Graphics

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Craigjw, Oct 28, 2012.

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  1. djt

    djt Registered

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    Project CARS uses an advanced DirectX 11 game engine that obviously is not the same as what is being used for rFactor2.

    http://www.slightlymadstudios.com/technology/
     
  2. osella

    osella Registered

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  3. 88mphTim

    88mphTim Staff Member

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    That is always worth stating.
     
  4. WheelNut

    WheelNut Banned

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    are you's all sure its a image quality improvement you should be comparing between dx9 and dx11 and not a performance improvement
    can't say i've seen a game in dx11 run with bad performance like i have with dx9
    dx9 first released in 2002 its 10 years old next month
     
  5. djt

    djt Registered

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    That’s a point that is seldom mentioned, DirectX 11 is more than just eye candy. Hardware utilization (in this case GPU utilization) is one of it’s biggest features.

    Even in it’s alpha state ProjectCARS performs amazing well in DirectX 11.
     
  6. fazerbox

    fazerbox Registered

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    Very irrilevant differences visible only in Screenshots. By the way, I prefer DX9 between first 2 pictures.


    About performances, I have no technical infos so I don't wat add more, but when I see previous images I note that images are almost identical but with fewer FPS in DX11.

    I think DX11 is better than DX9, but actually when I see DX9-DX11 differents I don't think a huge step forward, maybe this will append in the future or maybe full DX11 features are not used for performance issue.

    Max.
     
  7. WheelNut

    WheelNut Banned

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    framerate not always an indication of performance 250fps doesn't mean the game runs better than 60fps
     
  8. 88mphTim

    88mphTim Staff Member

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    From what I understand and have heard, it isn't. From what I've seen in games which support it, it isn't. People haven't even taken full advantage of DX9 in most ways. Just moving on for the sake of it, and giving yourself two development tasks (unless you want to do DX11 only, and kill all support for XP), seems very pointless to me...
     
  9. djt

    djt Registered

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    A huge step it isn’t, but a step forward is better then remaining stagnate and when it comes to better hardware utilization it’s a step in the right direction.



    What unexploited advantages are left in DirectX 9 that won’t break the the camel's back?
     
  10. osella

    osella Registered

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    Not denying it can run faster in DX11, just doesnt really look better.
     
  11. djt

    djt Registered

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    As far as I’m concerned smooth game play (performance) is just as important as the eye candy but I haven’t seen any DirectX 9 game that looks as good as what I’ve seen in Project CARS, any of the recent racing titles from CodeMaster or the other non-racing DirectX 11 games I’ve run.

    http://www.virtualr.net/project-cars-build-330-available

    Hell even Forza4, Forza Horizon and GT5 on the XBOX 360 and PS3 look and perform better than about 95%+ of the DirectX 9 games I’ve seen over the years (I’ve got a book shelf full to prove it).
     
  12. osella

    osella Registered

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    Try it for yourself then, when you launch pCars just select DX9 instead of 11, if your brain plays tricks on you believing it looks worse, make your own comparison screenshots to see that it doesnt, its all about models and textures (and whatever not-DX related, I know nothing about making graphics pretty much)...

    I agree though that if using 11 could improve FPS significantly, it would be great to have in rf2.
     
  13. FONismo

    FONismo Registered

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    pCARS just looks like a high res SHIFT2 IMO. So yes it would of been possible for SHIFT2 to look the same as pCARS. The difference is this time they are in charge of what happens with the game and so can go all out. They are not restricted by deadlines. Really SMS get their look from their shaders and materials used more than anything and of course the ultra high textures. DX11 has zilch to do with this. DX11 just sounds nice on paper, it's the new buzz word.

    When it comes to performance however and utilizing current hardware, it's pretty dam clear than DX11 has big benefits. So basically what you see with pcars any game could do with dx9 if the devs in question want to make it look like that. The cars models in pCARS are sensational aswell.
     
  14. 3lfk1ng

    3lfk1ng Registered

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    I'm new to sim racing but I have a strong background in computer hardware and software, as a gamer and as a sysadmin-in-training. I also track my car so I have 8 hours of racing experience under my belt so far. Hopefully my input could be of some value.

    I just wanted to chime in real quick to say that DX9 and DX11 can look exactly the same, the only "real" difference is the performance optimization that can be found in DX11's .APIs. In some cases the performance is still worse because most developers tend to add additional 'stylistic' features that they advertise as being DX11 only, things like advanced shader models, DOF, HDR, etc etc. DX11 better utilizes multi-core processors and uses an advance form of Tessellation which allows higher polygon models to be rendered without using too many resources. (Source: http://www.elitebastards.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=611&Itemid=29&limitstart=2)

    In short, DX11 can run better on modern machines, without the developer having to spend too much time in 3D development and optimization. A modern developer would just need to be comfortable in excluding the Windows XP users. With Windows XP users being 33% of the market (most likely not power-users or pc gamers and much more likely to pirate modern software) most developers are still reluctant to exclude the XP users even though Windows 7 based machines account for 46% of all online computers. (source1: http://gs.statcounter.com/#os-ww-monthly-201109-201209-bar, although similar but different stats can be seen here at Source2: http://www.netmarketshare.com/opera...11&qpcustomb=0&qptimeframe=M&qpsp=140&qpnp=25)

    Looking over on the Steam hardware & Software stats gives the closest survey we have to understanding a modern gamer's computer hardware:
    50% of gamers are using DX11 capable video cards.
    60% of gamers are using Windows 7 64-bit.

    tl:dr; It may not be worth it for the graphics but it might just be worth it for performance. Less computation on graphics allows more computation for physics. In short, gamers are ready for DirectX 11.

    Now, to clarify my stance in the matter. I much prefer your physics to Project CARS graphics. In the end, I want my cars to feel as real as possible through my Fanatec CSW, since it is the only practice I have when I am not on the track in my own car. I plan to use rFactor2 as a form of practice.
     
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  15. richiespeed13

    richiespeed13 Registered

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    Good, informative post mate. Sums up DX9 vs DX11 imo.
     
  16. coops

    coops Banned

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    ^ very interesting and well said. i believe a lot of sim and pc gamers would have a pretty reasonable rig so would agree we are ready. as tim says they are not wanting to exclude XP mayb the reason behind that is for new users in sim and pc gaming with old rigs.

    but a pole on this would be the way to go but not just in this forum mayb in all sims and gaming forums ?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 2, 2012
  17. 1959nikos

    1959nikos Registered

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    Excellent, first time DX9 vs DX11 is clear to me, very interesting stuff about OS usage too (I thought XP users were majority not minority, but time flies).
     
  18. 88mphTim

    88mphTim Staff Member

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    Windows 7 is that good.
     
  19. SLuisHamilton

    SLuisHamilton Banned

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    Don´t you post a list with all sim that uses isimotor engine software and Slightly Mad Studios is included? Doesn´t pCars belongs to SMS?
     
  20. SLuisHamilton

    SLuisHamilton Banned

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