MMOS - Parameters meaning.

Discussion in 'Hardware Building/Buying/Usage Advice' started by lagg, Feb 29, 2016.

  1. lagg

    lagg Registered

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    Hi all.
    I've bought an OSW and i hope to have it in a ¿couple or three weks? (we'll see)
    I've downloaded the MMOS and i don't understand how to configure it.
    I'd like to understand the parameters when the OSW arrives.
    I've been looking for info about the MMOS, but it's not being easy to find it.
    I ask for your help to clarify the parameters of the MMOS.
    I hope this will became in a good guide to help the owners of the OSW.
    I'm going to write the concepts that i've found (only a few).
    Please correct me if any is wrong.
    And correct me if something isn't well explained, because the english is not my native language.

    [​IMG]

    • Steering Angle: Group related to the Steering angle of the wheel.
      • Rotation: Steering angle of the wheel.
      • Center Steering: Useful to calibrate de center of the wheel. If the wheel isn't centered in rF2 we can calibrate it centering it and pressing this button.
    • Steering Stop: Group related to the force applied to stop the wheel when you have used all steering angle.
      • Gain: Max force of the engine to stop the Wheel.
      • Max Force: Max % of this force given by the engine.
    • Force Settings: Group related to the filter of the FFB.
      • Overall Filter: Smoothes the FFB.
      • Min Force: smallest amount of force the wheel can give.
      • Max Force: Highest amount of force the wheel can give.
    • Device Settings: Grupo to configure tthe Discovery Board. The Discovery Board provides the communication with the PC. This is recognised by Windows (7, 8 y 10) as a Joystick USB device and manage the FFB of the engine.
      • Setup: To configure the engine parameters.
        [​IMG]
        • PWM Mode: To select the PWM type.
        • PWM: Pulses frecuency.
          Nota: PWM Pulse-width modulation. It's used to control the direction andposition of the engine.
        • Enable Force Led: ???
        • Encoder CPR: Cycles per revolution. To write the encoder resolution.
        • Reverse Encoder: ???
        • Use Encoder Index: ???
        • Report Combined Pedals: ???
        • Analog Axes: ???
        • Buttons 1-16: ???
        • Buttons 17-32: ???
        • Shifter: To select the type, if we have connected a shifter to the Discovery Board.
      • Shifter: To connect a shifter to the Discovery Board.???
      • Buttons: To connect buttons to the Discovery Board.???
    • DFU Mode: ???
    • Effect Filter: Group related to configure the filters applied to the effects.
      • Damping Filter: How much the filter smooths the Damping effect.
      • Friction Filter: How much the filter smooths the Friction effect.
      • Inertia Filter: How much the filter smooths the Inertia effect.
    • Desktop Effect: Effect that is on when you are not in game. This effect doesn't affect to the game.
      • Dropdown: To choose between the effects (Off, Spring, Damper, Friction and Inertia).
      • Amount: Multiplier applied to the chosen effect, that is added to the general effects.
      • Saturation: Limits the effect to the percentage selected in the slider. This percentage is applied to the Amount selected before.
    • User Effect: ONE ADDITIONAL effect you can superimpose to the Effects of the wheel. This effect is applied by the Driver independently of the game.
      • Dropdown: To choose between the effects (Off, Spring, Damper, Friction and Inertia).
      • Amount: Multiplier applied to the chosen effect, that is added to the general effects.
      • Saturation: Limits the effect to the percentage selected in the slider. This percentage is applied to the Amount selected before.
    • FFB Configuration: Group to manage the different configurations.
      • Dropdown: List of configurations where you can select a previously saved config, or add a new one selecting the "Add config..." item.
      • Load: Load a configuration previously saved.
      • Save: Save the current configuration.
    Concepts:
    • Spring: is a force opposing the wheel rotation. Spring torque is proportional to wheel position (zero at center, max at max rotation angle)
    • Damper: is like a viscous force that "smooth" the rotation of the wheel, so much probably is proportional so rotational speed (faster you try to rotate much damping you feel).
    • Friction: should be a constant force opposing the rotation.
    • Inertia: is a force opposing the start of rotation, so it is max when you start rotating and then decrease to zero.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 9, 2016
  2. Korva7

    Korva7 Registered

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    "Steering Stop" is about how wheel stops when you have used all steering angle. Because there is no mechanical stoppers it's done by forcefeedback.

    "Min force" smalles amount of force the wheel can give
    "Max force" Highes amount of force the wheel can give

    "Effect Filter" (Damping Filter, Friction Filter, Inertia Filter)
    These are separete filters for Damping, Friction and Inertia effects.

    "Overall filter" filters all forces icluding Damping, Friction and Inertia effects.

    "User effect" Effects that is on when you are in game
    "Desktop Effect" Effects that is on when you are not in game

    Here is tutorial for osw: http://ascher-racing.com/wp-content/uploads/OpenSimwheel-Tutorial.pdf
     
  3. lagg

    lagg Registered

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    Thank you very much Korva7.
    A couple of questions.
    ¿How do the Damping Filter, Friction Filter and Inertia Filter work?

    I supose that the "Desktop Effect" is used to check the wheel when you are not in game (to config it), and the "User Effect" to check it with the game. ¿Is it true?
    But i have to choose only one between the different options (off, spring, damper, friction and inertia). Can i config only one of the effects? This is weird, no? Or i'm missing something?

    I had seen the guide but i've not been able to find the info to answer my questions.
     
  4. lagg

    lagg Registered

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    Thank you for moving the thread to the correct forum.
    And sorry.
     
  5. Led566

    Led566 Registered

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    Disclaimer: what I'm writing here is solely based on my thinking and experiences with my OSW+rF2 and AC.
    Please don't take everything written below for true and real.
    Anyone who has a better understanding of the driver functions please feel free to correct me.

    My understanding of the meaning of that sliders is "How much of damping/inertia/friction effect MMOS driver ADD to the FFB signal from the simulator"
    I.e. damping/inertia/friction amount is calculated by MMOS from the original FFB signal, multiplied by the relative slider % and then added to the FFB signal itself.
    So the first thing to do is to put those sliders to 0% this means MMOs doesn't add anything to FFB from rF2.
    Then you start playing with the sliders and try to find the best combination based on your feelings.
    I've added some of them all (5-10%) otherwise the feeling is not "natural" to me.


    I'm using Desktop Effect = Spring so the wheel is always centered when not in use.
    User effect is ONE ADDITIONAL effect you can superimpose and I guess is based on wheel position only (my wild guess here...).
    I'm using some damping or friction depending on the mod.
    Generally speaking is better to leave it to OFF.
    But I find it useful in AC to get rid of the way too springy feeling.
     
  6. lagg

    lagg Registered

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    Thank you Led566.

    Some questions.
    • You say "I'm using Desktop Effect = Spring so the wheel is always centered when not in use". Does it affect when you are in game?
    • The User Effect can be, Off, Spring, Damper, Friction and Inertia. Is it the same to increase the Damper, Friction and Inertia here as in "Effect Filter"?
    • You say "User effect is ONE ADDITIONAL effect you can superimpose and I guess is based on wheel position only". Do you think that these effects has nothing to do with rF2, and are applied by the Driver independently of the game?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 2, 2016
  7. Led566

    Led566 Registered

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    1. Not at all, as Korva said, the effect is disabled when you launch rF2.
    2. My take on that is: NO, the effect is different because is calculated in a different manner (based on the wheel rotation only, my wild guess!) AND has the Saturation slider (this fix the max effect applied i.e. if you put the saturation slider at 10% you only get 10% max of the effect, when the effect is above 10% MMOs only apply 10%).
    3. Yes. This is pretty sure if you ask me.
     
  8. Led566

    Led566 Registered

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    Click on dropdown, select "New" from the dropdown list. Write a name on the dropdown (es. Apex Porsche, etc.), change all the parameters you need (mainly you need to enter the correct steering angle for the mod) and then click Save.
    Next time you'll load the Apex Porsche mod in rF2, just select "Apex Porsche" from the dropdown list, click Load and you're done.
    This is MANDATORY with rF2 because the sim cannot communicate the correct steering angle to the driver.
     
  9. lagg

    lagg Registered

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    Thank you Led566 :)
    And what is the "Desktop Effect" for?
     
  10. Andrew_WOT

    Andrew_WOT Registered

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    Korva7 gave the most correct answer.
    - Effect Filters are just filters, that is smooth out effects delivered by sim, you have individual control over damper, inertia and friction. Or you can just use overall filter that controls them all.
    - User effect - you can choose one "in-game" effect. I think most just use damping.
    - Desktop effect - just for testing user effects outside the game, they are not active once in sim.
     
  11. Led566

    Led566 Registered

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    So why if I put those sliders to 0% I don't get no effect at all?
    No damping, no inertia, no friction?
    And, as far as I know, rF2 doesn't feed Mmos with those "canned" effects.
     
  12. Andrew_WOT

    Andrew_WOT Registered

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    No clue. But this is how it works with everything else. Are you sure you are not talking about Effect saturation slider?
    Easy test:
    - ramp up FFB to 100%
    - set overall filter to 0%
    - set desktop Friction Effect to 100%, you should start getting pretty nasty buzzing/vibration in the wheel
    - move Friction Effect Filter from 0% to 100% and observe if buzzing changes.
     
  13. Led566

    Led566 Registered

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    Always at 100%, then I use the ingame FFB multiplier.

    This is a torque setpoint smoother, nothing to do with FFB force.
    It represent the number of samples the driver use to smooth the setpoint. Range 0-31.
    I use 2-4 to avoid some "spikiness" I have if disabled (0 means disabled).


    This (desktop AND user effect section) works as you describe (?), the more you increase the slider the more you feel the friction force, the inertia force, the damping effect.
    So, in my case, it works in the SAME WAY of the Effect Filters section sliders:
    0%= Effect Off; 100=Effect at 100% (and so on, as a matter of fact you can go over 100% on those sliders).

    In other words my understanding is that Effect Filters section sliders works exactly like the sliders in an audio Graphic Equalizer.

    But I repeat, maybe I'm wrong with this section, could be just wrong feelings I have plus the fact that rF2 don't really use those effects...I will do some more testing with AC.
    Informations about the MMOS driver in the virtualracing.org forum are sparse and very difficult to find, because the MMOS thread is ginormus.
    If you have some link to relevant info please report here, would be very beneficial.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 3, 2016
  14. Andrew_WOT

    Andrew_WOT Registered

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    My message was on how to TEST Effect Filters, not recommended settings.
    Sounds like you are a bit confused on Effect Filter vs Effect itself.

    Effect Filter just smoothing the corresponding Effect, 0 - no smoothing, 100 - full smoothing.
    Anyway, it's not a rocket science. Make the change, observe the result.
     
  15. lagg

    lagg Registered

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    If i understand it correctly.
    The more the slider of the effect is, the more effect in the FFB is (more effect).
    The more the slider of the filter is, the more smoothing in the effect is (less effect).
    Is it correct?
     
  16. Andrew_WOT

    Andrew_WOT Registered

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    Yes, it is my understanding.
    In additional to Ascher's guide there is also some explanation on MMos settings in this guide https://www.dropbox.com/s/ry9t85eldwmya32/BuildGuideonProjectBruteForce.pdf?dl=0

    This is the best I've found to date. I was nagging people on iRacing for something more substantial to no avail.
    You can also ask MMos here http://forum.virtualracing.org/showthread.php/92420-DIY-USB-Force-Feedback-Controller
     
  17. Andrew_WOT

    Andrew_WOT Registered

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    This is interesting find. Where did you get it from?
    Wondering how Effect Filters work then, as based on your description it sounds like it is better to keep Overall filter at 0 in order to not lose samples, and just address the grittiness at Effect Filter level (again, not sure how they work).
    Need to test this out.

    Thanks

    EDIT: Actually after rereading I think there is no loss of samples, it's a number of samples over which smoothing is applied. Never mind.
     
  18. lagg

    lagg Registered

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    I've been a bit busy.
    I'll update thec first post asap.
    Thanks for your help in this thread.

    Enviado desde mi HUAWEI GRA-L09 mediante Tapatalk
     
  19. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    Interesting, I didn't know overall filter is basically a master slider that applies damper, spring, friction and inertia all at once. I thought overall filter was completely different in that it was sort of like what the smoothing option in RF2 does...
     
  20. Andrew_WOT

    Andrew_WOT Registered

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    Yep, OP just got it wrong, as name suggests these are Filters, even MMos confirms that http://forum.virtualracing.org/show...k-Controller?p=2125826&viewfull=1#post2125826
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 6, 2016

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