How do you know the car is hitting ground or bouncing?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Stefan_L_01, Nov 20, 2018.

  1. davidporeilly

    davidporeilly Registered

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    If you look at the infra red camera feature on TV broadcasts of F1 it illustrates very clearly what happens.
    Front tyres: The camber is optimised so the tyre load and so heat spread is even across the tyre at the highest cornering loads. That's what camber is for, so when the chassis leans over and centrifugal forces fight the tyre that at the highest cornering loads the greatest possible contact patch is achieved.
    With camber on a straight the inner edge runs hotter.
    Rear Tyres: camber is less as the tyre has to perform more in a straight line (power delivery).
     
  2. Stefan_L_01

    Stefan_L_01 Registered

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    Ok but you start from temps coming from straights, inner Edge runs hotter- if you enter the turn quite hard, whouldn´t you expect a raise in temp in all Areas by same amount, keeping the "straight line" Gradient (just add dT everywhere) ? Ok, the hotter area cools down faster (gives Energy away) so in a loooong bend Maybe you reach equal temps, but in a short one? And even if you achieved best contact for the fastest turn, that does not mean fastest lap time because there may be slower ones where you do not have the aerodynamic downforce, thus reaching the Limit earlier - and you may optimize your tire for those Areas gaining more than in one single fast turn.

    So ... tires are difficult, but covered quite well by the telemetry Output allready and also the ingame hud (custom Plugins could do better but we are waiting…). Data is there, whether it is correct is a different Story. I think the gt3/gte tires do quite well regarding temperature Distribution.

    But I would like to know more About ride height and Suspension only. Because if you hit a Limit there, you may loose slightly grip, get hotter, get more wear, spin and so on. I mean, did I spin being too stiff at the rear or being too low??? simple Question - but do I see the answer in any kind of data?
    Edit: and correct damping!!! Anybody found a correct damper settings by telemetry? Me not. You see oscillations even with max. dampers

    After all, like in gp2/3 (even if limited but hey, that was Amiga time), developers should ask themselves what data/info do the Player Need to optimize their Setup and thus optimize their Speed. If they´d do they hopefully will find the Right answers themselves
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2018
  3. enduser

    enduser Registered

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    Guess how many people in the world care about ride height of the car in the air inside a garage... :)

    Until now i thought motec plugin covers this area but now i m confused.

    As you see there s still no clear answer, so dev input would be very welcome, eg. saying that this will be covered with our built-in telemetry, no reply probably means same as now pretty much, only integrated in the game ui which will be a very big step forward no question.

    What me and op propose doesnt ask for the existing code to be redone or change how ride height is calculated, instead collisions already exist in game and as simple as hitting a barrier, so my guess is that its not very cumbersome to implement a HUD feature showing when the car touches the ground, which can cover even tarmac bumps and whatnot vs ride height which doesnt, wouldnt you say its very efficient?
    Even if theres no exact modeling of the car's undertray its still very useful and it would work within rf2 boundries letting the player know whats going on, thats whats important imo. You could even have 2 parts separating front wing and nose starting from the front axle going fw and the other part the rest of the car's collision model. Then many would start asking undertray to be modeled, laser scanned, dirt applied, water going through the diffuser and the rest... i know it never ends but its not better when you do nothing.

    For me, like nords, its a big check box to be ticked! You d say nords and new content means immediate income (very needed nothing bad, not against it) unlike game features , yeah but on the other hand happy gamers will spend more money in the game as well. :cool:
     
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  4. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    @enduser An indication of rubbing the chassis against the ground is exactly what 'ride height' provides (of course the undertray positions are defined per vehicle, so you are trusting the modder. But a built in indicator of 'zero ride height' also needs to be based somewhere). The confusion is how that relates to setup ride height values and setup changes.
     
  5. davidporeilly

    davidporeilly Registered

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    If you are addressing my post then I am sorry, I don't know what you are trying to say.
    If you are trying to say that the outer part of the tyre is not "recruited into play" with chassis roll and G-forces then I cannot agree. That, put simply is what camber is for. The more long high load corners the more camber is appropriate, EG more for Suzuka than for Monza which is more longitudinal (braking, accelerating and the corners except Parabolica are mainly slow and short).
    Yes it is obvious that there is a trade-off in setup for slow corners, fast corners and straights. That is what testing is for, to reach the best compromise for cornering versus straight line performance. So the equal temps and the best cornering performance will occur in the most critical corners on the track because that is how you should set up the car
     
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  6. enduser

    enduser Registered

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    Read thread title and op again pls.

    You re trusting the modder as with everything else, anyway ...
    it seems with no other feedback devs chose to give ride height priority over suspension tweaks in the setup page, meaning keeping it the same as a simple solution for most players, its understandable but also a questionable choice when every mm matters in very low aero dependent cars, its a quick solution before the telemetry plugin.

    Then again op is about knowing when car touches down and he seems to be able to read telemetry, its not rocket science. Confusing thread, to say the least. How suspension changes translate exactly is a different matter but since the suspension is adjusted around ride height and not the other way around its even easier to tackle duh, its just that conversation has shifted a bit as usual and talking about ideals.

    edit
    I agree though live telemetry > everything else, if AC has it rf2 should have it x3!

    and to correct myself Undertray00... / UndertrayParams among the first hdv lines, HUD touch down indicator easy peasy :D
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2018
  7. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    @enduser I thought I basically answered the OP with post #2. Almost everything after that is talking about ideals.
     

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