We know the HDR pipeline and HDPs like our own pockets but now we're focusing on automation because static HDPs are tuned to work just on the specific set of data hosted in the .gdb file, infact they're now considered a legacy feature. There are not magic values nor IRL values as HDR it's just a image processing pipeline working on dynamics. You can play with HDPs for years and getting hundreds of amazing profiles but no one will works for all tracks and all cars, so the automation (which is still an open Task for us) it's the only way to go if we want the game looking the same, in terms of colors and lights, between all combos. Not saying our automation will process the image as the Tosch one because functions are pure math and they can't be changed per track, but for sure that's what we want to find the balance and get rid of the HDP creation loop.
This is great. And the latest version is better (best yet). But you must hurry to get to a state where it can be locked down and then tracks updated as necessary. Otherwise we will just have a different set of abandoned third-party tracks with mismatching/ugly lighting off into the future. Modders are not willing to re-do their tracks every time a global/core adjustment is made. At least half the tracks we have are already abandoned/orphaned. And few have properly done lighting. There are only one or Tosch's out there and your solution correctly recognizes this, but we need it to not come too late.
That's kinda myth. As you see Tosch is changing day by day the Nordshliefe HDP profile without redoing the entire 2D asset to match a new profile. We're also working our own tracks using actual automation, just following the albedo rule, and we can easily move between different HDR values without screwing up everything. If, and when, artists are getting overdo texture reactions or crazy colors, it's mostly because they're producing diffuse maps with wrong color palette (aka full reds, full greens, full whites, high luma, super contrasts etc) and/or pushing too much with HDPs values. Working with Albedo maps instead standard diffuse means removing sunlight from it, reducing the overall exposure down to at least 1 stop and avoiding too aggressive contrasts. The albedo map will be then compensated by the HDR+tonemapper, since you're working with balanced values. Paradox of this myth is HDPs profiles are introducing LOADs of variables between textures, colors, contrasts, white point ranges, gamma, sky palette etc... and this means the artist may go nuts in finding the balance. Automation is going to solve this mess. Just use albedo maps instead standard LDR diffuse maps, and let those maps working inside a balanced HDR automation. I of course agree with you about to lock the feature when finished.
As long as you know Tosch is experimenting with these things, but almost no one else is. And by the way, Tosch's most recent image from above doesn't look particularly realistic to my eye, but it does look attractive and balanced. So when you look at it, the scene appears calm and harmonious, which is the key to successful graphics since we will never have a truly realistic presentation. I don't see a particular colour or texture that immediately stands out as unrealistic, out of balance with others around it, illuminated when it should be shaded or vice versa--things that plague many of the existing car and track combinations. Even one relatively small item out of whack ruins the immersion because the brain immediatley screams "digital fakery." If we could just get something like that now for the majority of tracks, most of the whinging would cease.
How about a competition? Your new automated hdr profile against my antiquated legacy profile. You can choose the track. Poll decides. When you win, I shut up and don't spam the forum with hdr stuff. When I win, you don't lock the feature.
I understand that the idea makes you uneasy. But I am still wondering how ISI released a build 906 with a version of automated HDR that ruined in a big way all ISI tracks (and third party) even the newest released in fanfare. Build 910 didn't solve the problem, and every one that downolads the demo before buying the product is welcomed with this nuked look, I suppose they just uninstall demo and go back to AC or GSC. Those who go on, write astonished posts in the forum about graphics, thinking they have some graphic setting wrong. Current users change their monitor settings if they have a dedicated rig, or drive from bumper cam if RF2 is not the sole program running on the computer. With current build all my tracks are running with legacy HDR (they weren't before this build with a few exceptions), when automated HDR will work reasonably well, I will gladly switch back to automated HDR. Do you have a schedule for fixing over exposure in cockpit view? Thanks.
Yes. The changes introduced around build 900 were the first steps of that plan as we have said before.
Good to hear, although comparing images from b880 to b906 there is no improvement in cockpit lighting, the difference is still striking in images below. Complex automation system and albedo maps are all for nothing if it fails to produce balanced colors at the most important camera view (in-cockpit). I would pick up Tosch' profile anytime if it ensures more natural cockpit view and works on 90% of tracks. View attachment 15580 View attachment 15581
No really. Tosch is doing what we're doing when we release teasing shots. Sit down, find the perfect HDR spinner pack.. and print that shot. Unfortunately this is like thinking you can make a movie about Africa just taking a picture of an elephant. Doesn't work sorry. We all know we can get great and dramatic screenshots spinning HDR values per shot (just try yourself) but we want all those values spinning automatically to make the game looking coherent and balanced out of the box, no matter the combo, no matter the latitude, no matter the time of the day. That's the point yes. There is no ANY competition between Automation and profiles per track. There is no a single track HDP profile giving us a magic formula. No One. Tosch is the first who knows that aspect as he released TONS of profiles and they're looking all different. Even all these shots he's showing us are all different in terms of balancing, colors, contrasts, etc... I would say the competition I see is Tosch VS Tosch, as it were for Tuttle Vs Tuttle at the time of Dunsfold (I was literally addicted with HDR profiles). We need to move away from that crazyness. Cheers.
Agree Tuttle, don't get yourself into a competition just let ISI do his magic to give us the best experience possible. But do it as fast as possible
That's what I expected. You can continue with your lighting experiments, like you have done in the past two years. I have no problem with that, but please don't remove the support for legacy hdr profiles until you have something that creates a consistent lighting over the whole day and not only from 8am to 10am/2pm to 4pm.
I agree. I would love perfect automation, but as long it is not perfect it is great that artists can create something, that works great on their track no harm done to anyone only good for us end users.
+1. The colour of the driver suit shouldn't affect the lighting of the track from cockpit view as it is the case I suspect.
When I said to Collins "I agree to lock the feature" I meant lock the automation when finished and then stop fighting with those spinners forever, not the legacy support of HDPs profiles. They're now legacy because we are not producing HDPs profiles per track anymore, but you can still work on it. If a day they'll be removed, but honestly I don't know, will be because we are sure about that move. I really don't get the point to be provocative with us (as you're lately), since we are working hard to make things working better instead sit down and let artists going nuts with their own profiles and then make everybody crazy to understand why their local track installation looks different from USER A, and why USER C looks too dark at the same time of the day, and then waiting for the USER B to post a video with a rubbish profile to prove our platform looks dated etc etc etc. Tosch, everything you do is VERY welcome. The job of tuning you're doing on this track is amazing considering the very old source involved. Nobody is going to limit your creativity. What I personally find less "nice", is when someone start suggesting ISI is working like he has no clue about what it's doing, meanwhile somebody over here feels ready to teach our own coders to re-write the whole engine they created from scratch. Just do your job and have fun.
No doubt it will get fixed, but "fast" is relative, considering that HDR automation was released a year ago. This overexposed cockpit issue has existed since day one with rF2, that is, 3 years and a couple of weeks as of now. Instead of waiting for HDR to be finished (by the time I'm probably old and have kids), I will enjoy my days as bachelor using Tosch HDR profiles instead of nuclear bomb cockpit view.
I really hope we'll close that big task before that time... These are few examples (two different cars) of what we're doing with the new HDR plan (which includes automation), see how the overexposure issue will be eradicated from it (sorry for the size, forum limit it seems); View attachment 15585 View attachment 15586
Coming back a bit to the topic. I will take part in a bigger race on this track and we thought about which starting procedure to use. A full formation lap would take a lot of time and doing a formation lap on the GP track and then a rolling start after a GP only lap would probably lead to crashes at the short cut tire stacks. My question is: Would it be possible for you guys to create a "diffrent layout" where a standing start will happen on the döttinger höhe like on the tourist version? This way you could pick up the cars with a Safety Car, split them by car and do a manual VLN/24h rolling start. I think that would be perfect for immersion and leauge usage
Very good news, congratulations. Knowing the problem is acknowledged and solved, we can wait the build that will bring the goods patiently.
