Force Feedback broken after leaving pit several times

Carsten Wilhelm

Carsten Wilhelm

Registered
Hey guys! Due to the ongoing situation, I got my simulator running again, and what can I say, it's great fun!

However, my FFB gets "rumbly" after doing some laps, pressing esc and leaving the pits several times or after being ingame some time without driving and then leaving the pits again. When it occurs, it feels like the FFB update frequency gets very low, like below 10 times a second or so, like driving over very aggressive rumble strips. The "original" FFB is still there in the background, however very rumbly. That's the best way I can describe it.

The strange thing: It happens exclusively in rFactor 2, other sims/games work perfectly fine. Car / track doesn't matter. And I can only get it to work again by completely restarting rF. FFB Reset makes no difference. Tabbing out while rF is still running, going to the windows controller settings and performing the Fanatec FFB test, FFB works perfectly, no strange rumbling. Tabbing ingame again, FFB is still broken.

Another thing: I did a complete triple stint in Le Mans (2,5 hours) plus letting the car sit without pressing esc for an hour earlier today to see if it would fail while on track / time-related (which it never did before) with no problems whatsoever. No fading, no rumbling, great FFB. Did some setup changes, went back on track a minute later, and it was broken again. So it does not happen while driving and should be related to something going wrong while in the pits or maybe while initialising FFB again when pressing race.

The fact that it works in other sims/games without any hassle for hours and that I can drive for hours at a time in rF2 without problems, only to fail when leaving the pits again makes me refuse to believe it's a hardware issue.

A brief list of the things we tried / fiddled around with:

Software:
-removed all drivers (Fanatec, USB, ...), reinstalled
-checked several Windows settings (power management for example)
-reinstalled rF2
-had only rF2 running, no other unnecessary programs / services
-didn't do a windows update with wheel etc. still plugged in ever
-fiddled around with every controller setting possible, none stopped the issue, reverted to original controller.json
-loaded preinstalled Fanatec CSR Elite.json

controller.json:
-Ignore controllers - everything except wheel
-Use thread - true
-Range from vehicle - false
-steering wheel range set
-steering wheel bump stop harshness - 100
(these are some tips I found for a similar issue with OSW)
-FFB multi - several values, by default I have 0.6
-FFB damper - tried everything from 0 to 32
-several other values changed

Hardware:
-tried several USB cables
-tried several USB ports
-reset wheel base
-tried several different settings in the wheel menu
-removed every USB device exept wheel and pedals
-FFB reset has no effect

Setup:
-Fanatec CSR Elite Wheel
-Fanatec Clubsport Pedals v2
-Windows 10 64bit 1909 (tried with 1903)
-Hardware details in my profile under information

... and that's not all we did for sure, but everything I can remember right now :D

We ran out of ideas and really need any help we can get. The only thing that I would say is left to try if we can't get it to work is to try it on a fresh Windows installation. That would basically be the last resort.

If any logs/trace files or any additional info are required, please let me know and I will provide them as quickly as possible.

Thanks a bunch! :)

Edit: There's no fixed time or amount of pressing esc / leaving the pits. Sometimes it happens after 20 minutes, sometimes after leaving the pit 10+ times. I can't recognise any pattern or provide any parameters to reproduce it 100%, so I can only suspect it just happens when it wants to sadly. Last saturday I took over the car from my teammate in a Nordschleife endurance race and it happened, so technically I went on track only once there and didn't press esc before. Other times, I had no problems after taking over the car. So I believe it's just more likely to happen the longer rF2 is idling.

Edit 2: Ideas from this thread that didn't work
- turn off driving aids (especially steering help) - was turned off already
- controller.json: "realtime controller detection" and "detect rearranged controllers"
- controller.json: "ignore controllers" set to every controller but the wheel
- completely new windows installation on new ssd
 
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Thanks for the advice! However, I have all driving aids turned off.

I will edit the ideas that gather in this thread in the first post for better overview.
 
Not at my pc, but there's a setting somewhere (controller or player json) regarding controller detection? Is that covered above?
 
In controller.json, there's "realtime controller detection" and "detect rearranged controllers". Both already tested with true and false each to no effect.

Also, there's a line called "ignore controllers" where you can tell rF to ignore controllers FFB wise that aren't supposed to put out FFB (e.g. pedals, button box), already tried setting that to all controllers but the wheel (so that every controller besides the wheel is ignored).

Is that what you meant?
 
Sorry, I can't give any tips you haven't already tried but I have a CSW V2.0 that has had a CSW V2.5 mother board, fan and servo installed due to a failure of the old MB. and I don't have any issue with the FFB. The only thing I can suggest is make sure that the wheel MB is not overheating, this was the issue I had with the V2 MB as the fan wasn't running at correct speed and the unit would have drop outs due to overtemp.
 
Yes, that would make sense, but as I said, I would rule out hardware / overheating issues. Otherwise I wouldn't be able to drive for hours straight without any sign of overheating (FFB fading / loss), only to fail again when I press esc and go on track again.

I bought a new SSD before work this morning and made a completely fresh Windows installation with only the bare minimum for driving installed (basically only steam and the hardware drivers). I didn't copy any of the old files, all drives except the new SSD aren't plugged to prevent any interference. And guess what, it didn't work - exactly the same problem still.
 
Not sure if anything has solved the issue since i haven't read all of the comments, but from what I found this issue is from multiple sessions starts on a single run of RF2. Meaning, you start a session, leave it, and start another at least 3 times, was the number for me. I also found changing the car from session to session on the same RF2 run (without restarting the entire sim) has a similar effect.

So basically, if you are setting up a race, especially an endurance race; get the race all setup, everything from ai to diffuclty and which car you will drive, then restart RF2 completely and that should prevent it from happening. At least that has worked for me in the past. I did a 24h race at silverstone with the ai with no issues once i worked it out.

I also, restart steam while I'm at it so it is running for the first time guaranteed.
 
Sean McCormack said:
Not sure if anything has solved the issue since i haven't read all of the comments, but from what I found this issue is from multiple sessions starts on a single run of RF2. Meaning, you start a session, leave it, and start another at least 3 times, was the number for me. I also found changing the car from session to session on the same RF2 run (without restarting the entire sim) has a similar effect.

So basically, if you are setting up a race, especially an endurance race; get the race all setup, everything from ai to diffuclty and which car you will drive, then restart RF2 completely and that should prevent it from happening. At least that has worked for me in the past. I did a 24h race at silverstone with the ai with no issues once i worked it out.

I also, restart steam while I'm at it so it is running for the first time guaranteed.
Click to expand...

The OP has stated similar, except it's not consistent. Sometimes it's the second session/run, and occasionally it's the first. If yours was consistently the third (if it happened) then that's sort of related but a little different.

I didn't mention heat earlier because it seems clear it's not an issue, as long runs aren't a problem. Obviously what's weird is that if it's a game issue it should happen to all wheels, and if it's a wheel issue it should happen to all users of the same wheel, and if it's both combined we should still see it across the board. It feels more like an initialisation issue but all the parameters available for that sort of thing have been tested.

Are there any reports of PSU issues with this wheel? Might help explain the sporadic nature of it...

*edit: @Carsten Wilhelm on the wheel side, is there software/drivers running that detect particular software and have a profile loaded/active for that software? Or is the wheel have its settings and games just do their thing on top of it? I only ask because I had issues years ago with logitech G series wheels not properly detecting rFactor and therefore not always using the right profile. If the wheel is somehow losing the correct profile when rF2 does some sort of wheel reset (when jumping in the car) it might cause such an issue, and if that's a selectable option it wouldn't affect everyone... clutching at straws...
 
Lazza said:
The OP has stated similar, except it's not consistent. Sometimes it's the second session/run, and occasionally it's the first. If yours was consistently the third (if it happened) then that's sort of related but a little different.

I didn't mention heat earlier because it seems clear it's not an issue, as long runs aren't a problem. Obviously what's weird is that if it's a game issue it should happen to all wheels, and if it's a wheel issue it should happen to all users of the same wheel, and if it's both combined we should still see it across the board. It feels more like an initialisation issue but all the parameters available for that sort of thing have been tested.

Are there any reports of PSU issues with this wheel? Might help explain the sporadic nature of it...

*edit: @Carsten Wilhelm on the wheel side, is there software/drivers running that detect particular software and have a profile loaded/active for that software? Or is the wheel have its settings and games just do their thing on top of it? I only ask because I had issues years ago with logitech G series wheels not properly detecting rFactor and therefore not always using the right profile. If the wheel is somehow losing the correct profile when rF2 does some sort of wheel reset (when jumping in the car) it might cause such an issue, and if that's a selectable option it wouldn't affect everyone... clutching at straws...
Click to expand...
I still am using an old forza motorsport fanatec csr wheel, the first gen, so it seems to happen sporadically. interesting...
 
I did another test yesterday. I went out for a lap, pressed esc and then tried to delimit the time to be in the pits before driving again when it begins to fail. For me it's between 17 and 22 minutes. After that timespan, it fails.

Now I picked up a Fanatec CSL Elite base + McLaren wheel from a buddy, tested it for some hours, no problems so far. So it goes in the hardware direction, but I'm confused since people with Clubsport v2.5 and DD1 bases report the same problem.

@Lazza
No, it's just the normal Fanatec driver. Only thing you can adjust there is wether you go with fixed rotation or with software controlled rotation, which differs from car to car. Both tested of course.
 
Dear All,
i am running a SC2 pro - i have the same problem
press ESC - get back into the car - no ffb
press ESC - get back into the car - ffb back
crazy thing
i thought its caused by beta release i am running - but that was not the problem
Peter
 
Have you assigned a button to 'Reset FFB'? I can sometimes leave the pits and there seems to be no FFB. I press the button assigned to reset FFB and FFB returns.
 
I've been chasing the issue since early 2017. I can tell you uninstalling drivers, software, resetting FFB, rebooting the wheel (which breaks the FFB anyway), etc will not solve the problem. The only thing I've found to get the good FFB again is to restart the game.

I suspect the total lost of FFB isn't the same issue. I think it's a high end direct drive issue, but please don't quote me on that.

The progressively worsening FFB in a session or when you click next session (with Fanatec wheels) is an issue that's been around for a very long time now, and it's been the bane of my existing for that last 3 years. I'm surprise that it's only coming up now for more users. It's the reason I upgraded from a CSW 2.0 to a DD1, and to a certain extent, the additional tuning has helped, but I think the underlying issue is still there.

Here's my history with the issue if any wants to get more info.

Fanatec GT3RS FFB-issue in "next session"
https://forum.studio-397.com/index.php?threads/fanatec-gt3rs-ffb-issue-in-next-session.61465/
 
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