm just thinking aloud, it's going to be interesting. ;)
     
  2. samuelw

    samuelw Registered

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    I want a real clutch. DD is a six speed manual. Double declutch on down shifts IRL as well in RF2.
     
  3. gorgias1976

    gorgias1976 Registered

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    I remember when I had my old Opel Kadett. For a while it had a carburator problem when the engine was started and the weather was quite cold. Engine tended to stop when on idle until it warmed up. This car had not much braking power. So one cold morning I was about to go to work and decided that as I approached the first red light I'd shift to neutral and then keep the right foot on the throttle and use the left foot for soft braking and prevent the engine from stopping.
    Well, as I pressed the brake slightly with my left foot I almost ended up with me teeth on the windscreen, that was scary heavy braking from 30 to 0.
     
  4. PorscheMR6

    PorscheMR6 Registered

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  5. Butch Nackley

    Butch Nackley Registered

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    I would only want it, if it worked like a real clutch. I have a manual car and enjoy driving it, even in this constant stop and go traffic my city has. But I don't really use manual clutch in games, since they don't work realistically. I did use DXTweak to make the G25 clutch work like a real one in rF1 and that was nice. But, it won't work with OS's past XP, I don't believe.

    Anyway, if rF2 had adjustable response curves with adjustable dead zones possible at beginning and end of the clutch travel, I would use it. If not, I would stay with Auto Clutch most likely.
     
  6. DrR1pper

    DrR1pper Registered

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    I've just returned home from my first ever driving lesson.....please please please have this option!

    I have a great deal more appreciation for LFS now from the few times I've tried it, the clutch physics felt exactly as I experienced today. Totally awesome and downloading that sim again now.
     
  7. Barf Factor

    Barf Factor Registered

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    I wasn't going to say it before but I think it is safe for me to reveal that I get an almost perverse amount of satisfaction from using manual transmissions. Also, automatics are for rich people.
     
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  8. DrR1pper

    DrR1pper Registered

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  9. Jason Kinchington

    Jason Kinchington Registered

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    Was just wondering what the benefits that a real clutch would offer
    As anti lock brakes off u can brake later making u faster and traction control off u can power out of a corner quicker making u faster
    With auto clutch turned off ???? Does it make ya faster

    I would be happy if it just wouldn't go into gear without the clutch pressed and a grinding noise

    Cheers
     
  10. DrR1pper

    DrR1pper Registered

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    It's not about the benefits (or disadvantage from another perspective) but for realism....this is supposed to be a simulator. lol
     
  11. tjc

    tjc Member

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    I used to know quite a few Americans a few years ago as there was an American base over here in my county (two actually) and most of them struggled with cars they bought here that had manual gears etc...

    Having said that, one of my sisters drives an automatic and so does the singer in the band I`m in and both of them wouldn`t drive anything else.

    I`ve always been a manual man myself, there`s just something I really love about changing gear and using the gears to drive the car... changing down, changing up, being in the right gear for the corner/roundabout`s etc and being in control of all that...

    Magic!

    Would love to do a track day on a real race track being given some instruction etc, sadly I live too far away from my nearest proper race track to make that a possibility but maybe one day...

    So Tim, how do you change gears with say, the BT20?

    Clutch and H-shifter?

    Please don`t tell me your using paddles lol... :D

    :)
     
  12. elbo

    elbo Registered

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    Why question whether to implement it or not? Put it in, if people don't want it they can turn it off. Those of us who want it get one more thing to enjoy.
    It's like ingame rain. I was happy to see it implemented and even happier to shut it off because I don't like racing in rain. I realize that without a force feedback clutch it can't be fully realistic but what grinding granny did for rfactor was plenty good for me. It is in fact single handedly responsible for the fact that I still play rfactor and haven't moved fully to rf2 yet.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 5, 2013
  13. Kknorpp001

    Kknorpp001 Banned

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    Can someone summarize the options available and that are being asked for? Some are saying all that is needed is not to shift and make noise if clutch not used but it seems there is more to it than that but I'm not sure exactly what or how it would work. For example...

    - Sometimes could get car into gear without clutch but would cause damage over a period of time and based on how close to matching revs and transmission durability. This seems like would require data for car or manual configuration via UI or text files or requires vmod online, etc.
    - rev matching would allow shift without clutch
    - response curve - what's that?
    - Etc.
    - Etc.

    Being in the SW development business, I think it is important to thoroughly define exactly what desires are for clutch software to do and also prioritize clutch features as, if IsI thinks that subset of features will nit be acceptable then they might not do anything at all but maybe just requiring clutch use to shift would be better than nothing.

    Also, what is the possibility of a grinding tranny or the other rf1 mod mentioned in this thread being done in rf2 by modders instead of ISI? Also please comment on those solutions and whether they meet requirements. Those of you in SW development should list bronze, silver and gold-plated solutions that are acceptable.
     
  14. DrR1pper

    DrR1pper Registered

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    The clutch pads can be model for accumulated wear during a race depending on how well you look after it (or not).

    Response curves are just ways to change the linear nature of an input (steering angle, pedal input, etc) into a non-linear input at the software end. This is already available for the steering wheel and pedals with the "sensitivity" slider that makes the input-curve exponential.
     
  15. O11

    O11 Registered

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    Oooow, yeah. Forgot about the turbo model. That is a great one actually.
     
  16. 88mphTim

    88mphTim Staff Member

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    Who exactly is questioning it? We're not...
     
  17. kotakotakota

    kotakotakota Registered

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    I'm also really excited for this realistic clutch option. Tim, I know you guys don't promise dates or things like that, but (assuming that such a thing IS in fact coming) can you at least tell us if this would be coming "soonish" or "not soonish"? :D
     
  18. 88mphTim

    88mphTim Staff Member

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    Work hasn't started on it yet, it was actually put off due to something else, so soon probably isn't a good description. :(
     
  19. kotakotakota

    kotakotakota Registered

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    Aww, alright. Well, thanks for the update, and I hope whatever the other thing is is just as cool :)
     
  20. Moe Faster

    Moe Faster Registered

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    I drive a 1300 Honda VTX and a Dodge Dakota pickup truck with a 5 speed, I also had a Saab 9000 Turbo with a 5 speed . . . yea, I'll have some realistic clutch in my sim, thank you very much.

    OK, here are some thots

    I've heard it called feathering the clutch and the application would be a car stopped on an upward sloping hill. With the car in 1st gear, while holding the brake a driver must slide his foot over to press the accelerator pedal slightly to add a few hundred RPMs while slowly releasing the clutch just enough to engage the transmission to halt the rearward/downhill movement of the car without moving forward, actually matching torque and engine RPMs (plus a few more because it just feels like I need it.) I've had some very scarey moments learning how to do this.

    As long as there are adjustments in the Garage (hopefully) or the Settings that allow the free movement of the clutch power band and some telemetry on the subject to show shift time and clutch engagement, I think we will be able to manage. Currently, there is a plugin that shows accelerator, brake, and clutch pedal movement, add one more bar that shows transmission engagement (perhaps some better defined auditory responses) and I think that would facilitate setup and play immensely. being able to make that go away too, seems a bit busy/redundant after initial setup.

    I have always thot that the stick shifter should be FFB. I have some software from as far back as 2003 that will make any FFB joystick into a FFB Stick Shifter. but I desperately need a gateway to guide the stick to the finite position of the particular gear or the software must get more hard core.

    a FFB clutch doesn't do anything for me, I just don't see the potential for any useful information. I was all of 16 years old and weight about a buck fifty the first time I ran into a full up RACING clutch. it took ALL I had to get it down and was left somewhat concerned as to where I was going to land when it finally overcame my left leg. OH YEA, there is some information there . . . FATIGUE.

    As soon as you can get to it Timbo, I'm sure it'll be alright, and I will try again to get some of those pins removed from that voodoo doll (don't see how you could even walk if you know what I mean). :cool:
     

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