Indy car and IMS Now Available

Adrianstealth said:
... At least a couple of hours ( if all aids off ) to start to feel the limits of a sim car
(mainly the speed in which we can turn corners) and then a nice progressional learning process after that is great in a simulator ...
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Exactly, as long we rF2 simracers aren't super humans and the US of A doesn't have alien technology I would have expected an experience more like this:



EDIT: Beside these questions. IMO ISI did a wonderfull job - Thank you!! - I'm confident and trust ISI with finishing more of the rF2 base technologies like real road, tyre patch .. this will get on the top of the most realistic racing simulations!
 
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After spending some time with the road course configuration car, I have to say awesome work ISI! Absolutely fantastic! Both the track and the car look stunning.

I do have similar feelings about the cars handling, as some other people have been saying, regarding rear grip (obviously entirely subjective, as I have never actually driven a DW12). For me its as though the car regains grip too easily once it starts sliding, especially if you give it some throttle too. Here is a little video which I hope maybe illustrates what I mean, I'm pretty sure this should have ended worse for me, maybe I underestimate this cars capabilities, but it just somehow doesn't quite feel natural in these circumstances. :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9byrcfHmy-8&feature=youtu.be

Also a couple of minor things I noticed. The Kriterium sponsor on the rear wing of the blue car is upside down.

View attachment 12916

and also (although perhaps this is intentional?), the tyres on the car, in the upgrades spinner thingy, show both slick and treaded tyres.

View attachment 12917

Other than that, superb job. Loving every second of driving these beasties, rF2 just keeps getting better and better at the moment!
 
One question regarding the grip :

The DW12 never ran at the old layouts of the Indy road courses, so we have no comparison to make. However, as the 2014 circuit was quite fresh when they ran the race, it's fairly likely it still wasn't as grippy as a surface as it will be once it has a little wear on it. Is there a possibility that ISI either knowingly or mistakenly have the track grip set to match the 2013 circuit that IIRC, they also surveyed originally? If so that may explain why we are a bit faster if the track is a bit grippier. Watch the Bourdais lap when the track was fresh to see just how slow a non grippy track can be.
 
I'm just trying to convert my rF2 Indy 500 lap times to a traditional average speed in a manner equivalent to the way IndyCar does it at IMS. It brings up some questions about timing and speed for the sim vs reality. Lap timing for the Indy 500 has been traditionally expressed in average speed rather than in time. But rFactor2 uses laptime and there is no translation to average speed even for this track. Now, the track's length is always given as 2.5 miles or 4.023 km as reflected by the track loading screen (actual conversion is 4023.25m). However, the XML results files generated by rF2 for Indy 500 express the track length as 4057.9m. That's a 34.5+m (113+ft) difference.
QUESTION 1 then is this: Is 4057.9m the distance upon which Indy 500 lap times are based in rF2?
QUESTION 2 is this: What distance are lap speed averages based on in reality at IMS?
The reason I ask is that a 40 second lap over 2.5mi (4.023km) distance results in an average lap speed of 225mph while a 40 second lap over a distance of 4057.9m would be nearly 2 mph faster. At Indy, that is not insignificant, in fact that's the difference between pole and 8th or 9th on the grid.
 
hiya Paul

i watched a small clip of the vids

the 1st one is in the wet, but I think your referring to how the driver manages to correct the car

the 2nd is a commentator referring to grip but not actual grip levels etc
(you have to just hammer it etc dosn't really mount to much credible although it sounds good I guess )


the best thing to do (IMO) is watch onboard vids and watch the driver inputs on the steering wheel & listen to the engine & how cautious the driver is on the accelerator through the corners etc I know there are other variables in play -but collectively over a few vids it offers some indication of the cars characteristics
 
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Domi said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDpSjrdPlxc

Even better if we compare to the same Indy track :P you can see pleeenty of steering corrections while being on throttle.
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some examples here , when combined with wheel inputs I think it shows how on the very edge the driver is
---------------------------------

+

best from about 1.30 when driver not so boxed in etc + look at how much rubber is down on the track , also I'm guessing long beach is high downforce
+ looks to be a very dry day

http://youtu.be/aGayPXe4gRA

p.s I'm not a professional at this, just trying to make logic of my own impressions of the sim version etc
 
I'll just say that you can't tell how on edge a driver is by steering input. :) the car movement, possibly.


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Hello
How can one come even close to compare unless you have the exact setup track conditions on and on.
All this is just guessing

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Default setup is understeer city, doesn't even have a RARB on it. No wonder people are saying too much rear grip. Not saying my opinion either way since I've not put in enough seat time and haven't looked at any data yet.


Talking roadcourse version.
 
Again, for me at least, it's a matter of setup, driving style and how much you push.

Going through first, second and sometimes third gear I do not feel as though the car's on rails. Not at all.
Plenty of throttle management is needed to keep the car pointing straight.
 
hexagramme said:
Again, for me at least, it's a matter of setup, driving style and how much you push.

Going through first, second and sometimes third gear I do not feel as though the car's on rails. Not at all.
Plenty of throttle management is needed to keep the car pointing straight.
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Couldn't agree more. I spent just over an hour last night at the new road layout testing.

The default set understeers so bad so I got to work making it more positive.

The result of this was a car that had very tail-happy tendencies out of the slow corners. Admittedly I have nearly dialed that out with throttle control and other settings.

Honestly if I had to sum up my impressions it would be that this DW12 is a brilliantly balanced and very drivable vehicle.

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Old car didn't run with a rear ARB (used as an ARB) on road courses ever so there's no guarantee the new one does either. Then again the rF2 default setup has the front bar detached too so it's pretty floppy in general. Not to mention about the wussiest diff settings possible. Maybe if you went to like 75% locking you could actually get it to move around in 2nd instead of being able to go 100% throttle anywhere with no wheelspin or movement.

Car shouldn't have a diff at all on ovals by the way. Aero options are a bit lacking for that side but if the data is limited it might not be able to be helped. Also echo that the car scrubs off speed too forgivingly and accelerates way too easily at well over 200mph at Indy. Seen people come out of the corner at 210 with no tow and hit 230.

Don't know why the max fuel capacity is 54L which doesn't even convert to a .5 increment in gallons when the IndyCar rulebook is in imperial measurements. Always seen it stated (and done elsewhere) as 18.5gal/70L.

Reason the front wing droops too much is it's mounted too high, the things are one piece that is bolted to the underside of the nose cone (the entire thing came off intact in Dixon's crash today) while the rF2 model has it going into the sides much further up. There's a bunch of other visual inaccuracies, the most blatant being that the car only has one rear wing main plane no matter the track or configuration yet the rF2 ones are somehow completely different (hint: the speedway one is more accurate), the sides of the tub being too round, rollbar thickness, and width of certain front wing parts. Missing the rear wing camera pods too.

Can't tell when the car is in the limiter because there's no sound for it and the digital display is missing features generally. If you could get that thing filled in properly, stop using the bottom lights as shift lights, and implement the flashing near red line it would be great.

Other than that it feels about right and goes around turns and sounds nice enough. Looks bloody impressive running around Mid-Ohio in a replay. Hopefully with a more aggressive setup it's really fun.


Indy road course is quite nice, oval could perhaps use a little work, particularly in the corners beneath the white line. Noticed the oval is using the 2013 infield and the 2014 road course has no curbs on the oval so I'm guessing off of previous indications the track isn't exactly completely finished with.
 
Eric the Pale said:
I was under the impression that the "3rd spring" takes over the job of the roll bar. However, I could be quite wrong.
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It has more to do with controlling aero load and allowing you to run softer main springs, think the difference between bouncy old prototypes (IMSA GTP etc) and modern LMP cars.
 
I am not so into the indycar thing, but isn't there a thing called push to pass?
Is it simulated in rfactor2 or possible to use?
 
Tim Wheatley said:
I'll just say that you can't tell how on edge a driver is by steering input. :) the car movement, possibly.


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I'll just say the guys can't compare real steering with virtual ffb steering. Sorry but it is far away from that, dynamic wise, at least with some ****ty game controllers. It is a silly comparison, and i'm just reading about accel grip but not about lateral accel grip levels.

Does that mean just longitidunal grip is off for some because they are not able to spin the rear while using a highspeed transmission config.

Sorry but a bit odd it seems to me, even i don't know Indy Cars, it seems very logical to me that this cars with the given config can't be accel like a car with lower V-max/highspeed but power and I think which continues to be the main reason before the grip level are the gear ratios/ torque bandwidth for this impression.

The transmission/drivetrain is strange. I've tested different combinations and I find it translates very long, to long. The car has not enough power for this gear box as it seems. In the reality it was like putting a transmission from a 200Hp car in a 100HP car where it is not able to reach V-max/highspeed, because the ratio and torque bandwidth are doesn't match.

edit: but who knows, maybe that is the config the cars really use, i really don't know.
 
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