Build 982 Knockout Qualifying

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Lazza, Jul 1, 2015.

  1. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Correct me if I'm wrong, I believe getting current F1-style knockout qualifying happening would require these settings in CustomPluginVariables.JSON:


    "KnockoutQualifying.dll":{
    " Enabled":1,
    "NumQualSessions":3,
    ...
    "Total3Session1Minutes":18,
    "Total3Session1Scored":20,
    "Total3Session2Minutes":15,
    "Total3Session2Scored":15,
    "Total3Session3Minutes":12,
    "Total3Session3Scored":10,

    (assuming 20 cars, down to 15 for Q2, 10 for Q3)


    Could anyone trying this stuff out please confirm or relate their experiences?

    Thanks

    *PS I'm also curious what happens when cars drop out; do the remaining cars move up in the order?
     
  2. jimcarrel

    jimcarrel Registered

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    I can't say anything for F1 but Nascar dropouts are staged in the position where they were knocked out. First round, all cars at P24 and above move to 2nd round, then 3rd round consists of the top 12 from second. So you start P1 at fastest of round 3, then P13 is fastest of second round, then P25 is fastest from round 3.

    Probably at least 30 ways to explain it
     
  3. Adrianstealth

    Adrianstealth Registered

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    that would be nice
     
  4. Marco Boy

    Marco Boy Registered

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    ..your example works fine ONLY if the exact numbers of car are on track in the session...

    In you example if you have 20 vehicles in qualify 1 you will have 15 drivers abilitate to drive in qualify 2, then, 10 on q3....

    But if on line, even if only ONE miss the race all goes wrong...... and you change parameters (shutting down the server) with the right number of player...

    If you are playing off line and so that number of driver is fixed... it's all right....

    Bye
    Marco
     
  5. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Marco, can you confirm what you're describing is how it works in Build 982 using this option?

    Also, what do you mean by "all goes wrong" - are lower drivers allowed to drive, or does everything go completely haywire or even crash?

    Adrian, this isn't a wishlist... there's a new plugin interface in this build and a knockoutqualifying plugin included, just lacks some detail on how it works.

    jim, I'm not asking how F1 works, I'm asking what the game does :)
     
  6. stonec

    stonec Member

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    I don't think this knockout plugin will work as such for F1 rules, or at least it's very difficult to setup if it's dependent on number of cars participating as it seems. I wish ISI had made an example plugin for F1 as well or just allowed free rules in Q somehow, as it's a big problem for leagues and no league will likely use stock cars anytime soon. Anyway, I believe this could be solved by someone coding a "F1Qualifying.dll" plugin, it is surely possible now with the new plugin interface.
     
  7. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Dunno... it's called "KnockoutQualifying" and you'd think that would mean some cars get knocked out, the minutes thing seems to make sense... not sure why you'd make a plugin called that and then not make it work with varying drivers numbers and dropouts. But we also have no detail on whether the grid will work properly with dropouts and later returns and all that kind of thing either.

    You're right though, the framework is there, just a shame if the included plugin is nearly useless.
     
  8. UlrichBlanke

    UlrichBlanke Registered

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    would be nice by using percentages of drivernumber - such as:

    session1 -> 100%
    session2 -> 75%
    session3 -> 50%
     
  9. Terence Groening

    Terence Groening Member

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    That's pretty much how it works, except it's deriving those percentages from the Total3Session<x>Scored variables. If the first one is 24 and the second one is 12, then the plugin will take 50% of whatever the actual number of drivers was. (BTW, it rounds up.)

    Everybody who was in Q1 counts, whether they left or not, as the original basis. The number of eligible drivers in Q2 and Q3 depends on this original basis.

    We might release the source code to this plugin. It's not particularly complex. If somebody wanted it to have a fixed basis rather than counting the number of drivers that actually were present for Q1, it would be a simple change (actually, the best idea would be to make the choice of fixed basis a new option). Other than that minor debate, I don't see any problems at all for using this for F1-style rules.
     
  10. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Thanks Terence. A percentage seems the least likely option given the parameters (starting at 100 by default may have been more obvious, though still not really) but I can see the logic for general use. An alternate option for static parameters would indeed be useful.

    In practice I thought most real life series with knockout qualifying (not heats) tended to aim for a specific number in the final round (10 in F1, with Q2 tweaked to suit the number of entrants) so expected that to be the default.

    Ultimately I realise this will probably need to be fleshed out by the community, and I was initially expecting to have to write a plugin for league use at least, but then when I saw the existing plugin and parameters I thought heyyyy maybe this will work.

    This will still take some testing to see what happens in specific scenarios (the usual issue with doing this stuff manually is the grid order being upset when people leave and rejoin in a different session, or in warmup) and I was hoping the 'example' plugin would have highlighted some of those issues and acted as a catalyst for additional functionality that would have been useful more widely. But we'll see I guess.
     
  11. Marco Boy

    Marco Boy Registered

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    Confirm.. i tried it with the new 982 build....

    Ok.. first... i don't play OFF LINE so that i am never sure about the number of driver that will be on the track the day of the race....

    So that.... these settings works fine for OFF LINE game where, if you have 20 dirivers [xx + (20-xx) player] at the start of the Q1 session you will have 15 drivers abel to join track for the Q2 session, from P1 to P15... and so that for the Q3... from P1 to P10 able to join track....

    If you have only 15 (for example) driver (don't care if AI or driver... is the number...) you will have 13 driver able to join track.. and not 15....

    If you have 22 driver you will have 19 drivers abe to join track....

    The number of driver MUST BE the same setted in the file.....

    .....ok....haywire (i had to use the dictionary for that.....) :eek:

    game never crashed... but.....

    i confirm that wrote stonec

    or at least it's very difficult to setup [because of] it's dependent on number of cars participating as it seems.
     
  12. GCCRacer

    GCCRacer Banned

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    So for offline F1 weekend, with fixed number of cars - this would work perfectly fine now?

    I need to upgrade then...
     
  13. Marco Boy

    Marco Boy Registered

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    yes yes yes... :):):)
     
  14. Flipo

    Flipo Registered

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    I tried this option having 24 drivers in the session, when you go to Q1, 24 are in Q1
    when you go to Q2 alone spend the first 17 drivers, and when you go to Q3, only the top 10 drivers pass.

    "Total3Session1Minutes":20,
    "Total3Session1Scored":24,
    "Total3Session2Minutes":15,
    "Total3Session2Scored":17,
    "Total3Session3Minutes":10,
    "Total3Session3Scored":10,

    However if you have configured:

    "Total3Session1Minutes":20,
    "Total3Session1Scored":24,

    but there are only 18 drivers, no longer works. right would have some specific parameters for F1

    "Total3Session1Minutes":20,
    "Total3Session1Scored":24, .-Pass That only the first 17 of 24 to Q2, and if there is 20 drivers, as that only the first pass 17, which does not get out, respect this number.

    "Total3Session2Minutes":15,.-That this number is the time of the session.
    "Total3Session2Scored":17, .-This number is the value that you want to pass to the next session Q3.

    "Total3Session3Minutes":10,
    "Total3Session3Scored":10,

    Finally, when you happen to run, remember the positions they had in Q3 including Q2 and Q1. Numbers have to be fixed, it can not be as a percentage if you want to have the rules of F1

    You can do this?

    Thanks
     
  15. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    Thanks mate, explained a bit more by Terence so that explains the reason for that. I'm sure we'll pretty quickly have a plugin or two utilising this to fix specific numbers of cars instead of percentages, and the author(s) can set and detail what happens with cars that leave and return or sit out sessions etc. The interface does appear to let you set the grid position of all cars so if that works correctly I think this will work as a neat solution - certainly better than the client-side plugin I'm using at the moment to handle this.
     
  16. machine

    machine Registered

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    We are planning to start running a Stockcar League as soon as it is released.

    Aussie leage Into Sim Gaming. We plan to invite other leagues hopefully in co-operation. (Aussie leagues - contact me!)
     
  17. JeDa

    JeDa Registered

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    Is it possible to create a pre-qualifying followed by a qualifying session? I tried it in the F1 92 mod. The first session has 33 cars. Only the fastest 26 cars can participate in the second session. I altered the dll file and it seems to work. however, when i start the race all 33 cars are on the grid. I just want the fastest 26 cars to participate. Is this possible?
     
  18. JeDa

    JeDa Registered

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    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Italian_Grand_Prix
    Also, is it possible to create two qualifying sessions (for example friday and saturday). The fastest laptime for each driver determins his startposition. It doesnt matter if he sets his time in the first or in the second session. This is how qualifying was back in the early 90. See the link.
     
  19. Lazza

    Lazza Registered

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    I don't think the provided plugin tries to affect anything except the qualifying session(s). I haven't done any testing but I think it would be possible, because races are part of the 'multi-session' stuff, so the old F1 pre-qualifying should be possible. I'm not rushing to do a qualifying plugin myself, but if no one does in the coming... er... weeks, I might do it.

    *And to answer the other part of your question, a plugin has access to each driver's fastest time in each qual session, so yes, the Fri-Sat qualifying is also possible.
     
  20. JeDa

    JeDa Registered

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    Thanks! Unfortunately I have no knowledge of creating plug-ins so i hope somebody can do it!


    Verzonden vanaf mijn iPhone met behulp van Tapatalk
     

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