Community Videos Thread

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by 88mphTim, Oct 21, 2013.

  1. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2012
    Messages:
    5,290
    Likes Received:
    31
    So ISI (and most players) would rather be able to look back, than to have all physical car parts appear in their mirrors? That's ridiculous because in real-life you can't even look back, lol, plus, we have the car rear-view mirrors, and on top of that we have a virtual rear-view mirror for people who can't see the actual rear-view (too low FOV) or for people in open wheelers who want to "cheat" :)

    Someone said that the issue is actually that many cars in rF2 don't have the car around you rendered while you're in cockpit view, so even when you set your player file to show everything in mirrors, your car still won't show because it's not actually graphically rendered in the first place.

    If this is true then that is ridiculous as well. It's not 1996 anymore and "optimizations" like this give a game a cheap, lazy, and un-finished feel. There a ways to optimize things and this isn't one of them. At least give us the option to enable the player's-own-car-rendering-while-in-cockpit-vie.
     
  2. K Szczech

    K Szczech Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2010
    Messages:
    1,720
    Likes Received:
    45
    I dare say he didn't have a clue what he was talking about - don't listen to him :)

    What you need to know about mirrors in games is that they're actually done using kind of "picture in picture" technology. It's like having two cameras placed in your car - one is looking forward and the other one backward. Backward view is rendered into texture that car model has on it's mirror surface, then the car with these dynamic textures is rendered into main view.
    This means, that game is actually rendering two independent video frames. Each of these frames can have completely different set of object visible. So there is absolutely no connection between what you see in both views. It doesn't matter that you can't see rear end of your car in your main view. This doesn't prevent it being rendered in rear view.

    The true reason for not having car parts rendered in mirrors is different - performance.

    Like I said - it's like having two cameras. But car's often have multiple mirrors. Take an average street car - you need front view, view in left mirror, view in right mirror and view in center mirror. That's 4 cameras. This means your graphics card needs to render 4 independent frames of animation in order to give you a full view from your car with 3 mirrors included.
    So, we're rendering 4 frames in order to see just one. You can imagine what it does to frame rates. Of course a simulator cannot give up on mirrors completely, but there are some compromises that can be done. One of them is only using one camera that looks backwards and render wide image. Then you split that image into 3 parts and put them in left, center and right mirror. Now you only need one camera to handle 3 mirrors.
    So where's the catch?

    One camera means one point of view. This "mirror camera" is usually placed somewhere centrally in a car. But mirrors in real world are placed separately and each one offers different point of view. You will see the outside of your left door in your left mirror. You will see the outside of your right door in your right mirror. You will see inside of left and right door in your center mirror. Having just one "mirror camera" game is unable to provide 3 independent views. If this camera is placed inside car, you will see car interior in your center mirror (which is fine), but also in your left and right mirrors (which is wrong, because they're actually outside the car). If you reverse the situation and put the "mirror camera" outside the car (on the roof perhaps?) they you will still not see the doors in your side mirrors, but roof instead, but you will no longer see car interior in your center mirror.

    That's why car interior is often skipped in mirrors, except for games that use 3 separate cameras for mirrors. This is a bit easier to do with modern graphics APIs such as DX11 or OpenGL 4, but requires some overall changes made to game engine and assets. It's easier to achieve in non moddable simulators (take for example iRacing, which I believe has 3 independent mirror views), because developer is in control of all the content.

    Of course it can be done, but it's a bigger issue that average gamer would realize - lot's of technical stuff involved. Some developers already have it, some probably have it planned but with more important tasks at hand it will have to wait.
     
  3. GTrFreak

    GTrFreak Registered

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2010
    Messages:
    376
    Likes Received:
    7
    My gosh, that's an extremely in-depth but understandable explanation. I do have some basic knowledge about graphics but I really appreciate your efforts to share your thoughts and knowledge. Thumbs up for you, sir.
     
  4. MikeeCZ

    MikeeCZ Registered

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2012
    Messages:
    1,544
    Likes Received:
    180
    Still would apriciate more mirror features sich is mirror oscilation and higher resolution, it shoud be a setting in Graphics tab so if we have PC that can handle it, lets have nice mirrors with bodywork in it
     
  5. hexagramme

    hexagramme Registered

    Joined:
    May 25, 2013
    Messages:
    4,241
    Likes Received:
    194
    Fact:
    The key to a fast lap is all about scrubbing as much speed out the vehicle as possible, steering as much as possible at all times and of course killing the front tires as early as possible.

    No, wait..? :confused: ;)
     
  6. Spinelli

    Spinelli Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2012
    Messages:
    5,290
    Likes Received:
    31
    I think you're really over-exaggerating the difficulty/complexity of "proper" in-game mirrors... RFactor 1 from 2005 does it...and I'm assuming it therefore is possible with rFactor 2.

    [HR][/HR]
    In Game Stock Car (rFactor 1 engine) I downloaded a simple, tiny file which replaced another mirror file. This made the mirrors nice and high-res. It doesn't look like it's from 1996 anymore.

    Simple as that, just replace a tiny file, done. Can we do this with rF2? I think I'm using the highest-rez option (7168 x 448) with no framerate issues and everything looks great in the mirrors. This - combined with "true" mirrors - is great in GSC, it really is.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 23, 2014
  7. GTClub_wajdi

    GTClub_wajdi Registered

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2012
    Messages:
    3,068
    Likes Received:
    413
     
  8. Victorj0301

    Victorj0301 Registered

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2013
    Messages:
    8
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  9. David O'Reilly

    David O'Reilly Registered

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2012
    Messages:
    1,018
    Likes Received:
    710
    We have recently done a mixed class ISI GT race with Nissan GTR GT1 and Corvette GT2.
    We didn't have many drivers (5) so across 2 classes it was lacking a bit.
    However some drivers preferred to stick with their choice.

    One of our top drivers has been suggesting weight penalties for a while now but I confess I didn't know how easy it is to do in game.
    I reckon for club racing it shows great potential to close up the field.
    As well as allowing drivers to choose GT2 or GT3 when you ask very fast guys to carry a little more weight the "improving drivers" get to mix it with the fastest for longer and work on race craft and just have more fun.

    IMO that beats circulating half a lap down thinking "wow they are fast, how do they do it " or "gee I am slow".
    This race showed how much fun can be had with such a formula.
    We did it for 2 seasons in RD Xbox F1. We called it Pro AM. There simply allocated the F1 cars in historic performance vs equal performance. If needed we would also create a time gap in the formation lap. There were weeks where 80% of the grid were in the same sector on the final lap.

    So the potential is there have a go.
    FYI we did 45 mins at Bahrain 6hr.
    GT1a) carried 255 kg (the max)
    GT1 b) carried 200 kg
    GT2 carried 120 KG
    This made them quite close. But GT1b (200KG) had much better pace in the 2nd half as GT1a) tyres were nuked.
    Why not simply add 135 KG to GT1 you ask?
    We wanted one GT2 driver to race with no ballast for the reasons above.

    the person with admin rights simply types
    "/setmass XXX John Smith"
    to give John Smith XXX KG for rest of weekend.
    "setmass 0 John Smith"
    clears it.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQhQf2LJFl4
     
  10. baked bean

    baked bean Registered

    Joined:
    Jan 17, 2012
    Messages:
    1,297
    Likes Received:
    48
    Love this track, nicely done too and the Apex SLS like's it aswell ;)

     
  11. Hedlund_90

    Hedlund_90 Registered

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2012
    Messages:
    1,683
    Likes Received:
    41
    I love that first section of Zandvoort :D Is that a WIP track or where did you get it bb? Nice video as always.
     
  12. kimikaze

    kimikaze Registered

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2011
    Messages:
    650
    Likes Received:
    23
  13. TypicalAnalytical

    TypicalAnalytical Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2014
    Messages:
    262
    Likes Received:
    0
    So is this that track that is planned to be paid mod?
     
  14. Bjørn

    Bjørn Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2010
    Messages:
    1,727
    Likes Received:
    657
    No.
     
  15. kimikaze

    kimikaze Registered

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2011
    Messages:
    650
    Likes Received:
    23
  16. TypicalAnalytical

    TypicalAnalytical Banned

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2014
    Messages:
    262
    Likes Received:
    0
  17. Euroracing8

    Euroracing8 Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2014
    Messages:
    24
    Likes Received:
    0
     
  18. Rich Goodwin

    Rich Goodwin Registered

    Joined:
    May 3, 2012
    Messages:
    1,217
    Likes Received:
    8
     
  19. ADRIANF1esp

    ADRIANF1esp Registered

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2013
    Messages:
    29
    Likes Received:
    0
    Lap and replay at Sao Paulo GP with the Formula Renault 3.5 2014.


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzNu1OMYflU
     
  20. Miro

    Miro Registered

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2012
    Messages:
    1,357
    Likes Received:
    108
    Nice vid! This car is just amazing, best GT mod in rF2 IMO. Looks good, sounds very good and drives just awesome.
     

Share This Page