Blacked RIMs since Build ID 3646315

[Damian Baldi]

Since last update, rims appears painted black when the car reach some speed. Rims have their normal colour and texture if the car is standing or at low speed. It happens in multiplayer, single player and devmod.

As the MOD have two different rim options as upgrade, at the beggining I thought the problem was a swap between both different rims, then it was discarded because the second rim have a different 3D model and on the example images it could be seen that the rim have the same shape.

While the car spun and lose speed, the RIM lose the black layer and go back to normal.

 

[Liquid4653]

If I may also add something here - the animation stages for the rims and covers works fine when loading in on default tyre, but as soon as you change tyre compound in the garage, it breaks the animation blur stages after that and they no longer work.

ArthurFox first brought this to my attention on the workshop page here - https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/comments/582567883.

Not sure if it relates to the other problem we are having above but I mention it in case it is and also because its the same area as you will be looking as well.

If you need some gmt or textures provided or the car in moddev, let me know, I can make these available for you guys

 

[CrossPly]

I'm a long way away from my machine right now so can't comment on the behaviour in the new build, but just to add to the issue mentioned by @Liquid4653

When you have more than one tyre compound the number of frames in the rimblur animation is also increased to match the tyre animation (I'm not sure if it's always worked this way but I figure that this is due to the rim and tyre being in the same instance within the .gen).

With one tyre compound the animation frames for both the tyre and rim blur are 0,1,2 and everything works perfectly.

When you add the second tyre compound the tyre frames for compound 1 remain 0,1,2 but compound 2 uses frames 3,4,5 and so too does the rimblur animation when compound 2 is in use. If you don't adjust the rimblur animation it will stop working with compound 2 and from what I've found this is also true with S397 content, with the Radical SR3 being an example that comes to mind.

For the rimblur animation to work with compound 2 you need to duplicate your 0,1,2 rimblur textures and rename them as 3,4,5 as well as re-export the gmts with the same longer animation params from the tyres.

Duplicating the rimblur files is obviously not a great use of resources and with more tyre compounds you have to keep duplicating the rimblur with every additional compound added which makes it even worse. If anyone has a better may of making this work I'd sure love to hear it!

Back to the issue mentioned in the OP, I've got several cars that use multiple rim gmt's that were working previously so I'll be sure to check this out when I get back home in a couple of weeks.

 

[Bernd]

I'm a long way away from my machine right now so can't comment on the behaviour in the new build, but just to add to the issue mentioned by @Liquid4653

When you have more than one tyre compound the number of frames in the rimblur animation is also increased to match the tyre animation (I'm not sure if it's always worked this way but I figure that this is due to the rim and tyre being in the same instance within the .gen).

With one tyre compound the animation frames for both the tyre and rim blur are 0,1,2 and everything works perfectly.

When you add the second tyre compound the tyre frames for compound 1 remain 0,1,2 but compound 2 uses frames 3,4,5 and so too does the rimblur animation when compound 2 is in use. If you don't adjust the rimblur animation it will stop working with compound 2 and from what I've found this is also true with S397 content, with the Radical SR3 being an example that comes to mind.

For the rimblur animation to work with compound 2 you need to duplicate your 0,1,2 rimblur textures and rename them as 3,4,5 as well as re-export the gmts with the same longer animation params from the tyres.

Duplicating the rimblur files is obviously not a great use of resources and with more tyre compounds you have to keep duplicating the rimblur with every additional compound added which makes it even worse. If anyone has a better may of making this work I'd sure love to hear it!

Back to the issue mentioned in the OP, I've got several cars that use multiple rim gmt's that were working previously so I'll be sure to check this out when I get back home in a couple of weeks.

I can confirm that. Rim animation textures have to use the same scheme as the tire compund animation textures, what for me is an unnecessary thing.
Tire and rim animations should work independent, what also would save ressources, when less textures have to be loaded.

 

[Liquid4653]

I can confirm that. Rim animation textures have to use the same scheme as the tire compund animation textures, what for me is an unnecessary thing.
Tire and rim animations should work independent, what also would save ressources, when less textures have to be loaded.

So this is why I am having that issue and is clearly intended, I naturally assumed they were independent so have only 0,1,2 for rimblur and cover blur, but wow thats a major amount of files extra to have it working correctly when one car has 4 compounds for example. I do suspect that the engine is intelligent enough to know a duplicated texture even if differently named, and think it would only load the one texture set regardless, but would be nice to know. either way this is an issue from isi days, not something that S397 have done.

 

[Bernd]

So this is why I am having that issue and is clearly intended, I naturally assumed they were independent so have only 0,1,2 for rimblur and cover blur, but wow thats a major amount of files extra to have it working correctly when one car has 4 compounds for example. I do suspect that the engine is intelligent enough to know a duplicated texture even if differently named, and think it would only load the one texture set regardless, but would be nice to know. either way this is an issue from isi days, not something that S397 have done.

Since we don't know the games code and its limitations and needs, it's always hard to judge things.
But i mean to remember, that the rim and tire animations worked independent in the past, but i can not say when exactly anymore.

 

[Damian Baldi]

To have rim and tyre separated would allow us to add more tyre brands or be able to select different rims/tyres combinations from upgrades sections, without the need to create files for each one of those combinations.

 

[CrossPly]

Agreed with everything above. A more flexible system would certainly be a nice addition.

Just to clarify @Damian Baldi , does the above info allow you to workaround your issue in the OP or is there still potentially another issue that might have been introduced with the latest build?

 

[D.Painter]

Looking at those screenshots it looks to me the texture are not working at all. The Black rim looses all context. Stark black. This can happen to models in 3D Max when a texture isn't assigned properly the object becomes a black hole in the image off the screen window.
In the screenshots the rims that are showing the texture, color are static, no blur. Not sure that this car has animated rim blur textures added to it. So the new game engine may require the rim blur textures to be available, if their not there it has no reference so loads a place holder, blank texture as default from the games common textures folder.

Again we are kept in the dark as to how S397 are doing the latest cars. This has all changed over each mod released by ISI so there is no real affirmative method you can use as a reference and now we can't see this part off the process at all.

 

[Liquid4653]

For reference Doug, this has happened since the last update, before that all was working fine, the exact same files, also, there are rimblur stages in there already too.

i suspect the last picture Damian took is when the car has just stopped or moving so slow as to not engage 2nd animation stage, hence why no blur is visible, and the tyre is the same as well because no blur there either, otherwise the rims would not be showing at all, because as soon as they move, they are black.

texture animation stages in the engine have been the same since day one, the weird thing here is the tyres are not affected by the problem and both have the same technique applied.

This happens in both versions of the engine, single player and moddev.

 

[Liquid4653]

Agreed with everything above. A more flexible system would certainly be a nice addition.

Just to clarify @Damian Baldi , does the above info allow you to workaround your issue in the OP or is there still potentially another issue that might have been introduced with the latest build?

sadly not, i have amended my moddev build and the problem still persists, the black rim issue that is, the issue I mentioned is fixed, if you can call adding a bucket load of extra files for all compounds, fixed lol. I feel sorry for the people who want to have their own rim colours, for the Porsche they now need 9 texture files instead of 3 to cover all tyre compounds regarding rims. Same goes for the covers as well.

 

[Liquid4653]

After spending some time investigating this issue, I now know what is causing this black rim problem, it is the wildcard material names the engine uses that allow for users to skin content.

I have put the rims material names on something different to avoid using the material wildcard names(WCRIMS/ WCEXTRA3/WCEXTRA4 etc) and the rims work properly again. It should be noted that wildcards not used in texture animation stages remain un-affected.

I leave this info for the devs @S397.

 

[Liquid4653]

bumping this thread in the hope the devs see this 2 month old post, which we were told to make here.

 

[D.Painter]

Looking at those screenshots it looks to me the texture are not working at all.

For reference Doug, this has happened since the last update, before that all was working fine, the exact same files, also, there are rimblur stages in there already too.

So just to clarify Steve, I was correct in my first assumption, that the textures where not working. A naming issue. Just as I suggested, If there was no blur textures would be the same as not named correctly.
I wasn't sure if this mod "had" blur textures or not. Renault was the same.

But thanks for idiot treatment.

 

[Liquid4653]

So just to clarify Steve, I was correct in my first assumption, that the textures where not working. A naming issue. Just as I suggested, If there was no blur textures would be the same as not named correctly.
I wasn't sure if this mod "had" blur textures or not. Renault was the same.

But thanks for idiot treatment.

The issue is the WILDCARD name in the gmt material causing the issue, nothing to do with the actual textures at all, which is why I said what I did in a completely normal manner.

I took at face value exactly what you wrote, 'the textures are not working', which is such a generic thing to say anyway, I merely stated the textures are unaltered and ok.

Your attitude sucks mate, and look at the posts i respond where you are posting in them trying to help.Certainly have a chip on your shoulder mate. I was in no way implying your an idiot but you are certainly beginning to look like one with comments like you have made.

How to shoot yourself in the foot 101 right there and why so aggressive, moody f***

 

[D.Painter]

I have put the rims material names on something different to avoid using the material wildcard names(WCRIMS/ WCEXTRA3/WCEXTRA4 etc) and the rims work properly again. It should be noted that wildcards not used in texture animation stages remain un-affected.

Just to add another point from some one who doesn't know shit.
WCRIM is the standard wildcard naming convention.

Sins the update that has affected this cars rims others have had small issue as well.
What I've found is if the naming entry is not added to the VEH file it want work.

Example,
DefaultLivery="C7R_2017_03.dds"
Extra0="window" // Windows
Extra3="mesh" // mesh
Note; Mesh. This is the older VEH file for this car. The Mesh.DDS worked.

DefaultLivery="C7RrF2.dds"
Extra0="window" // Windows
Note; The current VEH file for the same car. The Mesh.DDS is now not working. In fact the official cars have had this Mesh DDS removed from the cars DDS Mas.
To get the Mesh to work now I've renamed the Mesh.DDS to Extra3.DDS.

So it seem to some one who doesn't know anything that it's now necessary to add the naming convention to the VEH so it is recognized as such.

 

[Liquid4653]

wow angry little man lol

I would say grow up but i know your age.

I was waiting for an answer from the devs, I bump the thread and you come in like you have, appauling behaviour.