Obviously this isn't to start any bad mouthing of each party involved, but more to have mature discussion about the differences and opinions of each physics direction. I think we can safely say that there is a slight difference (especially in ffb) between ISI and s397s cars, and this could be as Tim quoted "working more closely with manufacturers" to be the cause of this. I also think maybe s397s cars are more forgiving at the limit, which doesnt always mean these are not realistic. Also obviously the cars created by each have their own characteristics so, its not a completely fair test in all. With the general direction of sims lately and the more realistic approach (being that cars are actually drivable at the limit), i truly believe that a hardcore sim experience doesnt mean the car is impossible to drive - and s397 have maybe got closer to realism than ISI have IMO. The end of the day we cant thank ISI enough to set the ground/base for an amazing sim, and pretty much set the benchmark for other sims to follow, just maybe rf2 has evolved into something more realistic in terms of physics. It would be nice to maybe see an overhaul of physics in the older cars. Although this would mean a closer look at the manufacturers data, which most likely is inaccessible now. Anyway please discuss away and keep it civil..