Any advice on Skip barber driving in tight turn or chicane?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by softslider, Dec 20, 2018.

  1. softslider

    softslider Registered

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    18
    I like Skip barber but I didn't spend much time getting accustomed to this car. Recently I started this car seriously from national version first. But I feel uncomfortable at tight turn or chicane especially for the entrance.

    Of course, I read below description regarding skip barber character and definitely I need more practice . But it would be appreciated for you expert to give some advice. Video clip showing pedal bars will be also welcome for the tight turn and chicane.

    https://www.rfactorcentral.com/detail.cfm?ID=Skip Barber Formula 2000 (rFactor 2)

    It is very important to keep the throttle down while turning, as this will keep the rear suspension loaded and the car more stable. Weight transfer is also critical, and any changes to throttle input on entry or mid-way through a turn, which will shift the weight away from the rear and cause “lift off oversteer”, will often lead to a spin.


    Smooth input is probably the most important aspect of this car, and any car. You must smoothly turn in, carefully feed in the power, try not to fight it too much in the corner, then smoothly let the wheel run as you exit the turn. Always be aware how much the car moves around underneath you, the car will not react well if you put a wheel on the grass on turn-in: That loss of grip will be devastating.

    Below video shows combined best laps extracted from 3 sessions via Replay Office and nick name shown car is the fastest one. There are the tight turn and chiane at 1:00 and 1:38 in the video. For now, laptime isn't important for me. I'd like to make this car under my control first.



     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2018
  2. Alex72

    Alex72 Registered

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2016
    Messages:
    1,317
    Likes Received:
    992
    Im no expert but just a reflection of my own time with this car. At start i spun and crashed a lot because of the character of the car. Very alive and a car that if you master it you will master almost any other car. At start i also tried to coast through corners wich is a massive mistake, lol. A Little throttle and you have much more Control over corner taking. Long story short, eventually i could drive the car very well and keep up with the AI, and as a result driving other cars got much easier, especially during corner taking due to being so used to having to really be awake during corner taking with the Skippy.

    Its a car i just felt my way towards Learning how to drive it. With rF2's excellent physics and FFB i learned how to drive it. Great car.
     
  3. mesfigas

    mesfigas Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2015
    Messages:
    1,722
    Likes Received:
    830
    @softslider
    when i play skip barber i have the back ARB to 10 and the breake bias to 59%
    thats all for me so far
     
    softslider likes this.
  4. Comante

    Comante Registered

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2013
    Messages:
    1,694
    Likes Received:
    1,218
    I spent a lot of time in the Skippy, trying to find a way to cut on the 4 seconds I take from human driver online, and I always struggled with the low speed chicanes at LimeRock... This until I changed the springs on my G27 pedals with a set of GTEYE spring. Almost instantly I was able to MODULATE the braking and find the edge of lockup. Now, with little setup effort I can even drive succesfully the Howstons.. at least the latest version with uber fat rear tires.
    In the end I don't know if my lap times improved , I was still at least 4 seconds slower than head drivers in the McLaren contest, but my driving surely improved and I crashed a lot less. With the skippy, what I took several laps to achieve finding a rythm noow took just few laps, enough to warm the tires.
    So, long story short, depending on your hardware, there are chances that you can't master the skip Barber if the pedals are not precise and sensible enough.
     
    softslider, David Kolody and mesfigas like this.
  5. softslider

    softslider Registered

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    18
    Thanks for your input. I feel each of your answer comes from your real experience.

    Firstly I'd like to keep the vehicle setup as it is. Regarding my HW setup, I have load cell brake(Protosimtech PT-1) which I can modulate brake power relatively easily rather than spring type one(but still myself can have an issue). Also I have triple monitors with FOV ~175 degree, I think the degree which I see objects(like passenger seat side mirror) is same as real.

    For the skippy driving in national version, I feel I can control it normally although there are enhancement points. But when it comes to tight corner or chicane which I mentioned, the car behavior is different than my expectation. Honestly I don't know. I feel I'm a little passive and the vehicle path is different than expected. Do you slow down more exactly at the corner & chicane entrance to enter the corner pressing throttle? I can't find the balanced point in the skippy. As you know, trail braking seems not the way to go in the skippy unlike other cars.
     
  6. Comante

    Comante Registered

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2013
    Messages:
    1,694
    Likes Received:
    1,218
    I try to make the main braking while the car is still on the straight line, as soon as the speed has been reduced to reasonable level, you can reduce the braking and start turning, the car will happily try to oversteer, at this point, controlling the car is a bit counterintuitive, the wheel control your angular speed more than your trajectory, turn toward the apex and the car will turn FASTER, turn against and the car will turn SLOWER. throttle input control weight transfer in this phase, lifting throttle will give more load on front tires, giving more directionality to the car front, but will increase the aforementioned angular velocity. Applying throttle on the contrary will numb the front tires but will increase grip on the rear, reducing angular speed. You want to keep the sliding inside a decent thresold, so that the car does not take SECONDS to regain grip and accelerate again. Remember that the amount of grip a tire can generate is a finite amount, more lateral grip is generated, less rotational grip (acceleration and braking) you can achieve, the "problem" is that a certain amount of sliding is required to turn fast the car around.
     
    softslider likes this.
  7. Filip

    Filip Registered

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2017
    Messages:
    1,208
    Likes Received:
    937
    This car can be trailbraked in corners like Limerock T1.
    But I can't remember exact version and tires
     
    softslider likes this.
  8. stonec

    stonec Registered

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2012
    Messages:
    3,399
    Likes Received:
    1,488
    Quick observation from your second onboard video. Especially in the first corners, try to complete the turn-in more at once, so that once you are close to the apex, you wouldn't need to point the wheel towards the apex direction anymore. With the way skip barber is balanced, you want to actively drive through the corner with some throttle on, but that leads to a bad balance unless the steering wheel is pointing straight. So the goal would be to complete the turn-in quickly, perhaps by turning in slightly later and sharper, and then get back on throttle and straighten the steering wheel. Once the steering wheel is pointing straight, it's easier to control the constant oversteer by making small corrections. I think the corrections are a bit too big at places, but keeping the wheel straight should help to solve this as well.
     
    softslider likes this.
  9. mesfigas

    mesfigas Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2015
    Messages:
    1,722
    Likes Received:
    830
    skip barber needs thousand of corrections while driving
    thats all
     
    softslider likes this.
  10. JimmyT

    JimmyT Registered

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2012
    Messages:
    924
    Likes Received:
    578
    @softslider I had heaps of trouble mastering this car but found this video gave me the tips I needed. Hopefully it'll give you some ideas.
     
    softslider likes this.
  11. mesfigas

    mesfigas Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2015
    Messages:
    1,722
    Likes Received:
    830
  12. softslider

    softslider Registered

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    18
    Wow! Super exciting!! :) Two thumbs up to the driver!! Was he you?
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2018
  13. softslider

    softslider Registered

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    18
    Thanks for more feedback from you gentlemen. It will be helpful to enhance my overall skill definitely. But in the original post, what I focused was the tight turn and chiane at around 1m00s and 1m38s in the video. You see I stepped inside the curb at the tight turn and had correction with counter steer behavior 3 times at the chicane. In the place, I feel not confident at my throttling unlike other corners. Same mistakes don't happen always but mostly I feel unstable there. I know I have to find the answer by myself finally. But to get some hint, it would be very thankful for some expert to provide video with pedal bars for the corners.
     
  14. Alex72

    Alex72 Registered

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2016
    Messages:
    1,317
    Likes Received:
    992
    Im gonna test chicanes when i get home from work and explain how i do it. It was a while since i drove the skippy but i think it was just a matter of slowing down enough and then be very aware and smooth with the inputs. I know in the beginning when i learned to drive it better how i in my head went "Wohoo!" as i took such corners because even though its slower it still require a sort of "taming the wild" to succeed. :)

    Good time to test as i pick up the new video card today hehe. Im also on triples.
     
    softslider likes this.
  15. mesfigas

    mesfigas Registered

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2015
    Messages:
    1,722
    Likes Received:
    830
    softslider likes this.
  16. softslider

    softslider Registered

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2016
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    18
    @Alex72

    Thanks for trying to help me. As you mentioned, it's a matter of timing and rythm which I can't find yet. I believe I can get some hint from your video as you are from Sweden famous for rally. :) I just thought about electric go karting experience when I went to Kista for business trip. It felt significantly faster than normal go kart and much enjoyable.
     
    Alex72 likes this.

Share This Page