Please S397, share the physics files and the tires of your cars.

shiet said:
I would be happy if I could load DLC tracks in devmode to finetune the AI. I don't want to do anything with the track itself.
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Offtopic: Just make SCN file pointing to all the encrypted mas files. This works fine here:

SearchPath=.
SearchPath=SpaFrancorchamps_2020
SearchPath=SpaFrancorchamps_2020\layoutEndurance


//-------------------------------------------------------

MASFile=COMMONMAPS.MAS
MASFile=SpaFrancorchamps_2020\ASSETS\assetsAnims.mas
MASFile=SpaFrancorchamps_2020\ASSETS\assetsGMTs.mas
MASFile=SpaFrancorchamps_2020\ASSETS\assetsMAPs.mas
MASFile=SpaFrancorchamps_2020\ASSETS\assetsMaterials.mas
//-------------------------------------------------------

MASFile=COMMONMAPS.MAS


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gianluca said:
That's the point, 95% of the people who make car mods don't know how to modify properly the RF2 physics .ini files of the car depending of it's different characteristics (engine position, weight distribution, tire model, etc.) and they keep using as a base for their mods the old rfactor 1 files, or the files of the early ISI cars, that can be decrypted. And this is true specially for the guys who want to start with rfactor 2 modding, but don't come from a rfactor 1 modding background.
The Studio can't share the exact data used in the DLC cars for licensing reasons? Fine. Then at least provide few car models more beside the SkipBarber, with different characteristics, to use as base. Don't give them the name or the shape of a real-life car and make it available somewhere: in the moddev folder or in the forum.
If someone wants to make a car like the Delta Group A rally car, moving from the SkipBarber without having the documentation that explains to you how to modify the files to adjust the engine and gearbox position and height in the car, how to add and set the 4WD, etc. is quite complicated. The new guys just give up or end up putting a new 3D model over the Megane.
Either they provide a complete detailed step by step guide, or they provide a good base for the most common type of cars to start from. Otherwise the modding support is just for the graphics. I mean, time ago there was the dev blog diary of the Brabham BT44 by Michael Borda, but it seems disappeared. Can't find it neither in the internet archive.
And this is the only material provided for the physics development:
https://docs.studio-397.com/developers-guide/car-development/car-physics
The old ISI 2012 pdf about car modding regard mostly the 3D model and how to get them in game.
The rest is in the side notes of the SkipBarber ini files (that aren't complete and not sufficient).

There is nothing about how to adjust the physics. One can only search in the forum and hope for someone's help. But even like that, most of the times, it's just guessing and not complete information.
That's why providing some ini files of the new cars is important for the modding community.
You can't share the same exact tgm of the Mini? Then share a basic dry/wet model with the same size, that can be used for all the other cars similar to it, or even for other Mini versions. Would be miles better than having to adjust the Clio tires, that are too different.
Click to expand...

@yoss did put a lot effort in it, the website just needs a refresh but in my opinion it's full of great info.

http://yoss.free.fr/rfactornfr/Modding_Tutorial_Website/PhysicsGlossary.shtml

I agree that a more recent car would help that is documented in the code.
 
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Frederick Alonso said:
Offtopic: Just make SCN file pointing to all the encrypted mas files. This works fine here:
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No need for this. Just copy the whole track to devmode/locations and put alle the mas-files into one drawer. No need for changing something in the scn
 
gianluca said:
:)
I wonder what secret data could we find inside the files of the Mini. A 70 years old car, with no electronic, with a rat nest in the trunk and for which we have every possible mechanical manual.
Sharing the tgm and tbc files of the car won't give S397 any trouble.
Click to expand...
It would allow people to use S397 work potentially for their (third party) profit.
"building" an accurate mod involves a lot of work and a lot of knowledge.
I don't think it's abnormal for that to be protected.
I even understand the fact that they don't release the new tyres (even if encrypted). I would prefer they did, but understand why they won't undermine their DLC sales by providing the best tyres in the business for people to simply produce mods which would compete with their product.
 
I used to ask for a tgm/tbc database quite regularly a few years back. We did get a few examples to use but only limited sizes, and no street tyres.

I also used to ask for a recommendation library of which shaders to use for paint, chrome, rubber, metal, glass etc.

Another thing I requested was a front end icon creator in Dev Mode.

Alas, nothing really happened so I gave up.

Bearing in mind rF2 has been heavily propped up by mods over the last 10 years, there's still very little help for modders. Most of it actually comes from the modding community, not the devs.
 
dylbie said:
I used to ask for a tgm/tbc database quite regularly a few years back. We did get a few examples to use but only limited sizes, and no street tyres.
I also used to ask for a recommendation library of which shaders to use for paint, chrome, rubber, metal, glass etc.
Another thing I requested was a front end icon creator in Dev Mode.
Alas, nothing really happened so I gave up.
Bearing in mind rF2 has been heavily propped up by mods over the last 10 years, there's still very little help for modders. Most of it actually comes from the modding community, not the devs.
Click to expand...
Without questioning what you say, I believe we should remember that S397 has been a fairly small team which had trouble just to keep rF2 afloat, so for them to document stuff for modders, would always be something extra, on top of their stretched workload.
 
r Factor 2 has had several advantages over the years but has also been saddled with some incredible shortcomings. So one of it's greatest strengths vs other sim has been the tire. Over the years and over several iterations, the tire file has been head & shoulders above most other sims. So it is being proposed that S397, for the benefit of modders and thus end users, release all the details of the tire so that modders(and COMPETITORS) can copy.
 
gianluca said:
I mean, time ago there was the dev blog diary of the Brabham BT44 by Michael Borda, but it seems disappeared. Can't find it neither in the internet archive.
And this is the only material provided for the physics development:
https://docs.studio-397.com/developers-guide/car-development/car-physics
Click to expand...
Oh, good grief. The dev blog diary is still out there, you just haven't bothered to look for it. It's in the same place it's always been since S397 began managing rF2 development, at the very beginning of the News pages.

Hello and welcome to our new physics development blog – Studio-397
Updating HDV and TBC files – Studio-397
Engine model and gear ratio restrictions – Studio-397
Diffusive Adhesion and Planar Compliances in Build 1098 – Studio-397
UltraChassis (Chassis Flex) – Studio-397[URL='https://www.studio-397.com/2016/06/ultrachassis-chassis-flex/']UltraChassis (Chassis Flex) – Studio-397[/URL]
Steering System, Force/Torque Distributions, and Some Little Bits – Studio-397
Tyres… The Big One. (Part I) – Studio-397
Tyres… The Big One. (Part II) – tTool & Batch Testing – Studio-397
Tyres… The Big One. (Part III) – Realtime Model Batch Tests – Studio-397

A short break in articles and then we have
Return of the development blog, point-based accelerations for TGM (QSA) analysis. – Studio-397
rF2 Physics Calculator Rejuvenated – Studio-397
Off the beaten trail. New off-road tyre features. (Build 1110) – Studio-397
tTool (realtime model) tyre analysis improvements (Build 1110) – Studio-397

If you consider these articles to be important to your modding effort, I suggest making yourself a local copy since you seem unable to find them when they haven't moved in the past 4.5 years. Now get to work on understanding what is out there.
 
davehenrie said:
r Factor 2 has had several advantages over the years but has also been saddled with some incredible shortcomings. So one of it's greatest strengths vs other sim has been the tire. Over the years and over several iterations, the tire file has been head & shoulders above most other sims. So it is being proposed that S397, for the benefit of modders and thus end users, release all the details of the tire so that modders(and COMPETITORS) can copy.
Click to expand...
The competitors are iRacing, ACC, AC, AMS2, Raceroom, Project Cars. These games use a different tire model and the developers pay the licenses and can get the same details that are sold to S397. What would be the advantage for them to see the tgm of the McLaren GT3, if they decided from the go to use a different tire model and use also a different physics engine. Even if some sims use an evolution of the RF1 ISI engine, it's now different from that and different from the one used by RF2.
And, again, most of the tgm of the tires used by the RF2 cars are available online. If that would have possibly caused a legal problem or the risk of sensible data being stolen by greedy modders or shady competitors, ISI would have removed them long time ago.
What is the risk for S397 to share a basic slick or road tire, with dry and wet alternative, with the same size of the ones used by the Mini, but not identical to these? The risk that I can choose a Mini made by the modders instead of their paid DLC?
 
gianluca said:
...
What is the risk for S397 to share a basic slick or road tire, with dry and wet alternative, with the same size of the ones used by the Mini, but not identical to these? The risk that I can choose a Mini made by the modders instead of their paid DLC?
Click to expand...
maybe the risk that everybody can see their faults?
 
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