ISI Planning to convert RF2 from DX9 to DX10 or DX11 like iRacing did?

[DreamLAN Master]

I think this would be a great opportunity for ISI to get a few more sales with the release of VR support. With the limited amount of titles available for VR currently this could've got them to the top of the short list of racing sim titles that are available to work with VR or even shorter list a sim titles working with the Vive.
The longer they wait to release support the more likely they simply will be lost in the crowd later.
I think the only 2 titles that support the Vive are Live for speed and Project Cars. I played LFS for less than an hour, because it made me nauseous, but still was pretty impressed. But with PC I've logged several hours in it and everytime I get into it I'm just amazed by the technology and I just keep waiting for the announcement from ISI that VR (Vive) support is coming.

 

[elbo]

I for one have done something I haven't done in 10+ years...namely buy a sim made by someone else than ISI. I picked up AC because of the VR support and I also held my nose and picked up a subscription for iracing. So there you have it two sales based on VR implementation alone. You have to think that ISI would likewise pick up some costumers if they implemented it. I certainly miss playing rf2 and its awesome simulation of autoracing but VR puts me in the car like nothing else.

 

[Euskotracks]

I think this would be a great opportunity for ISI to get a few more sales with the release of VR support. With the limited amount of titles available for VR currently this could've got them to the top of the short list of racing sim titles that are available to work with VR or even shorter list a sim titles working with the Vive.
The longer they wait to release support the more likely they simply will be lost in the crowd later.
I think the only 2 titles that support the Vive are Live for speed and Project Cars. I played LFS for less than an hour, because it made me nauseous, but still was pretty impressed. But with PC I've logged several hours in it and everytime I get into it I'm just amazed by the technology and I just keep waiting for the announcement from ISI that VR (Vive) support is coming.

Iracing and AC are already giving support to VR as well. So it is ISI the only one among the big racing titles the only one NOT giving support to VR.

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[Euskotracks]

If rF2 looked like (insert whatever) and still did everything else the exact same way it does without even a fraction of frame loss, I think some people's lives might change and possibly not for the better. I am not talking about ISI, I mean anyone (myself included) who might not do much else but rF2 all day.

No comment. If you think you have a point good for you

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[stonec]

Yep, that's my understanding as well. Automobilista and Raceroom are DX9 and don't support VR as well. LFS does through some workaround, but it seems to not work very well with DX9 apps. So any DX9 app will probably never get full VR support, at least not for Oculus that already dropped DX9 from their SDK.

 

[Euskotracks]

Those title offering VR support, use DX11 as that is what is needed for the VR to function correctly. At least that is my understanding. Please correct me if I am wrong.

From my understanding (at present) that means ISI will have to completely overhaul their graphics engine, and last we heard from ISI was the cost to benefit ratio was not favorable. Should that change, then VR support would likely follow.

Yep, that's my understanding as well. Automobilista and Raceroom are DX9 and don't support VR as well. LFS does through some workaround, but it seems to not work very well with DX9 apps. So any DX9 app will probably never get full VR support, at least not for Oculus that already dropped DX9 from their SDK.

It is clear that the decision of staying in dx9 is a major issue today in order to implement VR support. That is the reason why I posted in this thread. An unfortunate past decision which is showing its consequences today.

Now that we can see the benefits of dx11, I wonder which are the plans of ISI regarding VR in the short/mid term.

As a rF2 and VR enthusiast I would expect some feedback from ISI in terms of WHEN do they expect to be ready to provide VR support and if it will be included in rF2 or in a new title (rF3).

Will ISI reply?
I am still waiting...

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[Will Mazeo]

Serious question: why would you want VR support to drive with smoke, dirt and rain going into your cockpit? That would probably look horrible in VR.

I wish ISI would change its business model tho. Release rF 2 2.0 so you won't lose the licenses update all that is needed and start selling DLC if that means more money to improve it faster.

 

[Depco]

It is clear that the decision of staying in dx9 is a major issue today in order to implement VR support. That is the reason why I posted in this thread. An unfortunate past decision which is showing its consequences today.

Now that we can see the benefits of dx11, I wonder which are the plans of ISI regarding VR in the short/mid term.

As a rF2 and VR enthusiast I would expect some feedback from ISI in terms of WHEN do they expect to be ready to provide VR support and if it will be included in rF2 or in a new title (rF3).

Will ISI reply?
I am still waiting...

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I believe they did reply... When they said that there were no "immediate" plans to add VR support.

Truth be told, ISI makes a top notch simulation. However, they are not very good at anticipating and implementing graphical/hardware advances. They had to be dragged to steam kicking and screaming. (slight exaggeration, but still valid point) They chose to stick with the aging DX9 when DX11 was available at the time of their development and we now see the problems it is bringing. THe point can be made that ISI could not have predicted the explosion of VR back in 2009 so they should get a pass on that. But the flip side is that once it became obvious VR was a thing they still chose to ignore it and carry on with their other development. I think they made some lame excuse about the SDK changing so often that they didnt want to waste time developing using the DK1. Then they said that they did not get a DK2.

Their window of opportunity had passed them by before they even knew there was a window to be opened.

All this may be moot as they are likely working on their next title "not rF3". I suspect that they may have decided to simply build a new game to capture the VR/DX11-12 experience. ISI did say that the things developed in "not rF3" could be added to rF2 at some point. Whether this will become transparent to the end user or not remains to be seen. They probably dont want to enter "early access" again like they did with rF2.

In the interim I'll happily do my laps in rF2 and goof around with my google cardboard until something more substantial arrives on scene.

 

[Euskotracks]

I hope that today they have a better reply than "no immediate plans to implement VR in rF2 or a new title". If not I would be really disappointed with ISI's lack of perspective.
Thats why I ask again.

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[Marketcrash16]

Serious question: why would you want VR support to drive with smoke, dirt and rain going into your cockpit? That would probably look horrible in VR.

I wish ISI would change its business model tho. Release rF 2 2.0 so you won't lose the licenses update all that is needed and start selling DLC if that means more money to improve it faster.

I created a thread questioning their business model and it was quickly deleted. They don't want to do DLC but have no problem charging an annual fee so that my ethernet cable is useable. Also, relying on the modding community to provide content as opposed to largely producing your own is not a wise business model.

 

[Woodee]

I created a thread questioning their business model and it was quickly deleted. They don't want to do DLC but have no problem charging an annual fee so that my ethernet cable is useable. Also, relying on the modding community to provide content as opposed to largely producing your own is not a wise business model.

So all the FREE dlc on their download page is not enough for you?!

We are being SPOILED in rFactor 2... rFactor 1 only had about 6 official cars.

As for deleting a thread questioning their business model... they have a good idea of what is working and keeping them in business, rather than forum users that have no idea what is going on behind the scenes (as much as they think they do) and in their accounts. They will do whatever is best for their business interests, we may not always agree with their decisions (mainly because we don't always know why and it's not really any of our business).

When you think of how much the price is... the price of a few cups of coffee? All the DLC from them, FOR FREE... I reckon it's a great deal for the money!! If you can't afford it, do what most people do... be patient and SAVE your money up until you can buy it.

 

[Will Mazeo]

So all the FREE dlc on their download page is not enough for you?!

We are being SPOILED in rFactor 2... rFactor 1 only had about 6 official cars.

As for deleting a thread questioning their business model... they have a good idea of what is working and keeping them in business, rather than forum users that have no idea what is going on behind the scenes (as much as they think they do) and in their accounts. They will do whatever is best for their business interests, we may not always agree with their decisions (mainly because we don't always know why and it's not really any of our business).

When you think of how much the price is... the price of a few cups of coffee? All the DLC from them, FOR FREE... I reckon it's a great deal for the money!! If you can't afford it, do what most people do... be patient and SAVE your money up until you can buy it.

You just missed it pretty bad

 

[Woodee]

You just missed it pretty bad

Wow..... so witty... congratulations!

It was on point... talking about the business model they have chosen, you questioned it. I explained what we have, yet it seems you still want everything but what you have.

 

[stonec]

Yeah they do listen and change their mind, in particular with this Steam thing. This is what was said in Q&A about Steam distribution less than two years ago:

I don’t think we would ever give up our own system completely, the margins are substantially higher and the flexibility is great.

And now we are offered a Steam only download from next build onwards, so things do change.

 

[Will Mazeo]

Wow..... so witty... congratulations!

It was on point... talking about the business model they have chosen, you questioned it. I explained what we have, yet it seems you still want everything but what you have.

No... it was not on point. Read it all again 1000x and maybe you'll get there. Shouldn't be necessary honestly..

We need to accept it for what it is and just let go of our demands. I was happy to buy rF2 as a 32 bit DX9 game back in 2012 and whatever it turned into was just icing on the cake (so to say). It's still the very best Sim game on the market, dated DX9 and all.

This kind of comment make you look like you want rF2 to stay where it is and never grow or attract new people or improve. Users complain and demand because they CARE (I'm glad ISI seems to know this).

 

[Lazza]

No... it was not on point. Read it all again 1000x and maybe you'll get there. Shouldn't be necessary honestly..

You questioned ISI's strategy of 'relying on the modding community to provide content'. Have you not seen how much content ISI have provided? Did you not see all the complaints about having to download all that content when moving to steam?

 

[Woodee]

You questioned ISI's strategy of 'relying on the modding community to provide content'. Have you not seen how much content ISI have provided? Did you not see all the complaints about having to download all that content when moving to steam?

I already said this and he said I missed the point... I guess "people miss the point" on things he doesn't agree with.

 

[Euskotracks]

Bla bla bla but still no news from ISI regarding their future plans.

The worst part is that even if they were planning something I am afraid they would not tell. Probably no to hurt actual rF2 sales through steam.



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[Associat0r]

Everything regarding DX11, VR and future plans has already been cleared up a while ago.

https://www.facebook.com/simracingf...=1720104114880252&comment_tracking={"tn":"R"}

Tim Wheatley:

I have to say, I don't know where that comes from when everything said is saying the opposite.

"We will continue to develop rF2 into the foreseeable future."

"Things we are working on now may be folded into rF at some later point."

What that means? Still working on rF2. What does the other mean? That basically the way you might get things like DX11 and Rift will be from people paying us to do it, via commercial licenses and the like. Those could then come back into the rF2 product. Oh no, how terrifying.

​

http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.php/28455-At-ISI?p=417673&viewfull=1#post417673

Tim Wheatley:

I voted I'm getting VR on that poll.

The Q&A didn't contain any "never" that I remember.

​

 

[Euskotracks]

Everything regarding DX11, VR and future plans has already been cleared up a while ago.

https://www.facebook.com/simracingf...=1720104114880252&comment_tracking={"tn":"R"}

​

http://isiforums.net/f/showthread.php/28455-At-ISI?p=417673&viewfull=1#post417673

​

Sorry, but you must be very used to listening to politicians talking and saying nothing at the same time.

What Tim is stating there, is basically pretty much saying nothing. At the same time he is saying that work is being done in rF2 but at the same time that they would require new incomes to implement dx11 and VR.

But regarding the second he is not saying if they are working on it (active position) or waiting for some big racing team to out the money(passive position). We don't have even a rough time scope to look at (1 year, 2 years, ...5 years?)

If for you that is clarifying things I can tell that you are an easy person to satisfy.

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