FOV Calculator

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by taufikp, Mar 29, 2012.

  1. GTrFreak

    GTrFreak Registered

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    Spinelli

    I used a cockpit view of an open wheeler ISI had released. I did not make it myself. I agree completely with you and I don't drive this high in the cockpit. I just want to point out the width of the visible range, where the tires are in relation to the screens etc. Mind the "quickly" part in my post.

    Also, because of your answer I think you completely missed my point. As I said, I wanted to point out the width of the view. How the car has to be 'around' you and not only in front of your G25 and only in your primary monitor
     
  2. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    I understand your point, I was just going off on a tangent about the height view thing, I know it wasnt the point of the post. I was just hoping you didnt actually use cockpit view that low lol.
     
  3. ZeosPantera

    ZeosPantera Registered

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    Now we are getting into horizon line.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    And this is as you can see.. Very dependent on hardware placement. If you are eye level with the middle of your screen you need to put the horizon slightly below that.
     
  4. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    yesssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss thats exactly what im talking about :)

    why do all games even the hardcore sims always get this so goofed up????????????????

    Our views in game are always angled way too downwards, looks retarded.

    YOUR EXAMPLE WITH THE BLACK AND RED VETTE IS EXACTLY WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT, left side, pointed downwards, you would never be able to see that close of the ground in front of you and that far down your hood, far right pic, MUCH BETTER.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 18, 2012
  5. MaXyM

    MaXyM Registered

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    My guess is, to show nice dashboards.
     
  6. ZeosPantera

    ZeosPantera Registered

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    Since I edit every cam file to adjust the horizon line I find that most are set to -0.07(looking down) and some cars with ugly interiors are -0.03. I run +0.05 because I sit below my monitors center.

    I am so thankful rF2 has implemented a permanent and universal adjustment for this in the PLR file. If I have done nothing else I have influence some of the better view options. FOV Slider down to 10° and this.. Next is angular adjustment for the triple-head so multi-view won't be skewed for only 45° monitor angles.
     
  7. MrPix

    MrPix Registered

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    I hope you can help ZP, I know your threads have inspired me on FPS and also on racing sims before, but I'd like to run this past you.

    I don't have a racing rig per se, but I do have an office desk and chair and a triple monitor setup in a [-45][ 0 ][+45] config.

    With the calcs provided on this thread and basic trig, I have adopted a Vertical FOV of 21 deg. Sometimes going to 23 or even 25 to get more comfortable with the side mirrors, well the one closest anyhow. I have TIR so actually look up fractionally to view the rearview mirror and across the dash to bring the far side mirror into view.

    What I'd like to acheive now is the perfect horizon line vs Eye level, and hopefully with your help and that of others that care about this subject, I'll get there.

    I hope you don't mind, but I borrowed your crash test dummy for the illustration and my current setup looks like this:

    [​IMG]

    I think the value in the player.plr file is Seat Pitch that I may have to adjust, so if you could confirm this that would be great, but also, to what would I set it?

    As you can see my eyelevel is currently 2" above the horizon on screen.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 18, 2012
  8. ZeosPantera

    ZeosPantera Registered

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    It is the "Seat Pitch="5.00000" // Cockpit camera pitch orientation (degrees)" modifier..

    My setting is +5 but I have the almost exact opposite of yours.

    Where your eyes are you are probably going to want to try dead 0.0..

    Your horizon should be slightly below your eyes. I haven't worked out any actual CALCULATIONS.. for horizon line yet but I am sure there is some formula you can pop numbers into I would just need to remember all my High School Maths.
     
  9. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

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    Ya but in the last video I posted and in the picture aswell, you can see the dash and wheel in both, as the cockpit is covering almost the entire bottom half of the screen (just like nico rosberg said). So that can't be the reason.
     
  10. coops

    coops Banned

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    +1 maxym
     
  11. MrPix

    MrPix Registered

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    Thanks ZP. I did have a bit of a random play yesterday.

    Looking at your examples (and borrowing again) and trying to replicate them, this is what I have come up with:
    [​IMG]
    If the left most image is referenced as "1" and the right "4". Using a flat road track as an example and looking into the distance with a seat height of 0.... I get the following results:

    Image ref 1. Seat Pitch="-5.0000"
    Image ref 2. Seat Pitch="0.0000"
    Image ref 3. Seat Pitch="4.0000"
    Image ref 4. Seat Pitch="7.0000"

    Both ref 3. and ref 4. feel a lot more comfortable (TIR disabled by for this exercise by the way) and soo much more realistic than looking up to a flat road surface. Because my FOV is so acute, I place my seat quite a way back, so I can just see the top of the dash... I would have to glance down with TIR to see the dials as I would in a real cockpit.

    Next test is in an open wheeler, but my wrist is in a splint currently so may leave the testing for a week or so... it's driving me nuts not driving in real life and not being able to drive virtually seems even worse!

    Thanks for your help.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 19, 2012
  12. Gearjammer

    Gearjammer Registered

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    Thanks for all that information guys, :) Will have a go at changing back to a normal FOV with proper seat adjustments etc and see how that feels. The issue I had before was that the front tires just seemed way to close to me with a 17 degree FOV. Also, my current config on my monitors puts centerline of the monitors about4 degrees below level so I am looking at level horizon at about 4" from the top of my screens. Currently I can't adjust the height, but might be able to do some work to my racing rig later to add some elevation if needed. The question is, should I move the monitors up to allow the horizon to be in the center of the screens?

    Thought I would add a couple of images to make my point. First image is with FOV at 17, the second with FOV at 34 and the green stripes are roughly where my bezels are.

    https://dl.dropbox.com/u/52935236/GRAB_003.png
    https://dl.dropbox.com/u/52935236/GRAB_004.png
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 19, 2012
  13. ZeosPantera

    ZeosPantera Registered

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    If I were you I would move the screens and leave the view alone and at 17°. In real life your eyes would be pretty much in line with the top of the wheel so using that car as an example.

    Let me rant for a second. The problem with most sim setups is they are designed, built and used by old people(all of us). They need to be used by children or at least designed by them.. FOR EXAMPLE..

    [​IMG]

    This should be us.. All of us. With the Imagination of a five year old pretending with all our might that we are in that race car when we sit at our desks. (You will note the child has proper placement of the imaginary F1 steering wheel!).. That boy closes his eyes and he sees EXACTLY where the steering wheel, pedals, doors, front wheels and horizon are. And none of us started building ours by doing that.

    So right now sit in your driving position, close your eyes and with them shut tight imagine you are in a race car..

    Feel around. What is wrong? Are the pedals too low? Too far away? When you reach forward is the steering wheel where you IMAGINE it should be? Is it too big, too small, angled improperly? If you actually point your finger at the front wheels in your imaginary F1 car and then peek through your eyes are you pointing at them on screen? Are they too low to be on the screen at all? Is the distant horizon the first thing you lay eyes on?

    This is how a simulator should be built. With our eyes closed like a 5 year old. Luckily for us we can all be 5 year olds with bank accounts and power tools. Or maybe we have perfected our use of cardboard.

    [​IMG]
     
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  14. SLuisHamilton

    SLuisHamilton Banned

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  15. Gearjammer

    Gearjammer Registered

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    Great post indeed :)

    Unfortunately I built my rig using dimensions from my existing car, which is not a purpose built race car unfortunately lol. The only thing that is off according to those dimensions is my wheel is too close to me at the moment and the seat feels as if it needs to be tilted back a little bit, but other than that, I feel as if I am sitting in my real car. The screens are a bit low for what I would expect to see out the front windshield of the car and I will rectify that in short order by lifting my monitor platform about 3". I would expect however for the front wheels of the F1 car to be about in the middle of my outside monitors, but I have never sat inside a real F1 car so I don't know if I am mistaken on that part. As I said in my previous post, the wheels just appear to be too close to me to be in a "real" position at 17 degrees FOV.

    The one advantage I do have is that my seat does recline so I can lay back to get my position closer to what a real driver would be in, though the pedals and legs would still be angled as if I were in a touring car. The upside to leaning the seat back would be the lengthening of the wheel away from my body, giving me more of a proper arm position for driving, as well as lowering my head allowing me to not have to raise the monitors to accommodate proper horizon.

    I guess the disadvantage here is I would like something that appears to be close to real, but I have no idea what real is like, hehe.
     
  16. MrPix

    MrPix Registered

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    I have had a quick play with the Seat Pitch values in the .plr file whilst sat in an open seater. For the purposes of the screenshots, I took off Multiview so the picture looks better flat, but prefer it on when in sim.

    First I set my FOV to 23 degrees (+2 degreees greater than the 21 degree the FOV calculator led me to, but it feels more comfortable)

    Then I set my seat position (fwd/back) so that I could see dash behind where the wheel should be and what looked like a reasonable distance to where my head would be if sat in the car.

    Next up (scuse the pun) was seat height, to which I adjusted so that I could just see the bottom of the inner sidewalls, but not the rims (took this from comments on this forum). TIR was disabled through out the screen shots, but used to look sideways to get the right seat height initially.... which incidentally tallied up with seeing the bottom of the sidewalls on the wheels.

    Then I adjusted the Seat Pitch before each screen shot. Note, the seat position has not changed throughout these shots, just the angle of my head and eyes!

    The results:
    [​IMG]

    I'm loving the setting of "4.0000", which, even though is about 3.5" below my eye level, just feels so right. I did try "5.0000" but it's just too low, as is anything higher.

    I know this thread was initially started on FOV calculations, but this in my opinion is a totally relevant calculation within the field of view that requires consideration, so hope you don't mind me posting this here.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 19, 2012
  17. GTrFreak

    GTrFreak Registered

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    theres a red cross where your screenshot would be..
     
  18. osella

    osella Registered

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    So the seat pitch parameter is the same as orientation offset of rf1 cars .cams right?
     
  19. MrPix

    MrPix Registered

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    lol... you posted that as I was rectifying the link... Ninja GTrFreak!
     
  20. ZeosPantera

    ZeosPantera Registered

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    Yes.

    Also nice image MrPix.
     

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