Future plans for rF2?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Martin Vindis, Feb 26, 2024.

  1. Martin Vindis

    Martin Vindis Registered

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    Ever since LMU was announced, I've felt that rF2 has been neglected, which is understandable. I hoped that all the work going into LMU would eventually benefit rF2. However, considering the significant work still needed for LMU, I find it hard to believe that the developers will have time for both projects any time soon, and the last couple of months seem to confirm this.

    rF2 is great in many ways, but it still requires attention. There are longstanding bugs and older premium content that need fixing and updating, and now I'm worried that this might never happen.

    Have S397 said anything about their future plans for rF2?
     
  2. nolive721

    nolive721 Registered

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    There was a thread flying around on the topic last year when LMU was announced

    I like very much RF2 for physics and FFB with the right content but I also totally understand S397 to invest in LMU in absolute priority moving forward

    it’s a sound direction business wise
     
  3. marmagas

    marmagas Registered

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    I believe we saw this story and how it ended,AC and ACC.
    Only modders can keep rF2 alive and kicking from now on.
    Official content from s397 will not receive any updates,and i dont expect any official word for it.
     
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  4. DanRZ

    DanRZ Registered

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    They just need to release the last tyre model so that modders can use it. It would be awesome.

    And rF2 would be "done". No further update, except some DLC ported to rF2.

    The only "plus" i see in LMU is the Hybrid management which seems realistic but will probably never come to rF2.
     
  5. Adrianstealth

    Adrianstealth Registered

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    Rfactor 2 has been fab

    Rfactor 3 is increasingly becoming due

    we live in happy times
     
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  6. R.Noctua

    R.Noctua Registered

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    Does that mean we won't see any more new DLC or any updates? Or did I misunderstand something?
     
  7. elgagon

    elgagon Registered

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    No. This is his opinion.
    There has been no official announcement about this.
    S397 said that the development of rF2 would be stopped until the launchment of LMU.
    LMU is in Ealy Access and all the team is working in LMU now.
    We will see what happen and/or if there is an oficial announcement.
     
  8. DanRZ

    DanRZ Registered

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    I said rF2 is done, but secretly i still hope they will get back and update a few things.

    But financially, it's probably a bad choice to get back to rF2 instead of going forward to rF3 or any form of LMU "extended".
     
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  9. Bernat

    Bernat Registered

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    S397 said they would stop development until LMU got out. So it means it's on hold. Everything else is speculation.

    I think there are already several threads/messages about this. It wouldn't hurt to search instead of spawning a new horde of speculators. ;)

    With speculation, people express their desires and I'm a bit worried about the desires of some. They might regret it.
     
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  10. davehenrie

    davehenrie Registered

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    The moderators here have collected bug reports and issues from users, then telling us they would inform the team of the problems. However they clearly stated very little, if nothing at all, would be done to/with rF2 until LMU was well and truly sorted. @Marcel Offermans(former Boss at S397) has posted else where that he would not be surprised to see any further progress with rF2 until next year at the soonest. I would add to that my opinion, that if LMU is a huge success, they will spend all further development time on that platform. If LMU fails, MSG will probably fail as well and S397 might drown with them. We have to ask ourselves. When was the last code update to AC or Automobilista?
     
  11. Ayrton de Lima

    Ayrton de Lima Registered

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    They should launch the hybrid system and release it to modders, what is being done with RF2 is quite ridiculous.
     
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  12. Travis

    Travis Registered

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  13. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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  14. pilAUTO

    pilAUTO Registered

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    (all is 100% related to rF2 future)

    After serious use of Le Mans ultimate, just out of curiosity and because I am a fan of rfactor 2, and although it is obviously early access, I notice this without surprise :


    Le Mans ultimate has exactly the same physics as rfactor 2 (if there is a difference it is extremely small, apart from the hybrid of course), the ffb is strictly identical especially if it is correctly configured that is- that is to say in the same way between the two simulations, the graphics engine is strictly identical with a very slight pleasant improvement on the le mans ultimate but which remains weak, the sound engine remains exactly the same with a slight improvement which is very appreciable indeed, we feel that the ui code is exactly the same as that of rfactor 2 but as far as I am concerned this UI is a real disaster in terms of ergonomics and user friendly and also in terms of customization capacity given that is in a simulation.


    Apart from the content, what interests me 99.99% without any exaggeration I assure you is the realism of driving, it is exactly the same frankly we are not going to quibble.

    I'm not taking into account the fact that there are really major bugs for the moment because it's early access, on the other hand the experience I had with the le mans ultimate at the interface and bug level was a disaster to be honest but as I tell you I am perfectly aware it is early access so no problem.

    I actually have two major problems with Le Mans ultimate :

    1) Le Mans ultimate is none other than rfactor 2 and I defy everyone to say the opposite, but due to its WEC license, and immensely limited in content which is extremely damaging and even blocking concerning me as a passionate about driving.

    It's very important for me to drive a large number of cars, but even more important, cars with extremely different physics and behavior, and it's exactly the opposite in Le Mans ultimate without even talking about the variety of cars and their year of their type of transmission et cetera.

    Furthermore, even if it is only an early access and the first year of the game, the number of circuits is very ridiculous even if the wec compliant ones I agree, the variety, the type and the number of circuits is really less than it should be for an rfactor 2 enthusiast like me and I just want to say as a driving enthusiast quite simply.

    Furthermore, I consider that the greatest endurance circuit and even the greatest circuit in the world from all points of view is not Le Mans at all, sorry I'm going to offend some French people and people from Sarthe, but the greatest circuit of the world in short but also of endurance and in what concerns me the Nürburgring.

    There are no less than 5 endurance races per year on this circuit, the 24 hours and the VLN.

    All with many more different cars, 200 cars on the circuit and so on. In short, I'm not going to draw you a drawing, it's seriously so much better. Of course everyone has the right to like or not like the Nürburgring, but for me this circuit is totally essential even if it is obviously personal, the little time I spend on the simulator is either on the nürburgring combined, 99% of the time easily, either on the targa florio because it is a totally fantastic circuit precisely what we will never have on le mans ultimate.

    Sorry to be a bit like the guys in virtual reality who say and it's a bit annoying it's true no support in VR therefore no purchase of games, the guys say that all the time (I should point out that I have 5 years of VR so I know what it is), here I want to do a bit of the same guy who says no Nürburgring, no Le Mans ultimate.... But actually it's personal, this circuit is foundational for me, this year alone I spent more than 25,000 km on this circuit virtually on rFactor 2.....

    But in any case, not a very varied circuit and of different types and so on, and in number, for me Le Mans ultimate has no interest, I said for me, didn't I, for me !

    So note these two arguments, the argument of the cars which is totally major and main, and the argument of the circuits including the exclusion of the Nürburgring for endurance even if I integrated it perfectly it does not come into account in the wec.

    And obviously note that for me rFactor 2 is the only real simulation in a sense of extremely high-end driving realism and research by the publisher, and that I include in this sense Le Mans ultimate, I am not trying to absolutely demolish the game, but note my second point.

    2) My second is much simpler, it is quite simply that I am convinced that unfortunately le mans ultimate has already killed rfactor 2 from the beginning of its development about a year and a half or two years ago and even more during its announcement.

    Indeed, the only desirable thing would have been to continue to evolve rFactor 2 very strongly and gradually, obviously including if possible all the cars which are planned for Le Mans ultimate, with possibly some specific adaptations to the wec in the parameters of the ui or other, and add the missing circuits.

    This would have involved paying for one or more DLC in the form of a package, this DLC could very well have cost quite a lot more than €30 in any case without a doubt.

    You are going to tell me, and this is where we will disagree, that if they had done that they would have sold a lot less and it would have made a lot less money... Well I will answer you, without any doubt, yes, but the choice they made by releasing Le Mans ultimate is a commercial choice which is not necessarily bad actually, but unfortunately this commercial choice goes against the interests of both users of rFactor 2 but in my opinion of all SIM Racer.

    So the choice of a progressively greatly improved rFactor 2, with possibly in addition to the other DLCs and the DLCs corresponding to the wec, was in my opinion a solution perhaps 1000 or 10000 times better than the one chosen except on the commercial level but the business plan is none of our business, we are passionate, is it...

    Is not it....?

    The second choice, in my opinion would have been both better than Le Mans Ultimate but not an intelligent choice either, would have been rFactor 3.

    So, I reinvested in rFactor 2, and it's still great and even, to tell the truth, almost better knowing that the successor does much less of course, notably the aspects that I mentioned to you.

    I'm having a lot of fun on rFactor 2 these last few days, I really regret that it's no longer improved and believe me when I saw the words of the former boss of s397 Marcel, I said to myself that indeed it's It was very unlikely that they would really come back.

    To simplify his remarks, it's been almost 2 years or a year and a half that he has been working almost exclusively on Le Mans ultimate, almost 2 years that the code of the two games has deviated from each other, if he had to come back to it he will not come back for at least a year at least so the difference between the two codes would be too significant and would require too much investment.

    So we can believe it, we have the right to believe it, but I don't believe it and I prefer not to believe it.


    So I'm continuing on rfactor 2, that's all I can tell you.


    Be careful, apart from the content which does not suit me at all due to its variety, its diversity, its interest in driving and its number, I consider that Le Mans ultimate is in terms of graphics, sound, and above all what really counts driving realism strictly identical to rFactor 2 (with very slight sound and graphic improvements but nothing exceptional).

    I'm not here to criticize Mans Ultimate, but recognize that disappointment is quite legitimate when you're a long-time user of rFactor 2!
     
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  15. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    @pilAUTO there's a WEC license, they were required or decided it best to make a WEC game. That's not an rF2 DLC pack.

    There are big changes they've been working on, enhancements that aren't compatible with the majority of rF2 content, so while of course it's largely the same as rF2 (which is a good thing!), it's not still rF2. It's not trying to be rF3.

    And rF3 - for the 160th time - isn't going to magically do something rF2 isn't already heading towards. I would suggest that if you look at rF2 today, and if you could show it to someone in 2018 (and, let them hear it) they might guess it's rF3 anyway.

    rF2 was dying under ISI (ran out of breath), S397 picked it up and advanced it significantly, but as a business model it's obviously - evidently - not great. If LMU and other similar future projects can help to pick things up and keep the S397 show on the road, fantastic.

    I too would be disappointed if rF2 development stops here, but I'll probably get the more focused title(s) in future anyway. And rF2 won't disappear, it'll still do what it does now.


    On top of this, with all the opinions and game vs game stuff - the world of sim racing is better than it's ever been, has more choices than ever. Many of us own many of the sims, and we use them for their strengths. Nothing's ever perfect, and if it were easy to make something better everyone would be doing it.

    Go drive the bloody cars! Whatever sim! Who cares!
     
  16. pilAUTO

    pilAUTO Registered

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    That's exactly what I'm saying, an improved rFactor 2 is better than a fantasized rFactor 3.

    But I still prefer an rFactor 3 to an LMU.

    Note that my number 1 choice is an improved rFactor 2.

    This is also what I do by continuing to use rFactor 2 exclusively as before.

    This really suits me.

    But like you, I am disappointed with the probable end of rFactor in terms of development, evolution and perhaps content.

    One does not prevent the other !!!!
     
  17. Bernat

    Bernat Registered

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    Probable? Why are you (and others) inclined to think like that? I think you're being too pessimistic/overdramatic for no reason.
     
  18. pilAUTO

    pilAUTO Registered

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    Hi Bernat.

    So actually I personally think that there is much more reason to be pessimistic about the resumption of rfactor 2 developments at some point as well as new content.

    But without necessarily being interested in what I think, who has been an informed user of rfactor 2 for 10 years, let's focus on what the former boss of s397, namely Marcel Offermans, says objectively and in a very pragmatic and technical manner (there are two quotes that you can find on this forum) :

    1) First quote :

    With the LMU planned full release moving from december to february and transforming into an early access version, it seems likely that the team at Studio 397 will continue to work on the title.

    No new release date for the finished product has been mentioned, but if I may take an educated guess, I would not be surprised if they will take the rest of 2024 and aim for a full release at the end of the year.

    Meanwhile the content team will certainly have to work on the 2024 season content, and possibly a few other DLC packs for LMU to ensure people keep playing the title.

    That will take us well into 2025 and by that time it's probably too late to restart development on rF2.

    It's probably a better time to start work on rF3. Or start porting LMU to consoles.

    2) Second quote

    I'm looking at this mainly from a technical perspective. Let me explain...

    Based on the initial announcement for LMU, where they anticipated a Q4 2023 release, my guess is that development started roughly at the start of Q1 2023, assuming they would estimate that building a new game on top of the rF2 platform would take at least a year.

    So at that point they FORKED THE CODEBASE and started work on the new title.

    Because they no longer had to support modding or any of the existing content, this allowed them to make changes to the codebase that break compatibility.

    Fast forward to 2025 and you have a codebase that has drifted away from rF2 for well over two years.

    At that point even "cherry picking" bugfixes, let alone back-porting major features is going to be a challenging task and you can be sure that some of the more interesting changes can't easily be brought into rF2 anyway because it would again break compatibility.

    Assuming LMU does well enough to support the current team, which is basically back to the original size of Studio 397 before the acquisition, would you then bet on the fact that resuming with rF2 is the best way to build a sustainable company, when early 2023 you clearly decided it was better to stop working on rF2 and focus on LMU? To me that just does not sound logical.


    Granted, building rF3 might not be the most sensible thing to do either. I am following the developments at Kunos with interest as they are going to attempt this first (AC -> ACC -> AC2 is in some ways similar to rF2 -> LMU -> rF3) so you could say it's a great test case for other developers to watch. I don't expect AC2 to support modding. This will be another test. Is the community going to jump onto AC2 in the same way, even without it? We live in interesting times!
     
  19. pilAUTO

    pilAUTO Registered

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    In short, personally I am starting again after a short break of a few months to invest myself in rfactor 2, and this in a strong and exclusive way.

    It's a personal choice, but LMU simply does not correspond to my needs even if it uses the basis of rfactor 2 which in itself is already exceptional.

    But LMU does not correspond to my needs at all and I think that a lot of people will be disillusioned, frankly there are not only prototypes and modern GTs as well as AAA circuits in life.

    The passion for driving goes way beyond that for me.

    But everyone does what they want.
     
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  20. trichens

    trichens Registered

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    I've seen several comments on this forum and others where people are complaining that LMU has a limited selection of cars and tracks. If I were to buy F1 23 then I won't be expecting to get to drive a Ford Focus on a rally stage.

    They seem to be missing the point that LMU is a WEC specific game; it's only based on rF2 because the developers at S397 are using what they know as a start point. The LMU game was planned before MSG acquired S397.

    I'd very much suspect that only tracks and cars that appear in the WEC will ever appear in LMU.
    And no idea if historic cars and tracks will appear... does F1 23 include cars and tracks from the 1980s?
    And if they did what would the market for those be?

    MSG are also going to have to target consoles at some point as that's where the real money in computer gaming is due to the sheer numbers of possible users.
     
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