Am I the only one thinking payware could be rFactor2's death knell?

Just for interests sake, what software do the payware modders use to create their mods, $3-4K commercial programs or ...cough cough..." academic " versions or just plain ripped versions, just interested to know.

 

Don't pretend you don't know that answer already...

That is just one of the reasons I think mods should remain and stay free. For one, all commercial software, from downloaded office to photoshop, hell even textures downloaded from www.cgtextures.com can't be used in commerical activities, but I'm sure most people use these!

Add to that that a lot of modders don't have the slightest clue when it comes to physics for cars and just end up guessing stuff since they have no real world data to work with...

Next to that, commercial activity, even with symbolic numbers only, only grants big brands a reason to intervene, something which could seriously damage our hobby.

Worse, is that charging money raises expectations. For example, somebody is charging 2 euro's for a mod, which suffers from, in my opinion, half-assed models, sub-par physics, and stock ISI steering wheels. I wouldn't even drive those cars for free!

In other words, payware can work, if you take a look at Reiza Studios and how they did it.

 

Yes I know lol, I just saw your other post in the Blender request and thought I,d put this in here to see what happens lol.
I agree with you whole heartedly but who,s gunna own up hey lol.

 

Already he have people posting complaints or problems about buying mods.

Funny I thought I heard ISI does not support it.

Yet we have open house advertising and support.

lol

 

Some people still have it you know. I had to buy it 2 years ago and it was over company thought i use it only for ingame, i mean 3ds max here now. Photoshop buyed to, again over company and was needed. I do model with Zmodeler and ive buyed it to. Wanted 3dsimed for gtr2 in past, buyed it. Ive spend some money on all this, some was really for hobby in the past and some was for work and there are more than you think that buyed it those programs to.
For texturing you can use alot, you dont need to look from sites and you can do alot by youreself with some simple knowledge.
But again, nobody here should actually care what somebody uses, its not youre bussines to put nose inside. You can buy a product or not.

 

Exactly. People are just looking for an excuse sometimes.
What's between modder and software developers is between them and is of no concern to end user.

If you stumble upon copyright violation, you may report it to copyright owners, but saying things like "I wonder if you have legal software" is just looking for an excuse or argument.

 

Here's something I don't think has been touched on yet in this thread: I won't have a problem with Payware as long as what I'm paying for is a rock-solid doesn't need any tweaking on my part to fix any "issues". If I pay someone money, I'm expecting a fully finished/tested/validated product. Small little issues have never bothered me with rF1 mods, as usually it's something I can tweak myself (dodgy AI, performance balancing, etc.).

 

The big difference between iRacing and rFactor2 is cost.....and it's the main reason I quit iRacing. Personally I don't think payware mods for rF2 will take off. I know if I have to pay for cars and tracks in rF2......I'll go back to iRacing where there is a quality standard. iRacing has a lot going for it......the ongoing cost is one of the main negatives......which is one of the main pluses for rF2. Mind you if there are good freeware mods around for rF2, why would I pay.......if I want to pay there's always iRacing.....

You see I don't run rFactor to drive around by myself or with a bunch of AI......I run rFactor to run league races. If I have 20 people who want to run in a league series but only 10 of them are prepared to pay for the mod.....I'll just choose another mod. I'm not prepared to lose people because of a payware mod. The reason many people use rFactor for sim racing is because of the once off cost.....if it becomes an ongoing cost then many people will walk away.....many of them to iRacing. I already have a couple of friends who haven't yet bought rF2 who are saying if they have to pay for mods they won't get it to start with......and that will end up costing ISI money.

 

Paid vs unpaid mods really seem to strike a nerve with simracers.
I believe it's the fact that they don't want to see it grow to become the norm.
They don't mind buying a few exceptional mods, but my sense is they just don't want the "If you get paid so should I" attitude to take hold.
At the end of the day, IF the prices are reasonable compared to the overall price of the host product, then it will have purchasers.
I plan on waiting for the official release before deciding on any paid mods.
As to the Iracing....they're guys using it, who've spent as much for content in a year as an actual five day race school cost. That still has me scratching my head.

 

I'm happy yo donate for a good quality mod I will use & enjoy

Maybe an optional donation link is the best way

But if someone wants to charge then that's up to them & it's up to us if we buy it not

With good quality content from ISI, mods already available, full track packs on the way ( RFT )
There's enough choice free/donation & no doubt more pay ware to follow

 

I'm not worried about the payware mods coming out. rF2 still has that beta word attached to it and the game still is not finished so content is slow to roll out. A couple groups are just looking to take advantage of the sparsely available content and sell something for us t race. Soon free mods will start pouring in and the payware will become a footnote. There are lots of dedicated modders out there who do it for the passion of the game

 

There will allway be free mods, main problem is that passion is not enough. Its soo there will be people just seeing money in that and make payware but there will be those just wanting to do mods further but its only way to do it this way and this is what many dont understand. What ever hobby that takes time and money and youre lacking in one of this facts you will have to abandon it so if you do it this way still with passion and its only way than its a plus, you just get additional content that is free from youre choise to buy it or not. If some here are so into donations actually than it should be so hard to do it right away as buy option other than that i dont see people telling us im not afraid to donate becase that will never happen. If you have a choise to donate or not most here will just look away, sorry but it is so. If many here are so prepared to donate than you can pay for it to. I dont need gifted money, i want earned money than rather and some clearly dont understand here that earning it is better than beeing gifted.

Each earned money gives us push to work on more and more(not to get rich but to offer you more we dont have, we just want to cover the time and that it could be done in full time) and we are allways on how can we improve a product, give support and what is it that we can do next.
If even get licensed content im happy to pay for it aslong its in our budged ofcourse and this will come!

 

I think rFactor users have been living too much time in a dream land, having everything for free. But look to other games, charging money even for stupid content like clothes for the game characters etc.

Making good mods takes a lot of time, in my opinion most people don't know how much work it takes. Hours, and hours, and hours, and more hours... we have seen groups like CTDP making mods such as F1 2006 with an insane amount of detail, something that not even ISI has been close to match in any of their mods, and look where are them now, almost gone... good mods should be rewarded somehow, and don't mention donations please because they are almost unexistent. Even if it is just 1€ per download, it would help them a lot, and I'm pretty sure that would end having more people willing to make new cars, tracks... there is an important lack of original content creators for now, almost everything is ripped from other games, let's face it.

 

i think you will find most of the best modders in rF1 have left the modding scene because they went on and got jobs within the gaming industry after getting there name out there (for free)

 

Indeed, I see that as a reward for a modder too.

I support the idea that some talented modder release payware mod because of lack of time he/she would not otherwise be able to do it. But you have to admit that it is kinda hard for a rf2 user to control if that modder really had time or not.

Not sure what iracing mods cost but I'm pretty sure they are much more than 2€ each? That said, I'm not worried if these payware mods will cost max. 5€ per mod. That way you will be able to get your favourite mods by budget cost because lets face it: you won't be using even all the free mods because you just do not have time for them all. But a demo version is a must in every payware mod because the quality must be controlled. Otherwise some people could take money for crappy conversions etc.

With budget cost payware mods (+ additional free mods) rf2 would still be different from iracing. I believe modders can earn enough with 2-5€ mods because many would buy them. If you have to raise the price because you are afraid that enough people won't buy your mod, then there is a high propability that your mod is not good enough and you do not deserve as much money as you think.

 

+1



By the way, has anyone seen the link for a video from Inside Sim Racing that showed one of the blokes giving his opinion of rFactors payware
http://insidesimracing.tv/videos/view/910/0/Inside-Sim-Racing-Episodes

 

Ive got iracing last week to test it out actually and subscribe for one month is 12$ and you get some basic cars and tracks and those cars are not really amasing, they are well build quality cars ofcourse but that are cars allmost nobody is racing actually, atleast they are not for me in that game and you need to pay each month the basic 12$ to let you play the basic stuff alrleady and each new car or track you purchase is again 12$ that and even if you buy them you cant play them if you dont pay basic monthly fee.
So the basic price we have for 3 cars is like 12$ or 10 euros with support and updates that we will improve the cars all the time to is not really so expensive actually and ive sayed we wont ever go higher with the price. Example our single car cost is 5e, 3 cars will be allways at maximum 10 and we sayed we will even drop the price if that goes well buut first we cant do it right now becase there are people that payed 10 for this mod and wouldnt be fair to them but futuure would bring more cheaper and even better quality as we improve ourself with each car to. There will be bigger car packs, probably with tracks to in future but never we will go and make really high prices.
Maybe we could do subscribe option in future with some amount that would give you ofcourse all the cars and tracks in a period of 1 year you will have even after that period acces to and you will even have chance to be part of beta team.
Its another way that could work and its not directly selling the mod but a way to keep our work flowing and support us on doing mods in normal time.

 

Lol !

 

"They jumped the gun on this one"

Getting T5 at this stage was of course a risk but it will imporve. Even getting rf2 was a risk But everything will be more clear to everyone after things get more finalized. I think people's attitudes will be different when they know exactly how payware mod's quality compares to ISI content or best freeware content thus far. Then we can have this payware vs. free content discussion again.

 

... Because throwing a turbosquid model in the game in 3 hours is going to result in a terrible, terrible mod...

Honestly, I don't understand why people get so butt-hurt over pay mods. If you don't want to pay for it, don't. It's that simple. The mod team is putting a lot of time into these things, and if they want some compensation for it, then that's their decision. Not yours. Simple as. yes, that may mean you get less free stuff. Too bad for you.

Anyone who says it will be the death of rF should go out and buy their own copies of the tools and start modding for free themselves. If you're not willing to do that, then how can you get mad at someone else for not doing that?