Stefano Casillo actually read THAT 3D on racedepartment and just...get mad about it. We don't know what happens to Camaj when he read some kind of posts here...
Oh wow You just described most of the people in here. You write a piece on why you think rF2 physics are superior and the differences in 3 sims Historic F1's and the effects of under-steering into Variante Ascari at full speed............ What do they do ......? ....they bag you, call you a troll and a fanboy. and this is on ISI's own site ??? lmao rof lol Like wake up Australia !
You guys can argue until your blue in the face on whats the best racing simulation out there, there simply isn't one. Not everyone takes there virtual racing experience on the same level as us hardcore sim racers. I used to be so bias about other sims but I just got over my hill. I buy them all now. Infact I'm going to purchase dirt Rally in a bit. The only thing I expect out of it is to have fun. I keep Rfactor 2 to myself, AC and Pcars come in handy when I want other people to try some racing but don't want to degree of difficulty to takes to even do one lap in Rfactor 2. Asseto corsa appeals to the masses just like Pcars does. They are easy on the eyes, sounds nice, and easy enough to jump in and have hours of drunken fun with without even having any type of experience at all. Feels like what the average joe racing game driver thinks it should feel like. People who only want to race, just want a representation. They don't care about tire deformation, temps, and phyics, they just want to hop in and get a kick. They don't care about doing 200 plus laps of practice trying to get another 1.5 sec off there time. I own AC as well, its fun to show off with people who don't care much if its realistic or not, I've had a lot of people sit down at my PC. When I load Rfactor 2 they are impressed with it, however its degree of difficulty usually turns them back to AC. Sim racers are a very very small breed unfortunately, and the simulations we use are mostly unheard of. We will always be out numbered by the masses. No sense of beating a dead horse guys.
Totally agree and that's where a lot of my AC hours have come from, messing around and having a laugh with mates. It's just the usual hard thing that we see...something like PCars winning awards and being called by lots as the most realistic racing experience ever, when we sit here with a few other excellent options, raising our eyebrows at it. I see it with motorbikes, there are people who seriously think that their Harley Davidson is the most powerful bike around, and the best thing to ride ever, yet most "normal" roadbikes will beat one off the line with ease. Not to mention vibrate less, have better comfort, mileage, grip and cornering ability. I don't care about it normally, ride what you want, but if I'm talking with someone and they state something like that as "the troof", I get a little rankled.
Well, how much grippy is too grippy? Similarly I felt the rF2 IndyCar is too grippy too. it might be the way is supposed(?). the latest build AC improved a lot. I drove the Lotus 72 this weekend and like it a lot! Of course the FFB feel is still miles away from rF2. The car dynamics is excellent:, though: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDgo2YOHifo
What an almost eloquent way to say AC is almost a simulator. When people try rf2 and call it difficult is because they load a clean track surface? Well, in rf2 when I load an already rubberized track all the driving is straight forward. Meaning you only need to know the optimum racing line around that specific track and push the throttle. Just because a part of the player base doesn't care what's underneath the simulation model doesn't transform it into proof that the game isn't a realistic simulation. And the opposite can be said for sims that are "hard". In fact, I don't find rf2 hard at all, especially when the tracks are already grippy. I can corner and push the throttle without worries. For example, on the "hard sim" subject: "iRacing made the sliding/oversteering harder to control, too make the simulation more serious. iRacing is hard to master, because iRacing wants the sim racer to have a competitive simulation. so the sim racers can compete their racing skills to each other. And because its hard to master, people drive in it for years or even for ever and dont want any other racing simulation. Realistic physics ? Yes and No. Lets say the Physics are insanely well made, compared to real life physics. In realife you have much more time to correct a slide and your car has much more grip. sometimes its funny how easy it is in iRacing to spin out. But in the last update they added a new tire physics model. now you have a little bit more grip but its still not the same as in real life. All in all is iRacing the best racing simulator because its interesting and never bores you out."
Totally agree with your first sentance. It's a passive-aggressive way of saying AC is simple, for the masses, and not a sim while RF2 is a true sim because it's more difficult. That overall statement couldn't be further from the truth; more difficult doesn't neccessarily mean more realistic/accurate vehicle dynamics and kinematics, from from it.
In fact, I have not seen people categorizing it easy; talking about the new comers to sim racing. New comers to driving a car at 18yo when taking driving school lessons also find it difficult, but then adapt and it becomes a natural thing. Then when they get a bit older they do some race track driving and find it difficult again. But that's until they learn the technique for driving or racing on a race track. The type of people which categorize AC as easy are people that are used to older generations of sims (and certain newer ones too) where it was unnecessarily hard to drive the cars like are driven in real life. rF2 is grippy enough, especially when you have optimum range warm tires. So I don't see what can actually be difficult here; given that you know how to control road/race cars, driving cars isn't a difficult task. It only becomes difficult when you are competing cars against other people, but that's the nature of competition.
Driving a car is not hard. Driving a car to it's limits is not hard either. Driving a car to it's limits consistently, without killing yourself, that is hard.
Really? I wish I was as good a driver as you... I had the record laptime in my F2000 real-life season out of about 30 people but not on one single lap throughout a year of test days, practice sessions, qualifying sessions, and race sessions did I ever lap within a second or two (I can't remember, either 1 or 2) of the ultimate theoretical best laptime the car was capable of which our race instructors could manage just about any day. Also, when world-top up-and-coming real-life drivers came to the track (eg. Marco DiLeo, James Hinchcliffe, and many others), they would be on that top pace within the end of the first day or maybe 2nd day (each day consists of 4 20-minute sessions - about 17 or 18 hotlaps each). So, if your definition of "the limit" means the theoretical ultimate laptime of a vehicle (or within a very small % of it), then, no, it's not not hard to do so even once let alone alone consistently but rather extremely difficult for most people. On the other hand, if by "the limit" you just mean maybe reaching the theoretical vehicle's limit for a second or so during (Eg.) part of the braking phase or exit phase (getting on the power), then, yes, I agree, it's easy for anyone to periodically reach the limit even if you're lapping 10 seconds slower, just smash the throttle or lock a brake or add way too much steering lock and you will eventually hit the limit for a very short period of time. In-terms of pure laptime driving (ie. racing) it's extremely difficult to get to the limit for even 1 entire corner let alone 1 lap let alone, as you rightfully pointed out, consistently.
Yep, and that definitely depends on your interpretation of what the limit is. It isn't hard to push a car too fast into a corner, wash the front out, then push it hard on exit and battle with oversteer. Technically, the tyres are being pushed over their edge, you may be "on the limits". How many guys screech the tyres at a trackday and think they are well pushing it... But it's that skill of being able to juggle the car around, transferring the weight where you need it, and keeping it balanced so nicely lap after lap. And that's where the reward comes, for me at least. Having that dancing feeling with the car while putting in nice clean but fast laps. It just feels damn good haha! Where you know you are really pushing it, with the car slithering around, but it all seems so calm (sort of). And then the 30 laps fly by and you sort of "wake up". Personally, that's where I've found it in rF2, where I get a big feeling of depth in each corner, like I could do things differently and still have a good result, provided I'm in tune with keeping it balanced. I have been doing lots of races with the flat 6 around different circuits, just done 4 at the Nurburgring GP. Each time I was trying to take the corners in a different way, and just seeing the effects on the laps, the car and the tyres at the end. One race I'd push the entries and give up some exit, see how it turns out, then I'd try a race going for as high mid corner speeds, keeping the lines very even and smooth. Then I tried late apexing the corners that I could, seeing much more exit speed and higher top speeds. Then I shortened it down to a sprint and made the AI faster and had a hoot of a time trying everything under the sun to keep attacking and defending XD If you find your little niche like I seem to have, and it fills you with the same emotions and feelings while driving, then it doesn't really matter what anyone says, because people can't take that from you.
AC physics are pretty good, but then it's actual simulation is entirely average (no rain? no manual pit-limiter? no launch control? just to name a few), but then it has free online multiplayer, but then the game is split over multiple processes :S, but then it has a fully customisable hud and easily scriptable "apps", but then you can't move them past a certain point vertically on the screen... It has ups and downs. But then to answer the question of the physics I don't think it's terrible at all, some of the stock cars I think have quite average properties (no way a stock nissan GTR would slide that much on an optimal track, even on cold tyres). I just think that the most popular servers are drift servers says a lot, something's not entirely right, but at the same time some cars are still an absolute joy to race, spend time tweaking set-ups and have quite passable physics. I do think it is a shame that mod makers flocked to it for the updated graphics, and I really doubt it would be anywhere near as popular if not for that. (Going off topic now.) Hopefully the stable of rF2 cars/tracks continues to grow and if ISI pumps out a rF3 (please not for quite some time) they make it backwards compatible this time as surely the graphics quality from rF2 assets will suffice for quite some many years to come.
Okay.. but then this? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ke9RoFrXOA start watching from 0:35, don't skip over that part. (true, it was over an year ago).
oi Spin .........I pity anyone can't pick what sim is the best for them, more so talking and dissecting the same sims for 4 years and still being no closer to a answer. Shame ....shame. hehehe Someone saying they drive 3 sims and they are all kinda just about the same and all as good as each other makes my head swim. Bollocks Who is arguing ? imho rF2 is the best feeling sim to drive I have ever driven. Whether no one on this planet believes that I could not care less ! You believe in yourself not logic like yours or you will never truly like anything.
Will you guys please move past this "silly" discussion. Every time the subject of RF2 and AC come up, it ends the same way. Go buy what you like, drive it and stop with these ten year-old style comparisons. It's getting just a tad bit old. You don't have to 'down' one to make the other better. They're both good in their own right. "Move on already"
Don't you think people that push points of view with data and explanations only college students understands, graphs and replays and real life compares for years on end can be even happy with anyone sim. How can they ever perceive one as best. I swear on my Dad's grave the first ever corner I did in rF2, ( F3-Eve at Belgium Eau Rouge from pits ) I was simply overwhelmed. Then I crashed very hard at Les Combe .................. and Burnville and Malmedy and all I could think is " how awesome !@! " .................... lmao Not a day goes by in 4 years it does not continue to amaze me in new ways all the time, it never ends, simply nothing before has ever had this effect on me. So I rather think that for 4 years then search for a holy grail that already exists in each our minds sub conscious. Whatever sim/s it is, accept it, I bet you be happier for it.
maybe modders have been playing around with miles sound system for ages, maybe they need something new, maybe modders want to show their talent on some graphycal aspects ,and they are still waiting for things included in Rfactor 2 advertising in 2010 like rain over whindshields , damage layer in the cars and so on.... vertex? about online? i am idiot, i admit it, a lot of times i have been not able to open a server with the car we choose on the circuit we choose and have fun with my friends online. i am idiot, but i can do it in the rest of games , on some of them is just two clics, on others 20 clicks but is easy enough for idiots like me. rFactor 2 is still the best racing simulator, im not sure about the best driving experience, and is the only one in the market who can give you 100% racing simulation , on day, night , wet and dry conditions. you can think whatever you want and say whatever you want about the rest of games/sims but they are growing and some of them uses recent tecnology that will give them the chance to improve even more. Each day they are more close to rFactor 2 and the true (or my true) is that AC is not way far from rF2, is right now a couple of steps away. as soon as they offers rain, it will be only one step.
