[WIP] CART Factor

[DiggerHawk]

I would assume on road courses only. Like Nascar, I don't think the tire companies were comfortable letting folks circulate on the the big ovals in the wet. Smaller venues, like perhaps Nazareth, Phoenix, Milwaukee....perhaps those....tracks that required braking even in the dry.

I don't think it works as a brake light, I presume like in F1 reactions time wouldn't be quick enough to react to it coming on.

 

[DiggerHawk]

If someone is in the U.K., maybe they could go to Donington and shoot some reference photos? https://www.flickr.com/photos/doctor_dave/12929678233/

Unfortunately the museum closed a few years ago and the collection was sold off. I have no idea where the car is now.

A few weeks ago I had a look on Google maps to see if I could find the factory where they were made in Poole, Dorset. I think I found it. Its amazing that 3 of the 4 chassis where made in the England.

 

[USCTrojan4JC]

Great find with that pic!
From what I can make out the rain light is that rectangle part that spans the rear wing supports. Comparing it to a pic I found of the car at Donington there is a difference in this area. The Donington car has a thin symmetrical aerofoil spanning the rear wing supports apposed to that rectangle shape. The fact the Donington car is in oval spec suggests that they didn't carry a rain light on ovals (one less part to replace in an accident maybe? Considering it wasn't needed on ovals).

I wasn't able to find anything showing the rear of the PC27 from the Long Beach Grand Prix qualifying in the wet on Saturday, April 4, 1998. I think I was there that day, too.

I looked through Peter Burke's SpeedCenter gallery for that race weekend https://www.speedcenter.com/archive/gallery/gallery98/03longbeach/index.html and also the usual Google Image Search. I don't know if emailing him might provide you with any images he didn't post. Does anyone else have any ideas?

 

[PatientRF2fan]

I wasn't able to find anything showing the rear of the PC27 from the Long Beach Grand Prix qualifying in the wet on Saturday, April 4, 1998. I think I was there that day, too.

I looked through Peter Burke's SpeedCenter gallery for that race weekend https://www.speedcenter.com/archive/gallery/gallery98/03longbeach/index.html and also the usual Google Image Search. I don't know if emailing him might provide you with any images he didn't post. Does anyone else have any ideas?

Try here USCTrojan,

https://www.gettyimages.ca/photos/1...998 toyota grand prix of long beach&sort=best

I use this site a lot since the videos are so low res from those days.
the trick is you have put the year and name of the event.
For example: Miller lite 200 rather than mid-ohio

Rnd Date Race Name Circuit Location
1 March 15 Marlboro Grand Prix of Miami O Homestead-Miami Speedway Homestead, Florida
2 March 28 Budweiser 500K O Twin Ring Motegi Motegi, Japan
3 April 5 Toyota Grand Prix of Long Beach S Streets of Long Beach Long Beach, California
4 April 27* Bosch Spark Plug Grand Prix O Nazareth Speedway Nazareth, Pennsylvania
5 May 10 Rio 400K O Autódromo de Jacarepaguá Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
6 May 23 Motorola 300 O Gateway International Raceway Madison, Illinois
7 May 31 Miller 200 O Milwaukee Mile West Allis, Wisconsin
8 June 7 ITT Automotive Detroit Grand Prix S The Raceway on Belle Isle Park Detroit, Michigan
9 June 21 Budweiser/G. I. Joe's 200 R Portland International Raceway Portland, Oregon
10 July 12 Medic Drug Grand Prix of Cleveland S Cleveland Burke Lakefront Airport Cleveland, Ohio
11 July 19 Molson Indy Toronto S Exhibition Place Toronto, Ontario
12 July 26 U.S. 500 O Michigan International Speedway Brooklyn, Michigan
13 August 9 Miller Lite 200 R Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course Lexington, Ohio
14 August 16 Texaco/Havoline 200 R Road America Elkhart Lake, Wisconsin
15 September 6 Molson Indy Vancouver S Streets of Vancouver Vancouver, British Columbia
16 September 13 Honda Grand Prix of Monterey R Laguna Seca Raceway Monterey, California
17 October 4 Texaco Grand Prix of Houston S George R. Brown Convention Center Houston, Texas
18 October 18 Honda Indy Carnival S Surfers Paradise Street Circuit Surfers Paradise, Australia
19 November 1 Marlboro 500 O California Speedway Fontana, California

 

[USCTrojan4JC]

Try here USCTrojan,

https://www.gettyimages.ca/photos/1998-toyota-grand-prix-of-long-beach?family=editorial&page=2&phrase=1998 toyota grand prix of long beach&sort=best

I use this site a lot since the videos are so low res from those days.
the trick is you have put the year and name of the event.
For example: Miller lite 200 rather than mid-ohio

Thank you! Although, I think @DiggerHawk needs the photos more than I do.

 

[DiggerHawk]

Thank you everyone for your suggestions. I think I may have enough pics to make an accurate enough representation of the rain light. Should be an improvement over its current state anyway.

 

[PatientRF2fan]

Some progress to report.

Redapg looked at the reynard and has given me some direction in terms of updating the physics. I am going to be testing converting to a flex chassis, suspension and steering to rf2. His guidance will be very useful and I hope we have encouraging results. Hopefully we can also make some headway on turbo and existing tires, perhaps resize a new tire model too.

some tracks have been re-meshed and converted to the 98 layout. Thanks to a couple passionate members for providing some feedback in that regard. The focus has been on the drive with active bumps in distinct sections of the track. Each track so far has also experienced a frame rate jump with more efficient poly counts. Still have to add shadows, reflections and visigroups.. More important is the quest to get proper permission with the hopes of sharing and that is a process ongoing.

The graphic update diggerhawk did on the Lola looks amazing. Wow!

 

[PatientRF2fan]

flex chassis and upgraded suspension already out on the track. The steering no doubt feels much improved. There was always a significant dead zone requiring higher Min FFB setting for some. I always cranked the castor to have that hard working feel too. Lots of work but promising so far.

Notice the lock on some specs I found. 360 degree turn and the steering wheels varied from 11 -13 inches. Can really see how little they turned the wheel watching cockpit cameras on the hairpin at long beach.

http://indymotorspeedway.com/v1/98vstech.htm
Reynard 98I/Mercedes-Benz IC-108E data:
Steering Type: Reynard rack and pinion
Turns: 1 (lock to lock)
Weight Dist: 41/59 (front/rear)
Turbocharger: Allied Signal/Garrett
Clutch: 4-plate diaphragm spring
Shock Absorbers: Ohlins
Wheels: BBS/Forged Magnesium
Instruments: Pi
Spark Plugs: Bosch

I hope most would agree that we would still want these amazing cars to be a handful to drive . (I am an old GPL fan too)

 

[DiggerHawk]

flex chassis and upgraded suspension already out on the track. The steering no doubt feels much improved. There was always a significant dead zone requiring higher Min FFB setting for some. I always cranked the castor to have that hard working feel too. Lots of work but promising so far.

Notice the lock on some specs I found. 360 degree turn and the steering wheels varied from 11 -13 inches. Can really see how little they turned the wheel watching cockpit cameras on the hairpin at long beach.

http://indymotorspeedway.com/v1/98vstech.htm
Reynard 98I/Mercedes-Benz IC-108E data:
Steering Type: Reynard rack and pinion
Turns: 1 (lock to lock)
Weight Dist: 41/59 (front/rear)
Turbocharger: Allied Signal/Garrett
Clutch: 4-plate diaphragm spring
Shock Absorbers: Ohlins
Wheels: BBS/Forged Magnesium
Instruments: Pi
Spark Plugs: Bosch

I hope most would agree that we would still want these amazing cars to be a handful to drive . (I am an old GPL fan too)

Looking forward to seeing what you can come up with.

 

[PatientRF2fan]

Looking forward to seeing what you can come up with.

Thanks diggerhawk, probably easier to do the Lola being one car and all. I just know the Reynard so well. Are you onto the Penskes next?

 

[DiggerHawk]

Thanks diggerhawk, probably easier to do the Lola being one car and all. I just know the Reynard so well. Are you onto the Penskes next?

I have been working on all the chassis but somehow the Penske's had been left behind, so I have been giving them my full attention. I would say they are now furthest ahead not including the Lola.

 

[BeGee]

Thanks for tagging me in on these messages I've admittedly fallen off since my first look, but with all the momentum you guys have it's pretty exciting to see progress happening, I'm all for it.

There is something off with the tires and how they compare with the AI. The the AMS mod has oval tires as mentioned, maybe they find it beneficial to have a separate compound for the ovals? I know very little about modifying the tires properly, especially for the player, so I'm hoping one of you guys can refine it.

 

[PatientRF2fan]

Thanks for tagging me in on these messages I've admittedly fallen off since my first look, but with all the momentum you guys have it's pretty exciting to see progress happening, I'm all for it.

There is something off with the tires and how they compare with the AI. The the AMS mod has oval tires as mentioned, maybe they find it beneficial to have a separate compound for the ovals? I know very little about modifying the tires properly, especially for the player, so I'm hoping one of you guys can refine it.

Thanks BeGee, multi compound is in play for sure.

 

[David Short]

@DiggerHawk, @PatientRF2fan , @BeGee and everyone else that is providing help and their time in this thread and behind the scenes I can't thank you enough! For me this is the most exciting news and something I've been hoping for since I started playing rF2 late in 2017.
Been following this thread like a hawk and watching the progress as you breath new life into this awesome era of NA open wheel racing and bring it up to todays standards. Also the prospects of an improved Toronto and Long Beach Indy as well as some other series tracks is amazing indeed.

I really appreciate all the time, effort and commitment a project like this takes. Hopefully everything pans out according to your plans and any required permission requests and in due time we can all enjoy your fantastic work.

Thanks again and Cheers

 

[L0P3X]

Also the prospects of an improved Toronto and Long Beach Indy as well as some other series tracks is amazing indeed.

Apart of Graphic and Mesh updates, Toronto walls need a complete rework, that has been broken since rF1 days and somehow that is still a bug nowadays, same on tracks like St Pete, although on that one it's not a major issue.

Anyways, looking forward to race with this cars, amazing job

 

[vava74]

Incredible mod! Absolutely savage and, so far, undriveable for me, which is why it's soooooooo good. And in VR it's absolutely frightening!

 

[vava74]

That makes absolutely no sense.

lol! yes, it does: my skill level is on the putrid side, so when I find high horsepower mods which are easy to drive right off the bat, I walk away from them. On the other hand, if they are difficult - as they should and its difficulty abides to logic - I like them and try to improve myself by driving that challenging mod.

 

[Scoopscat7]

The the AMS mod has oval tires as mentioned,

What? They have oval tyres why the hell would they have oval tyres that’s just………,,,ooooh. I see

 

[PatientRF2fan]

Update:
Nice summer vacation, great break.
So after reading and watching as much as possible.......

I have all four chassis converted to Flex
I have added upgrades that include FFB strength / Semi Auto lift and blip or Auto lift manual blip downshift/
Split mirrors / onboard ARB / pressure on the fly / body and suspension repairs
Working on turbo engine and gears
testing primary and wet tires
Creating default setups with motec
Once road package is closer I will shift into some oval action

Have been using the physics blog, ptools and looking at the physics spreadsheet (rather intimidating).
Unfortunately this will be by feel as there is no real spec data to be found for this era.
I have probably reached my peak of ability physics wise and will have to find a mentor on this forum.

There has been some encouraging improvement. The turbo testing has been interesting.

Tracks:
My main focus was to re-mesh and add proper bumps from cockpit footage on these tracks.
I will eventually pursue permissions to share but want the product to be clean before asking.
I just keep going back into tracks as skills increase. Still using legacy shaders.
Anyone want to help PM me. I would appreciate it so I can focus mainly on the mesh, bumps, lines curbs, walls, setup and AIW. Be great to learn from others

Long beach 98 new layout remeshed bumps and lines Doug offered to host but I want to clean it up first
Belle Isle 98 remeshed bumps lines and billboard trees
Surfers Paradise 98. remeshed bumps and lines

Midohio: re-meshed added bumps and lines
Cleveland: resurfaced need bumps and paint
Toronto: re-lofting track and walls then adding bumps, lines, adds
Vancouver: re-lofting adding bumps and lines
Road America; havent tried it enough to feel the bumps

Ovals
I have a bunch loaded up in MAX and been working with the meshes

 

[PatientRF2fan]

Cleveland wow, did that mesh take a while...... what a weird corner T1.
looking forward to making this the bumpiest track on the schedule. Drivers would be bruised for days after.
1.5m mesh

Original 2.5 x 6m mesh

Mario's boolean cut saved the day for these transitions

original