Devs, please!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by sirBodo, May 8, 2019.

  1. sirBodo

    sirBodo Registered

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    Dear studio 397,

    My name is ~IsR~sirBodo at Internationalsimracing - http://www.internationalsimracing.com/forum/index.php
    This community exist for 14 years now and we are racing (only) Rfactor and Rfactor2 since then.
    I am an all time member and administrator on this site.
    We did countless championships and events, representing Rfactor all over the world and our forum has over 6000 members.
    Some of our members where test drivers (~IsR~Barabba) back then, and we helped much to develop and promote this sim.

    Back then we have pointed out (not once) about this problem whit sharing pit stop spots during the race. We have also suggested how this could be done.
    However, people at ISI thought this was not much important and did nothing in this case.

    Now, several years later, this problem still persists. We tried to make a strategy where every driver takes the half of the spot, so other driver can stop beside.
    However, because the track and pit stop configuration, this doesn't always work. We have 50-60 drivers signing in for the league and we have to run on 2 servers in order to avoid this.
    We would like to run multi class races with 60 drivers in one server, but this is not possible with this problem.

    Last race at Monza, 3 drivers had to share one pit spot and had to wait 30 or 40 seconds to refuel and change tires, because other driver stud at this spot.
    That made them loose much time and positions. Now, after 3 weeks of practice and countless practice laps, imagine how this driver feels after a situation like this...Yes, totally disappointed!
    Not to mention how we administrators feel after we organize everything and want to people have fun, and then receive a message from those people complaining, but we can't do nothing about this.
    Yes, also disappointed and very much upset!

    Either way, Rfactor can not be considered as a real sim if this problem persists.
    That said, we and many others are hoping very much that you guys will finally try to fix it.

    Thank you and keep up the good work!

    Bodo
     
  2. LokiD

    LokiD Registered

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    An honest plea.
     
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  3. lagg

    lagg Registered

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    I agree totally with @sirBodo
    We have had this problem too a lot of times.

    Note: Hi Bodo, nice to see you here.
     
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  4. mantasisg

    mantasisg Registered

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    Now imagine track like Goodwood, where physically there is space for only 14 or less cars.

    What do you suggest ? Ghost cars like in AC ? IDK about realism part of that, but in terms of game thts practial.
     
  5. Boomer20

    Boomer20 Registered

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    Well in real-life usually they get told to stay out if someone's is already in their pitbox. So maybe they need to introduce a notifier like how it tells you when your pit-crew is ready that your pitbox is occupied, that might help drivers stay out and avoid double stacking. Maybe something that detects that another car is occupying the same or part of the same space as your theoretical box?
     
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  6. McNolo

    McNolo Registered

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    Actually, this can be done without any problem, I think. It would require a modification in the track AIW and create a specific RFM for the mod, but there wouldn't be problems to doing.
     
  7. stonec

    stonec Member

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    That actually sounds like an interesting idea (having the message center inform that someone else has requested a pit stop for the same slot when you press the request button). The problem is that with refueling there is typically no real "pit window" because drivers almost always will pit at the lap where the fuel tank is empty, so this feature wouldn't help refueling races very much.

    If you run shorter races, a kind of "solution" is to not have refueling enabled. I believe most real-life series are now run without refueling option. Without refueling a pit stop is typically around 3 sec for open wheelers, so that kind of minimizes any damage from having to queue up.

    The other solution is to edit AIW and RFM and add more boxes or make it so that team-mates only share the same box, but you won't get around the problem that 60 cars cannot pit at the same time for only 20-30 boxes.
     
  8. mantasisg

    mantasisg Registered

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    Easiest solution would be to talk with team mates and put different loads of fuel.
     
  9. Comante

    Comante Registered

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    I don't think pit stalls are shared among team mates, at least not if you consider to run 60 cars on the same track.
    The idea of a notification about pit avaiability is maybe the easiest to implement, the other is to run 60 cars on tracks that can support them somehow, but I agree that something should be done as it seems that endurance multiclass racing is becoming a very popular activity in RF2.
     
  10. Boomer20

    Boomer20 Registered

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    Whilst I don't have experience in MP, I know in SP there are no teams, certain mods will line AI cars together in the teams but I'm guessing that's a AIW/RFM/Talent file thing. You'd like to think with the introduction of the competition infrastructure, part of it would be the recognition in game of teams and assigning them to the pit stalls as such right? It may not be a high priority thing to do that but it certain would give it a realistic and professional look.

    Ah but then the drivers would have to actually plan their stops or work out a pit window and not just go to empty, or do they run the gambit hoping they can make it without being delayed. Is that not part of what pit strategy is.
     
  11. McNolo

    McNolo Registered

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    Like I said, this can already be done. Let's see an example:

    We have a team called X consisting of 2 cars, A and B. They occupy the first garage and the first pit position, which they share and we want them can stop at the same time.

    First, we must treat both cars as a different team. In the RFM file of the mod, in the "PitGroupOrder" section, we must make each car a different group. So the lines of that section should be like this:

    PitGroup = 1, Group1
    PitGroup = 1, Group2
    PitGroup = 1, Group3
    PitGroup = 1, Group4
    ...

    Now, in the VEH file of the example, car A will contain the following line:

    PitGroup = "Group1"

    ... and car B this:

    PitGroup = "Group2"


    In the track, we must edit the AIW, and create two pit boxes in parallel (or the way we want), one for group1 and one for group2. Obviously we need there is enough space in the pit to be able to do it and also a little margin to be able to enter with relative comfort if our partner is stopped, but I remind you that it is not necessary to stop exactly on the site, you can stop the car a little deviated from the box and it works fine.

    We will also have to edit the positions in the garages if we want a fixed place for each car, sharing a garage with teammates, for example.

    It is simple.
     
  12. mantasisg

    mantasisg Registered

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    So with Groups it was basically said that you have not to enter as teams, but as separate drivers. Basically it was just said that you need more pit stalls.

    I have Goodwood and Nemuno Ziedas tracks, both has strange pits, Nemuno Ziedas basically has only "garages". It is great that rF2 allows for sharing a pitstop, just check how those pits ended to be in Assetto Corsa.

    You also should consider that you have to be able to enter pit stop, and then leave it as well. And there has to be space for other cars to drive through We don't have need for this, but mechanics also need space.

    Just talk before race and plan your pitstops. Also these things happens irl so...
     
  13. ~IsR~Barabba

    ~IsR~Barabba Member

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    Hello everyone
    My idea to solve this problem is the following, since we still don't have a working solution, even editing the various files.
    Make (like iracing) the pitlane in ghost mode, from the beginning of the line where the traffic light is, to the line where the pitlane ends.
    So everyone can make their pitstop without problems.
    as many know I have dedicated myself to various jobs on rfactor1 and rfactor2.
    we tried to edit all the possible files, and the problem remains.
    even if the problem went away editing the files, I don't see why an administrator who already has to organize many things should also edit the files to solve this problem.
    in the tracks where there are few places in the pits, the problem is unsolvable.
    just as I said above, with the ghost pitlane system everything would be solved
    I hope this thing is taken into consideration, and that I and my admins, we must not always hear the complaints of our drivers doing championships.
    some riders can also lose a championship due to this problem.
    I can't find this right!

    Babs ;)
     
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  14. Steve Olden

    Steve Olden Registered

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    PC2 does this..and I think the crew chief app picks up on it too
    (tbh PC2 does most of the stuff that people are asking for for rF2 - maybe the devs should buy a copy, when it's on sale obviously, and take a look at it )
     
  15. McNolo

    McNolo Registered

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    One thing that would facilitate the process and that I take to suggest to S397 is that it allows editing the size of the pit stop frame.

    When you edit the AIW, you can see a rectangle that delimits the space assigned for the pit stop. As far as I know, the size of that box can not be changed, but if it were possible to do it and create a wider one, with space for two cars (or more) , a simultaneous stop could be made without respecting a specific position, any of the team's cars could stop at any of the sides.

    Maybe in some tracks it would not be enough because the space lack, but it would solve the problem in most cases.
     
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  16. mantasisg

    mantasisg Registered

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    Just having car as ghost while in pit stall solves everything, except that it is unreal. rF2 already does this, when creating a track and spawning with multiple cars at same location.
     
  17. Comante

    Comante Registered

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    I would say that is not realistic to race with 60 cars in a track made for 40, but here or there something is to be left behind.
     
  18. stonec

    stonec Member

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    Personally I think the ghost pitlane system looks ridiculous on iRacing broadcasts. If the idea is to simulate real life, IMO sims shouldn't resort to these kind of tricks. Pit lane navigation and collisions are part of the race. @McNolo has already presented solutions that make more sense.
     
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  19. Will Mazeo

    Will Mazeo Registered

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    I requested some pit stop updates long ago, nothing done :(
    https://forum.studio-397.com/index.php?threads/more-pit-stop-functionalities.57411/
    Pit stalls need to be larger, most tracks fit more than one car in the stall space just fine

    Just please, never go ghost cars in pits, they are extremely dumb!


    Most tracks are limited due to how the game deal with pit stalls not because of real life space, IRL they are mostly limited by garage slots.

    Does anyone know if dual pit lanes even work in rF2? Some tracks have it, like Road Atlanta


    I wish we'd be at this level of pit road imersion (and we should be considering titles like GP4) :)
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2019
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  20. AMillward

    AMillward Registered

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    In rf1 a lot of the F1 tracks had the pit lanes done by team. So you'd have Williams at the front and Minardi at the end.
     

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