[REL] Latest Update: Nissan GT500 2013 v1.2 Now Available!!!

Discussion in 'News & Notifications' started by Christopher Elliott, Feb 1, 2017.

  1. Marc Collins

    Marc Collins Registered

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    OK, after some more seat time, I can conclude that this car does not feel as planted and substantial as the USF2000. It should, however, feel heavier, because it is a much bigger car. It also still has remnants of the light rear end syndrome of many older rF2 cars...again that was thankfully gone in the USF2000. The interior sound from the left speaker is clearly too exaggerated. It should be offset just a bit, but the source of the engine sound is not literally to the left of the driver.

    A nice improvement, but still needs one more update :)
     
  2. whitmore

    whitmore Registered

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    This car is a little odd for a car twice the weight of a Skippy or the UFS 2000 when off throttle rear suspension unloads just like a skippy. This simply should not be the case for a heavy sedan type car. The FVR V8 is a good example of how a heavy sedan should feel off throttle.
     
  3. D.Painter

    D.Painter Registered

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    Not a good start for Studio 397 with this car. Sounds, Physics, Graphic, All not to flash.
    For a Christmas present it's one you'd want to re-gift! Or return it to the store for your money back. Hahaha....
     
  4. whitmore

    whitmore Registered

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    Lucky this is not a AC forum or we would already be banned LOL
     
  5. stonec

    stonec Member

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    On the other hand it's free content. If any of the other major sims obtained a license for Nissan GT-R, it would be branded as paid DLC instantly. Also the car model itself is built in 2012 or 2013 when the first previews were shown by ISI. I think the planned DLC stuff will be a step up on all fronts.
     
  6. Korva7

    Korva7 Registered

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    I find it weird how much you guys trust to your expectations on how this car should drive.
    There is lots of different things that has effects on how a car behaves, but you are only thinking the weight of the car.

    Imo there is no reason to suspect the realism of this car especially. There is some older cars that seemed to have some measurable physics inaccuracies (shown by tire temps), but this car don't seem to have those.

    I like this car now quite a lot. After i began to pay more attention on my pedal inputs, i found this car to have nice amount of adjustability.
     
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  7. TJones

    TJones Registered

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    I really can't follow you guys, even former "less good" (and i think all agree here), didn't get such of a negative feedback.
    For me it's a great car, drives good especially with soft tyres, handling with default setup is very nice, not to easy not to difficult, just like i would expect such a car would handle. Maybe the tyres are still a little bit to hard in general, even the softs did work pretty well on a, as a tyre consuming know'n track, like Matsusaka. I think i should run into troubles here, with soft compound. Ok, this may change, when S-397 include variable track surface temperature and the influence on tyres. :)
    My impression of the sound isn't that negativ either, the exhaust of the car is placed on the 9 to10 o'clock position, relative to drivers head, also the whole sound scale seems to be dominated by exhaust.
    I tried now with speakers and with headphones, and both didn't geve me a strange or unconfortable experience. For example watching external view in replay, gave me stronger volume shifting as a car passes by.
    Possibly configuration of my 5.1 sound system plays a role here. Placement of the speakers are not optimal because of local conditions (furniture ...), so relative to my head my spaekers are places at FL:11 o'clock, Mid: 11.5, FR: 1, RR: 4, LR at 8 o'clock. Also software settings (volume, timings) might plays a role, but should match here.
    Only thing i would tweek would be more variance of volume, depending of throttle position and revolution of engine, so a bit increase with full throttle and high revs, like i wrote earlier.

    Again for me a very good mod (close to USF2000), and a fun-machine.
     
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  8. D.Painter

    D.Painter Registered

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    I get it's free but so are a lot of other third party car mods that a better then this one. Licensed or not.

    As far as the Clay model goes I don't have a issue with it. It's the Mapping, Texturing that fails really badly here. There's 6 texture to make up the Rims, One set, Not both when 2 would have done. The car body mapping is, well I've described enough about that disaster already.

    Being free is no excuse for what's been done to this car.

    Driving it, I found the rear was jealous of the front and always wanted to lead. Tried all sorts of things with the set up to try and settle it down but nothing seamed to work. I used a old rF1 trick on it. Detach the rear ARB. Locked it up and put it on rails just like it used to in rF1. Free? True.
     
  9. hitm4k3r

    hitm4k3r Registered

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    The car is great to drive, relatively easy and I don't know where you guys see big issues, so if you need to detach the rear ARB to fit it your driving style then go ahead and do so. The question is whether you will be fast enough and if the car stays responsive enough. I also don't get the comparisons with the USF2000. What makes people believe that it should feel like a USF2000?

    Sound issues have allready been mentioned and need to be fixed asap. With headphones it feels like driving a car with mono sound, so please test this properly next time you release an update. Makes me wonder whether you have testers with head phones testing that stuff properly. Something like that shouldn't slip into updates, especialy not after the negative feedback on sounds after the first release.
     
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  10. Rony1984

    Rony1984 Registered

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    I can't relate to the negative experiences here regarding the handling of this car. For me, on a T300, it feels fantastic right out of the box, with incredible depth to it. With the default setup is maybe a tad prone to oversteer, but that's about it.

    Thanks to everyone involved with bringing us this beast!
     
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  11. Marc Collins

    Marc Collins Registered

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    No one is saying it should feel like a USF2000 that I can see/read. The USF2000 was "perfect" out of the box. Authentic and high quality graphics; authentic and high quality sounds; authentic and high quality handling; authentic and high quality FFB. It doesn't have properly modelled damage, but since everything else was so good, it get's overlooked. The GT500 was far from perfect out of the box and even after a major update it still has a few glaring problems. That's the comparison.

    For me, the USF2000 felt like a new generation of rF2 car. It felt like an AMS car transported into the superior rF2 environment, but a car that handled authentically in all possible driving and racing situations.

    The GT500 feels like a decent rF2 car, but it still suffers from too light a rear end and a series of other problems with sounds and templates. It is a let-down because I personally thought the USF2000 was a sign of a new direction and quality standard that would appy to all new cars and eventually make its way back to update the existing ones. Looks like that idea was a bit optimistic :(

    Back to the comparison. In AMS, if I drive a light car and then jump in a heavy one, even blindfolded and with no sound on I could tell which one was the heavy car and which one was the light one. All the cars feel like they were simulated in a consistent sim-universe. Is there a single person here who thinks the GT500 feels like it comes from the same sim-universe as the USF2000? Of course, they probably do not in reality. The GT500 has been hanging around ISI for years and the UF2000 was not.

    The detached rear ARB "fix" is a bad sign from the past. Not a terminal problem that cannot be addressed, but not a good sign of improved quality, either.
     
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  12. Lgel

    Lgel Registered

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    Sorry I don't share your feelings, but how a car feels is not objective, depends a lot of what you recreate in your head.

    I don't expect a GT500 to be a very forgiving car to drive compared to an endurance GT.

    I reduced rear wing compared to default to balance tire wear. The car has a lot of downforce, so behaves quite differently at low speeds.

    I share hitm4k3r view " The car is great to drive, relatively easy and I don't know where you guys see big issues".

    Cheers.
     
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  13. stonec

    stonec Member

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    Niels talks in this video about some inertia bug carried over from rF1, which they fixed in AMS. If I remember correctly, you had to use fudged inertia numbers on some axis (a bit higher than real values) to get realistic results. Many rF2 mods also seem to use this approach (notoriously enduracers mod went a bit too far with it by plugging in totally fictional inertial values). Basically every mod I've driven since rF1 times tended to feel "heavier" than the corresponding stock ISI content. The same trend is also with sims, rF1-based sims like R3E tend to have lighter cars, whereas cars in AC or LFS all feel heavier.

    I can't answer for sure whether this is still a bug in rF2 or whether ISI fixed it, but its' an intriguing question. I don't know who does physics for S397 so might be difficult to get an answer on that now when ISI devs are gone. I agree that the USF2000 feels more in-line with reality regarding the inertia, but it might just be a happy coincidence with this car.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2017
  14. Lgel

    Lgel Registered

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    Sorry see post above, I have no problem with too light a rear end, nor do I feel I drive a light car.
    Doesn't mean you are wrong and that I am right, I just state that feelings are very subjective.

    Cheers.[/QUOTE]
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2017
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  15. nipzon

    nipzon Registered

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    Come on Studio397, fix the sound issue, it's spoiling the drive.
     
  16. hitm4k3r

    hitm4k3r Registered

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    The problem is, that this whole discussion relies alot on subjective impressions, different hardware and at the end on different driving styles. I personaly don't need to detach the ARB to get a good feel for this car and it feels pretty planted out of the box. So there is nothing to "fix" for me in that direction. If I wanted to improve the car more towards my driving style I would make it even edgier as I have more issues with understeer out of long sweaping corners. I tested this car on a soaked wet track and I had zero issues with oversteer even out of slow corners. Out of the Hairpin at Suzuka I had no issues applying throttle in wet conditions and could easily correct it in first gear when the rear end started to step out a bit, wich is to be expected in wet conditions in a high downforce car at slow speeds while applaying 500 plus horsepower. Also the light vs. heavy argument makes no sense at all. A light car with really stiff suspension and hard tyres might feel alot heavier under loads than a heavy car on soft suspension and soft tyres in rF2. I think you are a bit confused how the FFB works in rF2. Not only the weight of the car has an impact, but alot of other factors like spings, tyre construction, suspension geometry, body rigidy, steering system etc. It's not as simple as saying this car weighs more, so it has to feel heavier on my wheel. Just compare the Panoz roadster and the Kart ;)

    So yes, I personaly feel that this car comes from the same universe as the USF2000 and I am sure that I am not the only one.
     
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  17. Ronnie

    Ronnie Registered

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    No, you're not.

    Same observations here. Out of the box the car doesn't have enough front end for my taste. I can quite easily get it to sharpen up it's behavior with "few" adjustments. I used to be a very, very understeer-liking driver, as this very old video shows:


    It all started to change once rF2 came out. I suffered a lot from humongous tire wear, handling issues etc. Transition to a new driving style is a painful process but if you put yourself through it, it will pay off with some extras on top of it. Now my driving style I consider it to be "Go where I'm pointing exactly and we will be friends". In other words I want my car to be as positive on front end as possible. I want to make as little steering and pedal movements on entry as possible, clipping an apex and launching myself out of the corner even if it means some fighting with a steering wheel mid corner and on exit.

    Why am I telling you all this? Just to give you an idea how much your habits, your "hardcoded" reflexes have influence on what something feels like. There is one saying that I really love: There are no understeery or oversteery cars, only drivers that make them understeer or oversteer. The best way to fix a car is sometimes... to fix yourself. Being flexible, driving everything that has wheels on it, different characteristics give you sense of versatility. You can be so surprised when you come back to a long no seen car after lots of practice with many other machines and feeling that you've improved yourself, changed in some ways and find a car that you always hated is now your new found love. GTR GT500 is a very rewarding beast that once you understand both setup-wise and driving-wise it keeps on giving and giving even more.
     
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  18. stonec

    stonec Member

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    I don't think @Marc Collins meant FFB when he was talking about weight of the car, at least I don't refer to it that way. The FFB in rF2 is normalized so that every car at 100% FFB will output roughly similar numbers of force, so you are right in that FFB weight tells nothing about weight of the car. What I was referring to was the inertial weight, the one that defines how resistant an object is to a change of direction. In rF1/rF2 mod makers typically fudge the inertia values higher than specced to obtain a heavier feeling of the car. This light car problem is a leftover from rF1 and is not technically part of this discussion, but the phenomenon is more obvious on a car like GT500 that should have a certain feeling of weight.

    My point is that it's probably nothing that S397 in particular did wrong with GT500. They could fudge the inertia numbers like modders do, but that wouldn't be the correct approach. The light-weightness issue has deeper roots in pMotor engine.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2017
  19. MarcG

    MarcG Member

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    I didn't think the GT500 was a heavy car to start with, essentially it's fairly light, from a quick google search 1,020kg. A DTM car (again quick search) is 1,120kg and I've always considered those cars light due to the way they feel like a Go Kart with a shell when I drive them. A car like an Aussie (V8)Supercar is heavy coming in at 1410 kg and that is what I drive it like...like it's a heavy car.

    Are people getting a bit carried away with the GT500 being Big therefore it must be heavy? Or am I missing something?

    As before though; feel, drive ability & FFB (amongst many others) are all highly dependant on the User and their rig, after all you can put two world class drivers into the same car and they both come back to the garage with completely different opinions. That's why Devs prefer to listen to the Race Engineers who actually give them the numbers to work with, actual matter of Fact numbers not just the opinion of a Driver.
     
  20. I_Bellett

    I_Bellett Registered

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